re: Official Running Log/Marathon Training Thread

Those seem like good, insightful questions for anyone to ask themselves following a training program and race. I like this type of discussion on here.

Also, just wanted to mention for anyone looking for race shoes - Nike has additional 20% off sale items through the app right now. VF2’s for $140+ tax.

I take no offense in any question.

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You were wanting to set a new PR of 3:45ish and trained in hot humid weather. Why did the race day weather deter you from going for your goal that you trained for in similar or worse conditions?

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This comes down to my confidence and just how my body felt going into race morning. With it being in NYC, we did a lot of walking Thursday-Saturday. I didn't eat as well as I should either while there. With that, I went conservative and kept it safe.

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What training plan did you follow? Do you feel like said plan prepared you to hit that PR if the weather was good?

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Have a coach that I've been using and trust what he has put together. I think there is still an internal fear of going full send and blowing up.

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3:45 is 8:35 pace. I quickly scrolled through the last 2 months of your strava and didn't notice any runs at this pace or faster. long runs up to 18ish miles seem to be 8:45-9:00? I assume pace was based on your plan' but how can it be expected to run 10 secs faster for the full distance when it's not done in training even at shorter distances?

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If you scrolled through everything, I hope you also took note of the time in which all of my long runs begin at. I'm typically running at 5am on Sundays which means I'm waking up at 4-4:30 to start prep. Whether that is an excuse I use, my energy level is just not there. I get maybe 5-6 hours of sleep if I'm lucky and that's probably hurting my performance. If you also look, the long runs have smaller workouts within them. They aren't just 2mi WU, 10mi at pace, 2mi CD. Maybe that's what we should be doing, but I trust my coach's plan. My run 2 weeks prior to the race looked like this:
20 min WU
60 min @ 2 hr pace + 60sec/mile
60 min @ 2 hr pace
Cool Down
The WU averaged ~9:20
First 60 min averaged ~8:35
Second 60 min averaged ~7:55
Our plan for this full was specific to volume and feeling more comfortable in the later stages of the marathon. I only missed one run and it was a 20 miler, but throughout the plan I was able to do 17, 18, 19 without really any problems. Even when I trained for my half PR in 2021, I only hit GHMP in intervals and never for long distances and time. I was able to improve my half from 1:47 to 1:35. I had no issues holding that pace for the entire half after only doing it intermittently.

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Did you incorporate strength and or cross training of any sort?

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Yes, but not to the letter of the plan that was put in front of me. I don't have access to a gym so I use a few free weights at the house and the rest is body weight or resistance bands. We do two days a week of strength training.

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You mentioned in one training post about not being happy with fueling before/ during a run. Did you get that corrected (besides forgetting the bottle at the hotel) and what was your fueling plan?

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Yeah, I tried using Mautren w/Caffeine only and it did not sit well. Plan was to alternate 100 and 100 w/caf every 4-5 miles plus Gatorade endurance 8-10 oz. I actually only ended up using 6 gels total so I could have taken one every 3-4 mi and used more on the back end to help get me past the wall when it came.

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With this race behind you and 2 months to prep for Houston what plan and or changes will you go with to get you across that finish line with a new PR?

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Besides eat and sleep better leading up to race day. I wish I could shift my training runs to later in the day but that just isn't possible with the family life. I think I had the opportunity in my training runs to "empty the tank" but I typically hold back because I still want to be a functioning husband/father for the day. That is probably holding me back and again why I went into with the expectation of enjoying it and not going full send.

There is one south of Houston. Man I miss stopping in to that place

First time I ran I got in through the lottery.

This time I did the Virtual Marathon offered in 2020 with guaranteed entry in 2021, 2022, or 2023. I chose 2022.

No problem at all. It's great opportunity for some self-reflection on this race and training block.

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How did you feel after? 100% spent or could've gone another 5 miles no problem?

