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Started By
Message
re: Afghan pilots assassinated by Taliban as U.S. withdraws
Posted on 7/9/21 at 10:35 am to fatboydave
Posted on 7/9/21 at 10:35 am to fatboydave
It's a decade past time we allowed them to self-determine. If this is the direction they choose to go, so be it.
0
Posted on 7/9/21 at 10:44 am to sumtimeitbeslikedat
quote:
we should have taken them completely over, installed Americans as rulers, governors, mayors, police, etc….
That would have caused more American bloodshed and issues than we can easily calculate. You cannot force your ideology on people who do not want it at a subconscious level, and there is no level of those people who want western democracy and ideals.
I don't know what the right answer should have been, but it isn't that. My proposal was:
1.) an overwhelming and lightning fast targeted military operation to destroy terrorist elements of the Taliban
2.) A narrowly defined but heavily supplied short term aid program consisting of targeted air drops of food and water but no cash of financial aid
3.) A overwhelming leaflet and media campaign making it extremely clear what we targeted, why we targeted it, and a promise to target things again if necessary.
4.) Zero occupation.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 10:46 am to loogaroo
quote:
Although, it’s going to take them a while to use up all of Africa’s minerals.
Africa is a much easier target. The warlords are easily bought off.
Different story in Afghanistan. Serving Allah is more important than money.
Their religion/ideology is strong shield for preserving their culture (even if it is backwards)
Posted on 7/9/21 at 10:56 am to CU_Tigers4life
quote:
frick Afghanistan. This has been a disaster for just about every nation that's occupied it.
This is the most realistic and rational thread on the Poli Board in a long while.
We all knew that whenever the U.S. withdrew, Afghanistan would revert to a Taliban shithole. Right wingers have called for withdrawal for years because this kind of foreign occupation no longer has a sufficient direct link to local US security. Trump announced withdrawal but apparently changed his mind (or was pressured to change his mind) because the experts knew this would happen.
But however you look at it, whatever your political persuasion, withdrawal had to happen sometime, and the experts were always right about what would happen.
If China wants to go into Afghanistan, good luck to them. The exact same cycle happened when the Russians were there as when the US was there. If China goes there it will happen again.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 10:59 am to TBoy
China isn’t opposed to genocide. Will be interesting to see how the yellow man does out there.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 11:07 am to SantaFe
They have an estimated 3 trillion in rare earth minerals.
China will get their hands on them when we are fully out of the way.
China will get their hands on them when we are fully out of the way.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 11:11 am to fatboydave
The Taliban fears helicopter gunships, and the AAF has a bunch of good Russian made Mi-24’s. Hate to say it, but killing the pilots is smart.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 11:28 am to fatboydave
Not to worry. Biden said yesterday that the Afghans have 'the best equipped military in the world.'
I'm sure Jen Psaki will have an explanation for that quote at the next press conference.
I'm sure Jen Psaki will have an explanation for that quote at the next press conference.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 11:43 am to mmcgrath
If 10% of this country decided to use these tactics, you would be hiding in a bunker shitting yourself or a casualty.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:02 pm to mmcgrath
quote:
ou would lose 90% of your support, unless you think your side has the mentality of the Taliban. Citizens on both sides would turn in the assassin in the US unless you retreated into the woods / mountains.
I assure you any pilot that would agree to bomb or strafe a civilian population in the U.S. would have little public support.,
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:11 pm to hubertcumberdale
quote:
You are suggesting the US colonize the Middle East?
I’m saying when it comes to war, you don’t use half-measures. You beat down and make your enemy fully submit to your will. Don’t get me wrong, I’m NOT saying that there is no compassion for the innocent. War is horrible, and all innocents are precious and indiscriminate killing should not be done… but YOU HAVE TO WIN DECISIVELY. You have to break their will to fight completely. That’s where we went wrong in Vietnam and Afghanistan. And where we went right in WWII and Iraq (at the beginning).
