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Message
re: Govt Assistance and Minimum Wage
Posted on 2/12/18 at 5:52 pm to Ebbandflow
Posted on 2/12/18 at 5:52 pm to Ebbandflow
Fresh out the Navy I got a job making minimum wage at a plastic plant. Within a year I moved up to assistant operator making about $2 an hour more. Within 3 years I was the lead shipping clerk making twice minimum wage. Within 4 years I was promoted to shipping supervisor making almost 2x the minimum wage.
The lesson, if you're an asset to a company you won't be stuck at minimum wage for long.
The lesson, if you're an asset to a company you won't be stuck at minimum wage for long.
0
Posted on 2/12/18 at 5:54 pm to Ebbandflow
First, as minimum wage is increased labor force participation rate is decreased. People often argue that unemployment rate will increase, but that is only in the short run, because the rate at which people become unemployed due to the minimum wage increase is also roughly equal to the increased rate in which people leave the work force entirely.
Second, as unemployment rates go up and labor force participation rates go down, disability filings go up. As people do not have a job, they will start getting money from somewhere, our disability programs are being absolutely crushed by false claims.
Third, our "livable wage" keeps going up and up year over year. In fact, livable wage has increased dramatically faster than inflation over the same period. Why? There are a few reasons, but our main areas are:
A. Life Necessities continue to grow. In the 50s it was necessary to have a home, running water, and an oven. In the 70s it was necessary to have all that plus a refrigerator and HVAC. Now it is necessary to have all those plus a microwave, landline, mobile phone, and soon internet.
B. The general trend to people moving from in expensive rural areas, to costly urban areas. This does not play part in inflation at all, but has dramatically increase the average cost of livable wage nationally.
Second, as unemployment rates go up and labor force participation rates go down, disability filings go up. As people do not have a job, they will start getting money from somewhere, our disability programs are being absolutely crushed by false claims.
Third, our "livable wage" keeps going up and up year over year. In fact, livable wage has increased dramatically faster than inflation over the same period. Why? There are a few reasons, but our main areas are:
A. Life Necessities continue to grow. In the 50s it was necessary to have a home, running water, and an oven. In the 70s it was necessary to have all that plus a refrigerator and HVAC. Now it is necessary to have all those plus a microwave, landline, mobile phone, and soon internet.
B. The general trend to people moving from in expensive rural areas, to costly urban areas. This does not play part in inflation at all, but has dramatically increase the average cost of livable wage nationally.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 5:55 pm to Stuckinthe90s
If we really want to solve these issues of poverty, we should.
1. Realize that Minimum Wage increases will not have the intended effect and can be detrimental by kicking people out of the work force.
2. We must reform government assistance programs so that they cannot be taken advantage by people who do not need them. I reference disability, but there are similarly people who take advantage of all sorts of government programs, specifically SNAP.
3a. We must define, not only what is a livable wage, but we must itemize it so that 'wants' are not making it to the 'needs' column.
3b. We devise a way to help shift some of the population back out to the rural towns (obviously in a thoughtful manner, this can't be kicking out poor people because the cities don't want them). This will allow the tax payers dollars to go much further.
These are just some of my thoughts, obviously these are not the conservative talking points and will probably get a lot of downvotes oh well.
tl;dr - picking political sides will not help lower govt assistance or increase wages, only a pragmatic approach that addresses the root cause of the problem will.
1. Realize that Minimum Wage increases will not have the intended effect and can be detrimental by kicking people out of the work force.
2. We must reform government assistance programs so that they cannot be taken advantage by people who do not need them. I reference disability, but there are similarly people who take advantage of all sorts of government programs, specifically SNAP.
3a. We must define, not only what is a livable wage, but we must itemize it so that 'wants' are not making it to the 'needs' column.
3b. We devise a way to help shift some of the population back out to the rural towns (obviously in a thoughtful manner, this can't be kicking out poor people because the cities don't want them). This will allow the tax payers dollars to go much further.
