- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Heard an interesting take about "segregation" from someone who lived through it
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:15 pm to burger bearcat
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:15 pm to burger bearcat
This is true.
But not because segregation was good for any race.
All races were better off because of married women raising families.
But not because segregation was good for any race.
All races were better off because of married women raising families.
0
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:15 pm to burger bearcat
It’s no secret Lyndon B Johnson is a huge piece of black America’s current problems.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:17 pm to jp4lsu
quote:
You certainly saw a major decline in the black community after CRA but i wouldn't say it is the CRA and the desegregation that was the cause.
It was the welfare that followed.
So was CRA the proximate cause then? Sounds like welfare was a part of the next steps that needed the CRA in place to cause the negative effect.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:20 pm to jp4lsu
quote:
You certainly saw a major decline in the black community after CRA but i wouldn't say it is the CRA and the desegregation that was the cause.
It was the welfare that followed.
I think it was a bit of both.
Because of segregation, black communities were forced to create their own economies (to a large extent). The lack of welfare meant the poor had to work if they wanted to eat (which covered most black families). Having to work meant less idle time, which meant fewer opportunities to get in trouble.
Had the CRA not happened but welfare did, I think the destruction of black economies slows to a crawl.
Had welfare not happened but the CRA did, I think black economies ebb but then bounce back once the "new" of being able to go into whites-only establishments wore off.
Out of the two, I think welfare has been the more destructive and by a wide margin.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:23 pm to burger bearcat
There are several factors. The introduction of welfare being a big one, as pointed out by others here. Segregation did probably hurt black ability to accumulate wealth because suddenly their stores and restaurants were competing with wealthy white owned corporations, and the same thing happened to them that happened (and is happening) to a lot of small towns all over America. Add to that the influx of guns into black communities via the black separatist movements and then the explosion of drugs during the crack epidemic and the mass incarcerations that rightfully followed and you have a series of cascading actions that destroyed the American downtown. You can also add to that the fact that segregation policies forced wealthy black people to live side by side with poor black people, which couldn’t have been great for them, but which did provide a presence of respectability and a positive example within the community. When they could leave, they did and the people left behind are on a sinking ship.
The death of both religion and sort of quasi-religious American standards impacted the entire country at the same time, with people turning against marriage and family, and productive employment, and prayer and belief in something beyond you. It hit the poor the hardest, while mostly white upper middle class kids are fine because they can believe in nothing and still go to school and work because they have to maintain their current lifestyle. If you are too rich or too poor and you believe in nothing, why not abuse drugs? Why not be a monster? The one can’t fail, and the chances of the other one succeeding can seem extremely thin.
The death of both religion and sort of quasi-religious American standards impacted the entire country at the same time, with people turning against marriage and family, and productive employment, and prayer and belief in something beyond you. It hit the poor the hardest, while mostly white upper middle class kids are fine because they can believe in nothing and still go to school and work because they have to maintain their current lifestyle. If you are too rich or too poor and you believe in nothing, why not abuse drugs? Why not be a monster? The one can’t fail, and the chances of the other one succeeding can seem extremely thin.
This post was edited on 7/18/23 at 10:02 am
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:23 pm to burger bearcat
I grew up in that era and got caught up in that mandatory desegregation of schools where they made us switch over Christmas. I lived outside the area that the school I attended. Stupid!
I grew up in rural Mississippi and I guess there were some but I can't think of a single black owned business in the 60s. I know Jackson had some but not where I grew up.
As to the CRA, you can look at the number of 2 parent POCs as a percentage has dropped drastically since 1964 and I believe that to be the nidus of the destruction of black communities and large cities.
I grew up in rural Mississippi and I guess there were some but I can't think of a single black owned business in the 60s. I know Jackson had some but not where I grew up.
As to the CRA, you can look at the number of 2 parent POCs as a percentage has dropped drastically since 1964 and I believe that to be the nidus of the destruction of black communities and large cities.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:27 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
Sowell has written on this point.
I read his stuff on this. He said that many boys in his HS senior class (all black public school) became white collar professionals. Today, that same school mostly produces boys who end up in prison.
