re: Religious Leaders Told to 'Prepare Now' for UFO Disclosure and 'Bible-Changing' Revelation

I kinda lean towards the cattle mutilation thing being a government operation testing for prion disease in cattle populations. But who knows. The Colares incident is crazy talk.

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Somebody burned all those Brazilians

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There were also grotesque and brutal human mutilation cases surrounding all that craziness. Most of those people who got burned ended up getting sick and dying.

Just crazy events. Not saying it isn't worthy of discussion. It certainly is. It's one of the few UFO flaps that are actually concerning.

Switching gears for a second. I just saw a bright fireball in the sky east of my location in NWA about 30 minutes ago. Looked like a meteor breaking up in the atmosphere or something. Typically I wouldn't think to put it online, but with all of the other weird fireballs over recent weeks, including ones that change direction in the air, I thought it might be worth mentioning. Wondering if anyone else saw it.

Also saw some strange lights in the same region of the sky a few minutes after the fireball disappeared.

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If "God" gave them that "Bible", and it contradicted what God gave humanity, then that would be a very different God than what is claimed in the Bible, because it means that He could contradict Himself (He could lie).

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That is the very basis of the potential conflict.

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Not quite. We're talking about hypothetical situations where claims are being made.

In reality, if aliens existed and we knew what they claimed (if they claimed to be given a "Bible" of sorts, had a "savior", and were made in the image of "God"), then that would still only be a claim. It would be no different than the claims of other religions.

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The laws of logic are preconditions for argument. You can’t meaningfully debate anything without already relying on logic.

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Correct, and I'm saying that the existence of God is a precondition for all intelligibility. That's what the transcendental argument for the existence of God states.

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But a religious text is a specific historical claim that could be mistaken, interpreted differently, or challenged by competing revelations.

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Christians don't believe that the Bible is merely a religious text, but is the very speech of God, which reflects not just objective truth, but an authoritative standard that should direct our thoughts about reality. In that sense, it's even superior to the laws of logic

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Using logic to reason about logic is different from saying “this specific book is divinely true because the book says it’s divinely true.”

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Not from my perspective. I believe the word of God is the supreme authority, and nothing higher can be appealed to, just like the laws of logic cannot be appealed (since they originate from the very mind of God).

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It’s a logical fallacy to use a claim as its own evidence.

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Not as I see it. I'm not appealing to them as a text, but I'm appealing to God as the supreme rule and authority, and His word reflects His authority, so I can't appeal to anything greater.

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It also doesn't preclude that possibility. Not that I am aware of, anyway.

Your four points don't convince me otherwise.

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The biggest issues with multiple image-bearers is what it would mean for trinitarian and Christological doctrines.

Jesus is the image of God (2 Cor. 4:4), and as such, is the perfect or express image of God (Heb. 1:3). He is also uncreated but begotten of the Father from eternity, meaning that there is a relationship of bearing the image of God as creatures the corresponds to the perfect image-bearer of God in the Son. There is a direct connection between Christ and those that bear God's image. That relationship is both covenantal and natural (meaning, consisting of the same creaturely nature).

Jesus is the new Adam, where the first Adam was created to image God, related to God by covenant (of works), and fell into sin and needed redemption, and the second Adam is the perfect image of God, also related to the Father by covenant (of grace), and took on a human nature to redeem fallen image-bearers (humans). For us to be in union with Christ is to be connected to Him organically, sharing in a nature (human) as the fullness of Christ (Eph. 1:23). There is no other "body" that images God, connected to the perfect image of God, because the Church is exclusive (the fullness) to humans in union with the head, who is Jesus Christ.

Jesus as our federal head has only two natures--fully divine and fully human; Jesus is ruling in Heaven as the God-man, not the God-man-alien. Therefore, there cannot be another group of image-bearers that are not human, because Christ as the God-man perfectly images God as the archetype, while humans are the ectype that are to be conformed to Christ (Rom. 8:29).

I fear I cannot properly express the weight of the evidence from the Bible as to why humanity is unique as image-bearers, and how it goes beyond merely an argument from silence, but from necessity of relationship, so if you are unconvinced, then so be it, but it goes all the way to the heart of trinitarian and Christological doctrines that are definitional to Christianity.

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But it doesn't. Not necessarily, anyway.

What if these hypothetical image bearers have never sinned?

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I'm still going to push back on calling them "image bearers", since I don't think it's possible for any other creatures to be "image bearers" without being human, but only so-called image bearers.

I believe only humans can be image bearers. To be an image bearer of God is not an arbitrary designation that can be applied to just any creature, but it is designated by God as creating a creature with a special purpose of reflecting God's glory to creation. We see how this played out with humans through the covenants of works and grace, culminating with Jesus taking on a human nature to go along with His divine nature, and redeeming mankind (not any other creatures, even fallen angels). Jesus lived, died, and was resurrected for the sake of humanity, not any other creatures.

But I get your point: if aliens exist and haven't sinned, then what does it matter if Jesus died for sinful humans?

A couple of things: sin exists for those who have a law that they can break. Adam was only able to sin when he was given a command that he either obey or not obey. Animals cannot sin because they have no law that they can understand and break. Only humans and angels can fall into sin, apparently. Therefore, aliens having the ability to sin and not actually sinning would mean they would either live forever as they are (that would have been the reward for Adam had he obeyed), or they would have to be rewarded with glorified bodies in the new heavens and new earth when Jesus returns (to earth) to raise the dead to glory, to judge the living and the dead, and to make all creation new.

This eschatological ending is what seems most troubling for the notion of aliens being image bearers. In Revelation 21, we are told "Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people". The renewal of all the cosmos will be for the purpose of men. If aliens had the same image-quality and prominence as man does, then it seems odd that they would not be included in the ruling and reigning with Christ in the new creation. God's place cannot be with mankind exclusively if it is also with other glorified image bearers, or else God would be showing partiality in exalting redeemed man over sinless alien image bearers.

Not only that, but the destruction of the cosmos for the sake of the new heaven and new earth seems to imply that whatever planets these other alien image bearers would be on would also be wiped out due to sin of image bearers in humanity, and instead of having their own planet(s) renewed, they would be glorified in heaven and on earth, a foreign planet for them. But not, the focus on the covenantal renewal is with man, not aliens, because only man is made in the image of God.

And, because God has only one people--who Jesus is tied to through His human nature--that precludes other peoples that Jesus is head of and over.

I haven't kept up with this much. Has the government rolled out any little green men yet?

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Yes, if they were truly made in the image of God

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That's how you should frame this discussion moving forward so you conceptualize the discussion and respond better.

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You aren't saying they would be "claiming" to be made in the image of God

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No. I'm saying they would be made in the image of God

Nothing in the Bible precludes that. The Bible only says that humans were made in the image of God. It's silent as to what else is made in the image of God.

And the point of this exercise is to show how leaving out such important parts, only to have those left out things revealed in time, can create issues.

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and while that would be problematic to Christianity, so would the reality of Islam being the true religion, or Mormonism, or something else.

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Yes, exactly.

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. However, since we aren't talking about what is true but what is claimed to be true

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No this isn't what we're talking about. This is you trying to re-frame the discussion to continue to avoid the discussion

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You continue to conflate the claim of something with the objective reality of that thing.

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No. This is a strawman you created.

I didn't say they claimed to be in the image of God. I said they WERE. You're conflating what I said. Here is the specific wording

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What if these aliens are made in the image of God?

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Notice, I said ARE not "claim to be".