These are just some of my thoughts, obviously these are not the conservative talking points and will probably get a lot of downvotes oh well.
tl;dr - picking political sides will not help lower govt assistance or increase wages, only a pragmatic approach that addresses the root cause of the problem will.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 5:55 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:we already understood how the mind of the insanely stupid operates. affirmation that we aren't in that category never hurts tho.
Just going in-depth for some of you so that you finally understand how this all works
thanks,
Posted on 2/12/18 at 6:01 pm to Ebbandflow
There is an entire culture of people who have no desire to have a regular family life. They sleep around with multiple people, and have children with multiple men. Then they don't give a darn about education or getting any type of job skills preparing themselves for life, but, this is now societies fault that they can't get anything but minimum wage jobs?
Posted on 2/12/18 at 6:05 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
you were just talking out of your arse.
So just like your first sentence in the op?
Posted on 2/12/18 at 6:41 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
If someone is being paid a wage that is not liveable, they will require assistance.
The left in a nutshell
Low pay should be incentive to better yourself, not live on the taxpayer
Posted on 2/12/18 at 6:44 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
Well basic human decency may not be your reality but it is certainly mine
It's not, because you think low paid workers are incapable of improving themselves
Posted on 2/12/18 at 7:16 pm to Ebbandflow
Companies are not going to pay higher minimum wage . That’s why they are already replacing them with computers.
If democrats feel so strongly about helping the poor why not do it with your money ? Because democrats only care to giving away our money.
People working for minimum wage should go to a trade school . It’s cheap if they actually had to pay for it . They could learn a trade 1-2 years and increase their pay .
If democrats feel so strongly about helping the poor why not do it with your money ? Because democrats only care to giving away our money.
People working for minimum wage should go to a trade school . It’s cheap if they actually had to pay for it . They could learn a trade 1-2 years and increase their pay .
Posted on 2/12/18 at 7:17 pm to Ebbandflow
I worked one minimum wage job in my life. I was 15. Minimum wage was a little over $5. Worked it one summer. Every summer after that I never worked for less than $10/hr. Because? I figured out even entry level skilled work like plumbing paid better. Worked through my first stint of college, dropped out and travelled working pipeline and other oil/gas jobs. Decided to go back to school, worked through school with a wife who didn’t work and a kid.
My mom has a staffing company. She pays over minimum wage for even the lowliest position she offers. All you have to do is pass a drug screen. A lot of times she can’t find people to work. They won’t do it because the work is too hard. They’d rather flip burgers for less money than work at the Nissan plant, or at some distribution facility, get this, DRIVING A FORKLIFT.
Tell me again how they all want to do better, but can’t. Cause I’ve seen thousands go through her office and choose to go back to minimum wage and get a govt check.
My mom has a staffing company. She pays over minimum wage for even the lowliest position she offers. All you have to do is pass a drug screen. A lot of times she can’t find people to work. They won’t do it because the work is too hard. They’d rather flip burgers for less money than work at the Nissan plant, or at some distribution facility, get this, DRIVING A FORKLIFT.
Tell me again how they all want to do better, but can’t. Cause I’ve seen thousands go through her office and choose to go back to minimum wage and get a govt check.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 7:23 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
quote:
Well basic human decency may not be your reality but it is certainly mine
It's not, because you think low paid workers are incapable of improving themselves
Or, more importantly, that there aren't side effects that usually wipe out any benefits and sometimes have significant deleterious effects on the very people whom a mandated minimum wage is trying to help.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 7:54 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
So posters of this board are against govt assistance. The same people have shown to be against minimum wage increase.
Question: How can you have it both ways?
Some of us believe in laissez faire, which would cover both.
You make a mistake by believing that your two things are opposite sides of a coin. They are not. They are both instances of the government interference.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 7:57 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
Well basic human decency may not be your reality but it is certainly mine
Typical liberal - your brain is so polluted with lies you're lost to what normal people do in their everyday lives.