This post was edited on 7/18/23 at 9:52 am
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:50 pm to burger bearcat
quote:
...despite what the history books and media will tell you, black people actually had prospered more pre-CRA act era under segregation than after the fact.
This is factually inaccurate.
Black people did not prosper more pre-Civil Rights Act, and the attempt to rewrite history on this is pitiful. Sure, there were more businesses owned by black people at this time, due to necessity and legal segregation, but the businesses that were in operation were not largely industrial. Many of them were mom and pop service businesses that provided basic goods and services (small neighborhood grocery stores, small motels, small auto service shops, lounges/night clubs, salons and barber shops, etc.), but they were often not (to scale) as large as businesses owned by the American majority.
Ask any black traveler that traveled across the country about sun down towns and the Green Book and how difficult travel was across the United States pre-CRA.
Ask any black veteran that returned from World War II (even if they were employed) and was denied a VA loan to purchase a home. 96% of the VA and FHA loans that were doled out after World War II went to white families. This is a statistical fact. Note: If you couldn't purchase a home, you couldn't access equity in your home to potentially start a business.
Ask many black Americans that could not access Social Security benefits because they were initially intended not to benefit them.
History doesn't bear this out. I'd like to see evidence of this vast prosperity that you speak about that existed prior to the Civil Rights Act.
This post was edited on 7/17/23 at 2:00 pm
Posted on 7/17/23 at 1:59 pm to burger bearcat
I’ve often wondered where the root of segregation lies. The best I can guess is that it sprang up out of the post civil war reconstruction era. You obviously had a lot of animosity from the former soldiers but I think a good deal of it probably came from the kids who were left fatherless. Those fatherless kids, the majority of them dirt poor grew up competing with former slaves for the same economic scraps. Blacks became the easy scapegoats. Segregation was born out of it not only to keep the two hostile groups from one another but also as a means to hoard resources
Posted on 7/17/23 at 2:06 pm to burger bearcat
Show me a History book that tells the truth about slavery.
Two of the largest slave owners were Black.
" free blacks owned more than 10,000 slaves, according to the federal census of 1830."
Antoine Dubuclet was born a free man to free parents and inherited a large sugar plantation called Cedar Grove from his father. Under his father, the plantation was small and contained only a few slaves. Under Antoine’s leadership, it grew, and by 1860, he owned over 100 slaves and had one of the largest sugar plantations in Louisiana. He was extremely wealthy, even more so than any of his white neighbors. His plantation was worth $264,000, while the average income of his neighbors in the South was only around $3,978.
After marrying a wealthy black woman, his lands expanded, and after her death, Dubuclet was considered the wealthiest black slave owner in Louisiana.[8] He was elected and served as state treasurer during the Reconstruction Era, one of the only black men to hold the office for more than one term.
Two of the largest slave owners were Black.
" free blacks owned more than 10,000 slaves, according to the federal census of 1830."
Antoine Dubuclet was born a free man to free parents and inherited a large sugar plantation called Cedar Grove from his father. Under his father, the plantation was small and contained only a few slaves. Under Antoine’s leadership, it grew, and by 1860, he owned over 100 slaves and had one of the largest sugar plantations in Louisiana. He was extremely wealthy, even more so than any of his white neighbors. His plantation was worth $264,000, while the average income of his neighbors in the South was only around $3,978.
After marrying a wealthy black woman, his lands expanded, and after her death, Dubuclet was considered the wealthiest black slave owner in Louisiana.[8] He was elected and served as state treasurer during the Reconstruction Era, one of the only black men to hold the office for more than one term.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 2:07 pm to burger bearcat
quote:
o what I had heard from someone who lived in segregated Alabama, was that despite what the history books and media will tell you, black people actually had prospered more pre-CRA act era under segregation than after the fact. They owned businesses, had families that were together, and were busy. And post CRA, many of the black small businesses had shut down, and of course tied in with LBJ, Great Society policies that destroyed their families, it has been downhill from there.