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:14 pm to mmcgrath
quote:Conservatives proudly fantasize about killing American soldiers. I guess its in the Blood of Southerners.
You would lose 90% of your support, unless you think your side has the mentality of the Taliban. Citizens on both sides would turn in the assassin in the US unless you retreated into the woods / mountains.
Taliban hasn't had to kill to seize control of much of their territory as most Afghan forces ( outside large towns/ cities) have simply surrendered or fled.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:21 pm to hubertcumberdale
quote:
They carpet bombed Afghanistan for 20 years and killed roughly 70,000 civilians in the process
So we missed a few
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:23 pm to fatboydave
NO reason for US to be there 20 years. Learned nothing from Russia being there 20 years. Stupid. 2,500 US soldiers killed and I think 20k injured. Rules of Engagement are a joke. Either fight or don't.
The Afghans have had 20 years to learn to win. Some give up and don't fight.
If the Taliban and other bad actors take over the country, the US just needs a base to be able to fly planes and bomb them til there is nobody left to bomb and no Poppy fields left to harvest heroin that kills - IF they attack us.
You hear the establishment say we stayed on Germany, Japan etc. Well, get out of there too unless they pay the US to be there.
The Afghans have had 20 years to learn to win. Some give up and don't fight.
If the Taliban and other bad actors take over the country, the US just needs a base to be able to fly planes and bomb them til there is nobody left to bomb and no Poppy fields left to harvest heroin that kills - IF they attack us.
You hear the establishment say we stayed on Germany, Japan etc. Well, get out of there too unless they pay the US to be there.
This post was edited on 7/9/21 at 12:26 pm
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:23 pm to fatboydave
These people had 20 years to get their shite together, so they didn't have to live under the thumb of the Taliban. Instead of using that time to develop and make that place a little less of a shithole, they constantly bitched about the US occupation, and how they handled shite. and I have no doubt that there is plenty to be critical of, but still they had 20 fricking years to get it together. I feel bad for their people, but we can't and shouldn't be spending blood and treasure over there defending them, if they have no intention of ever taking responsibility for themselves.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:26 pm to Northwestern tiger
Frick Bush for getting US into these crazy unwinnable wars. The Taliban is evil, but this is the Afghan people's country...we had no business being there or in Iraq, from the getgo.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:36 pm to tarzana
quote:
Frick Bush for getting US into these crazy unwinnable wars.
Yeah, it was Bush and Bush only that wanted us involved in Afghanistan and Iraq, right. Might want to check the position at the time of all of your marxist democrat heroes there, Scooter.
What Bush is responsible for is not just allowing our military to bomb the ever-loving dogshit out of them, and daring them to respond. It's not like either place isn't a 4th world hellhole to begin with.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:40 pm to sumtimeitbeslikedat
quote:
Our problem is exactly the same thing we did in Iraq. We shouldn’t have just “conquered” the countries… we should have taken them completely over, installed Americans as rulers, governors, mayors, police, etc…. Instead, we conquered the corrupt and then gave it back to the corrupt. All we did was “monitor”, “advise”, and “provide security” for the corrupt.
No we should have killed every man, woman, child, goat, camel, and scorpion. Destroyed every building and burned every tent.
We should have chemically sterilized the soil in every location where crops (especially opium) could grow. We should have poisoned every well and water source.
And then packed up our shite and left.
The only way to win in Afghanistan is to make it unlivable.
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:42 pm to fatboydave
Posted on 7/9/21 at 12:44 pm to CU_Tigers4life
quote:
This has been a disaster for just about every nation that's occupied it.
The United States easily conquered Afghanistan, which no other nation had been able to do. Russian military commanders were surprised by the speed in which we moved through the country when we first invaded the country in 2001. They predicted a stalemate and bloodbath in the mountains.
Where we messed up was not declaring victory and leaving the country after the death of Bin Laden in 2011. The whole reason for the invasion is because the Taliban refused to hand him over and shut down the terror camps.
Nation building shouldn’t have been an objective.
This post was edited on 7/9/21 at 12:47 pm
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