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Didn't feel completely spent and it shows this week. Monday and Tuesday I was pretty sore but able to get around without issue. Yesterday and today I almost feel normal. I could have run a few more miles at that 9:00-9:15 pace. It wouldn't have been fun but I would have survived a 50K.

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Does you coach have a personal marathon background and or regularly trains people for this distance? I ask this b/c you mentioned training plan was based on volume so I'm wondering if you feel the approx 40 miles a week was sufficient volume?

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So this I will be completely honest on. He ran his first marathon this year and finished in 2:47. He ran in college at Marquette and was best in the 5K and 10K. He has been coaching for a ~5 years now and all of his athletes are with him for the marathon. Sorry, when I say volume, what I meant was long run volume. I didn't want another training block of only going up to 17-20 once and then tapering. This time we had planned multiple 17, 19, and 20 mi runs. That was intended to make me full more comfortable in the later miles. To accomplish those, we cut back on some of the mid-long runs during the week. I didn't see the benefit leading up to Chicago for the 45-50 mi weeks. I think we will take a combination of the two going forward. I did enjoy the Wed/Thur 8-12 mi runs and they were a good compliment to the Sunday long runs.

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do you incorporate any hill work into training knowing NYC has a couple of bridges to get up and over?

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Yes and no. In Houston, we are limited to essentially overpasses, and I have very few in my area. Again, because of the timing of my runs, I'm not driving 20-30 mins to find a good overpass or parking garage to incorporate hills. That's on me, not the coaching. All that to say, I could have done more. In my defense though, I never walked a bridge during this race. I slowed down sure, but never walked.

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what do you think it will take for you to shake the hesitation off and go full send?

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Honestly, I'm going to plan for a longer training run this block and just go all out. Ask my wife to suck it up and deal with the kids one morning from 7-11 and simulate race day as best I can. I'm not sure of another way.

I think people (myself included at times) are just afraid to go hard, even for a race. It's much easier to say "I'll just use this as a training run" or "I'll just have fun with it". No, you signed up to race, so race. Leave it all out there. And I really don't see why any non professional would need a coach. That's actually comical to me. There are more than enough resources online and gadgets to tell you what you should be doing. If it's a motivation thing, well then that's another story. And not talking about you specifically KB! Don't want to seem like piling on ya. Just speaking in general, as we've all been here a long time.

Wish I could will myself to do that

Might see tomorrow - anyone running the Corporate Classic in New Orleans tomorrow?

I signed up last minute bc some of my run group are doing it. I’ve been training for a half and have not done much speed work, so not really in prime 5k shape…but I’ma give it a good effort. Still want that sub 20 5k. Missed by 30 seconds last year.

Btw KS, I’ve seen your runs on Strava and been meaning to tell you kudos for running in Manayunk. Used to go there often when my ex was in med school in Philly. Love that area but holy shite those hills are no joke. Oh and the stairs too

I’m with you on the coach thing. I’m not swamped with extracurricular outside of work so it’s not really a time thing. I just rather have a full plan and something/someone holding me accountable vs an online plan or researching and making my own plan. Think if I ever decide to tackle the marathon I’d look for a coach or running buddy to hold me to the workouts and push me more. I find it hard to motivate myself to workout as hard as I can when on my own.

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I ran the NYC marathon in 4:44. I was hoping for 4:30 but the warm temps prevented that. 74 degrees at the start of my wave. I looked at my HR after 2 miles and it was as high as I normally get at mile 6. At that point, I made a decision to slow down and just not die. This is my fourth marathon. In two of the three previous marathons I ran, at least one person has died. I’m running for health only. I’m not gonna push it to the point to where my health is at risk. I did see one gentleman being loaded on a stretcher at mile 25 who was pale as a ghost. Hopefully he’s OK. I never saw any stations run out of cups.

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Well that is not exactly what I want to read as I prep for my first marathon. Of course I’m just tryin to complete it not finish for time. What do you use to measure heart rate?