- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Why do old conservatives get mad when you tell them that SSI is welfare
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:02 pm to NC_Tigah
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:02 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
SS is literally a forced savings bond contribution at about 1/3rd the ROI.
That doesn't pay you back what you put in, when two weeks after you start receiving your check, you die. People tend to forget that little caveat.
0
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:02 pm to SlowFlowPro
we paid tens and tens of thousands of $'s into the system and yes, i consider those programs welfare
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:03 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
SS is literally a forced savings bond contribution at about 1/3rd the ROI. Not only is it not welfare, it is in fact the opposite.
It can certainly turn into welfare if you don't earn a ton of income and you stay alive for a while. Yes the ROI is less than traditional investments. However some people are taking out a lot more than they contributed even if you were to adjust for a higher theoretical ROI.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:03 pm to AlxTgr
quote:
You're really not getting this, and it's very surprising.
getting what?
all welfare, by default, "forced you to pay"
it's an illogical argument to make to segregate SS
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:04 pm to winston318
Dumb. Welfare for those who paid tens of thousands to get some back 40-50 years later??
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:05 pm to winston318
If the government would give me my fricking money back right now, no interest, they will never hear a word from me.
As it is, even though it is an inter generational welfare ponzu scheme I will drain every cent they give me.
Of course, I may get penalized for actually taking care of my retirement, so since I won’t need it they may screw me.
I am going to take advantage of any govt stupidity I can
As it is, even though it is an inter generational welfare ponzu scheme I will drain every cent they give me.
Of course, I may get penalized for actually taking care of my retirement, so since I won’t need it they may screw me.
I am going to take advantage of any govt stupidity I can
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:06 pm to winston318
quote:
It's actually the biggest form of welfare. They will argue that the paid into it like they had a choice. Regardless its welfare
Why do the same people get mad when you tell them tanf isn't an entitlement program. It isn't.
Or you can not argue such stupid points.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:08 pm to cahoots
quote:
It can certainly turn into welfare if you don't earn a ton of income and you stay alive for a while.
So what do you call it when the government forces you to contribute to SS? I'm letting the government use my money for 40-50 years to run their business. Why shouldn't I benefit from that?
I sure as hell expect a good return on my money when I invest it in a 401k. I expect the same out of the government. You should too in all honesty.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:11 pm to winston318
Thanks for posting this, I didn't know there was an SS, SSI, and SSD.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:12 pm to TheHarahanian
quote:
The last huge sudden move to the left by the democratic party, prior to what we're seeing in the last few years, was the 1968 DNC.
I would mildly disagree. The last sudden move before the most recent was in 2003 when the Democrats made the move to Nancy Pelosi as minority leader and killed the conservative wing of their party.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:12 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:False.
you can literally make this argument about all government redistribution plans, if you stretch enough
If folks don't understand the origins of SS retirement or what it actually is, there will be no getting rid of it.
In the Depression, FDR needed government funding and had limited means to attain it. So he came up with a mechanism to have his cake and eat it too. Force the public to buy a poor ROI debt vehicle under auspices of a retirement program.
Voila!
Social Security was born.
It was pure political genius.
As someone already posted, give me the money, and let me put it in an IRA myself. Until people understand WTF SS is, many (most) will never go for its faze out. When (if) folks do understand the terrible ROI SS provides and that they'd do far better on their own, acceptance of a faze out might change.
This post was edited on 11/2/17 at 4:14 pm
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:12 pm to Jcorye1
disability is actually truly fricking up SS
when welfare reform in thee 90s came down, it was essentially replaced by SSI as "welfare"
this shift was not anticipated by Social Security and it's draining the coffers at untold rates
when welfare reform in thee 90s came down, it was essentially replaced by SSI as "welfare"
this shift was not anticipated by Social Security and it's draining the coffers at untold rates
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:12 pm to Homesick Tiger
quote:
So what do you call it when the government forces you to contribute to SS? I'm letting the government use my money for 40-50 years to run their business. Why shouldn't I benefit from that?
I never said you shouldn't benefit. I'm saying that some people are collecting more in SS than they would have accumulated by hypothetically investing 6.2% of their income on their own. Some people are taking way more than they ever contributed even if you include 10% interest adjustment.
This post was edited on 11/2/17 at 4:13 pm
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:14 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
As someone already posted, give me the money, and let me put it in an IRA myself.
pretty sure your money has already been spent by people on SS. it's gone
that's what your generation has to realize
i understand that anything i pay into SS will never be recovered. the system will collapse before i get to frick over the generations in elementary school and head start programs, currently
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:16 pm to cahoots
quote:
I'm saying that some people are collecting more in SS than they would have accumulated by hypothetically investing 6.2% of their income on their own.
And like I said, two days after you die nobody gets back what you paid in. They keep it.
It's a crap shoot based on odds.
I see why you feel the way you do, I just happen to disagree with it.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:16 pm to cahoots
quote:
I'm saying that some people are collecting more in SS than they would have accumulated by hypothetically investing 6.2% of their income on their own.
In retirement?
Could you run those numbers?
There are certainly folks who collect far, far less than they contributed.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:22 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:What? Welfare recipients don't pay anything into anything. And,
getting what?
all welfare, by default, "forced you to pay"
quote:
Welfare is financial support given to those in need. Social Security benefits are earned through years of paying taxes into the system. Once you are eligible to receive benefits and you reach full retirement age, there are no requirements of need. Anyone, regardless of income level, is able to receive their full earned benefits. Since everyone receives this earned benefit, it is not welfare.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:24 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
As someone already posted, give me the money, and let me put it in an IRA myself. Until people understand WTF SS is, many (most) will never go for its faze out. When (if) folks do understand the terrible ROI SS provides and that they'd do far better on their own, acceptance of a faze out might change.
If you wanted to fix SS (and, pro tip, no one does), you would start the proposal by making it clear that it doesn't apply to selfish baby boomers. Only then would it be politically palatable. A SS and Medicare plan must exempt the politically selfish to even have a prayer of making it through Congress.
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:25 pm to Homesick Tiger
quote:
And like I said, two days after you die nobody gets back what you paid in. They keep it.
It's a crap shoot based on odds.
I see why you feel the way you do, I just happen to disagree with it.
Yes it is a crap shoot. Some people collect more than they paid in, some less, and some about the same.
For those that collect more, it is welfare. That is what welfare is. Free shite.
This post was edited on 11/2/17 at 4:26 pm
Posted on 11/2/17 at 4:25 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:You may be right.
i understand that anything i pay into SS will never be recovered.
But it's not on point in terms of your SS=welfare argument.
Essentially you are saying we are all being forced to buy Puerto Rican bonds. Those bonds are currently paying on the coupon. Odds are though, current purchase will see little ROI d/t default.
I get that.
But any ROI after purchase of those bonds is not welfare.
This post was edited on 11/2/17 at 4:28 pm
Page 6 of 11
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News