My wife and give far more to our community than could be measured by some anonymous post on a message board. We contribute not just in monetary means but time as well; ensuring kids in our area that are part of the foster program receive birthday and Christmas gifts. My wife even goes further and is a big sister sponsor for NE Alabama Big Brother/ Big Sister program.
We volunteer our time to help these kids build basic things, like self respect, self esteem - not entitled handouts.
Don't lecture me about your lies and delusion or your corrupt politics. I loathe people like you and your lies.
frick off filth. As far as I'm concerned, y are a cancer to mankind.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 8:02 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
First the sponsors of a right-wing radio show or news will lead you to believe that if anyone gets any raises that the company is going to go bankrupt and no one will have any jobs and that trickle down economics will help everyone. Everyone that is including the guy who makes less than a livable wage.
Not always.
Sometimes it translates to increasing the price of goods, which often leads to lower sales. In this case, the company survives alright, but this increases inflation and may cause some people (poor people on minimum wage) to be unable to purchase said good.
We’re also talking jobs that can be done by anyone with two brain cells and a heart beat. Jobs that should be done by minimum wage. In this instance, you want to give raises to people you want to keep because they are good at the job. When you raise the minimum wage though, you decrease how much you can give to people you want to give to, because you’re paying for other people.
The result of this is that employers hire illegals who take half the pay.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 8:03 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
This is perfect insight into the mind of the left
I had the exact same reaction. The left is functionally retarded with respect to economics.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 8:09 pm to stat19
quote:
Well basic human decency may not be your reality but it is certainly mine
quote:
Typical liberal - your brain is so polluted with lies you're lost to what normal people do in their everyday lives.
My wife and give far more to our community than could be measured by some anonymous post on a message board. We contribute not just in monetary means but time as well; ensuring kids in our area that are part of the foster program receive birthday and Christmas gifts. My wife even goes further and is a big sister sponsor for NE Alabama Big Brother/ Big Sister program.
We volunteer our time to help these kids build basic things, like self respect, self esteem - not entitled handouts.
Don't lecture me about your lies and delusion or your corrupt politics. I loathe people like you and your lies.
Preach on!
I feel the same as you on many levels. These liberals claim they "believe inn human decency" but use the government to hold a gun to other peoples heads using other peoples money to. fulfill their ideas.
They typically don't ever put their money or time in, unless it as for show amongst their friends. Of course they will all where stupid awareness ribbons to show how much they care, since that has never actually helped anyone.
My wife and I took in my niece and nephew because their parents are/were drug addled ne'er do wells.
We put our money where our mouth is.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 8:46 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
This is perfect insight into the mind of the left
Perhaps.
You didn't answer his question though. Are you incapable of articulating your point, or just unable to defend it?
Posted on 2/12/18 at 8:53 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
If someone is being paid a wage that is not liveable, they will require assistance. If they make enough to live, they will not be eligible.
Minimum wage jobs aren't meant to sustain a family. If you're working a minimum wage job, it's highly irresponsible for you to procreate and rely on those who had no choice in your poor decisions. Having taxpayers foot the bill for your lack of responsibility... minimum wage workers don't pay any taxes in the end... is fricked up.
This post was edited on 2/12/18 at 8:55 pm
Posted on 2/12/18 at 10:17 pm to Wildcat In Germany
Shouldn't that minimum wage then increase with the inflation of shelter, food, and utilities?
30 years ago, a gas station attendant could buy a house with cash, only working one job.
The "job for teenagers" and "not meant to be a liveable wage" arguments are not only outdated, but incredibly ignorant.
30 years ago, a gas station attendant could buy a house with cash, only working one job.
The "job for teenagers" and "not meant to be a liveable wage" arguments are not only outdated, but incredibly ignorant.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 10:21 pm to GeauxOCDP
quote:
The "job for teenagers" and "not meant to be a liveable wage" arguments are not only outdated, but incredibly ignorant.
If you make minimum wage and are above the age of 18, you are a failure. End of story.
And if you work minimum wage and have kids? Your kids should be taken and you should be sterilized since you obviously can't make good decisions.
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