They say this explicitly at the Civil Rights museum in Birmingham. Segregated blacks had to start businesses of their own since they couldn’t go to white businesses. It’s why first black millionaire businessman was from Birmingham.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 2:07 pm to Blizzard of Chizz
You could drink the water in 60's Jackson..............
Posted on 7/17/23 at 2:07 pm to burger bearcat
quote:
black people actually had prospered more pre-CRA act era under segregation than after the fact. They owned businesses, had families that were together, and were busy.
And post CRA, many of the black small businesses had shut down, and of course tied in with LBJ, Great Society policies that destroyed their families, it has been downhill from there.
This is true.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 2:08 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
Sowell has written on this point.
No question that the old regime was "better" for Black business owners.
It is certainly also reasonable to ask whether it is "better" for Black customers (a) to have the right to enter any establishment you want to enter or (b) to have MORE, similar establishments owned by people who share your skintones, while being denied access to many, many similar establishments.
Well done, sire.
One of the reasons I keep reading your posts.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 2:13 pm to Robin Masters
LINK
quote:
According to an analysis of Federal Reserve data, Black families are far less likely to be millionaires than White families.
1quote:
Moreover, the racial wealth gap has persisted since the Civil Rights era and the passage of the Civil Rights Act.
2
With these modern-day facts in mind, early Black millionaires have drawn attention as entrepreneurs who overcame significant structural barriers to achieve stunning success and wealth across a variety of areas. They have also won attention as underappreciated contributors to the formation of American capitalism, with Black contributions to developments such as industrialization also gaining recognition in recent decades.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 2:15 pm to The Maj
quote:
quote:
had families that were together
=====
This was the key... dads were in the homes...
Absolutely - that is the answer. But now, I don't know if "fatherhood" is a concept that is well known in that community. I feel that any family with a real father has long ago physically moved away from that 'community'
today, Putting some dope-headed "baby daddy" in charge of a 'family' may not have any hope of being any better - hell, he might even sell off his baby daughter/son.
The benefits of 'family' only accrue thru centuries, if not eons, of experience - just the act of 'making some people start living together' doesn't automatically endow "family outcomes" - not in the way that we who know what families really mean anyway.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 2:16 pm to burger bearcat
quote:
And post CRA, many of the black small businesses had shut down, and of course tied in with LBJ, Great Society policies that destroyed their families, it has been downhill from there.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 3:06 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
It is certainly also reasonable to ask whether it is "better" for Black customers (a) to have the right to enter any establishment you want to enter or (b) to have MORE, similar establishments owned by people who share your skintones, while being denied access to many, many similar establishments.
It should be the right of anybody to associate with or deny association to whomever they want without any pressure from a servant, a/k/a gooooooooooooooooooooberment official.
What is wrong with being able to associate freely with whom you want? If we were all meant to be as one, how come we are all so different?
Oh, that's right. We are part of the experiment called the Melting Pot. How's that working out for us?
Frig that!!
Posted on 7/17/23 at 3:12 pm to LSUAlum2001
I had a conversation with a black preacher in my community one day.He blamed the Democratic welfare programs for destroying black families which in turn is causing the degradation of the black race.That, in turn ,has hurt race relations.
We didn’t specifically discuss integration but I’m sure he was for it as am I.Blacks should have equal rights.The way they were treated in the military and as veterans,for example ,was shameful.
BTW,he loved Trump.
We didn’t specifically discuss integration but I’m sure he was for it as am I.Blacks should have equal rights.The way they were treated in the military and as veterans,for example ,was shameful.
BTW,he loved Trump.
Posted on 7/17/23 at 3:25 pm to AggieHank86
You’d be surprised the views around here by some older black men. Many believe segregation was better.
Hell I know one who was commenting once on the crime rates in the area. He flat out told me white men need to go back to publicly hanging the ones who do that shite and it would stop. That comment caught me way off guard
Hell I know one who was commenting once on the crime rates in the area. He flat out told me white men need to go back to publicly hanging the ones who do that shite and it would stop. That comment caught me way off guard
Page 2 of 4
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News