re: 12th Grade Girls Are Far Less Likely Than Boys To Say They Want To Get Married Someday

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Because modern feminism told women that the only value was outside of the home to chase a career and that family, being a mom, was not worth it.

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100%. I have worked full time, part time, and not at all since having children. When I was just staying home with babies, some women were actually mean about it. Like somehow I was throwing away my education to be a "housewife" and completely ignoring the fact that I was just choosing motherhood for a while.

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Because modern feminism told women

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What does this mean? Was there an email? Newsletter? Some conference that feminism hosted that women all attended at some point? I’m serious.

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You've kind of said marriage isn't worth it for women at large and men get more value out of it than women. And that's why women are opting out.

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Idk. I have a good husband (not a perfect one). He’s a great dad. If he dropped dead today, I would never consider dating again. Heterosexual marriage is way too much work for women, imo. I call my best friend my future wife. I think a woman wanting to remarry is a huge red flag. Pretty much every woman married to a man that I know agrees with me. But I’m sure we’re all anomalies.

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You reacting generally to jokes on a male dominated message board.

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jokes? I don’t know about that.

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Philosophically speaking it's much easier, feminism seeks to turn women into something other than mothers. That traditional family, and traditional "motherhood," is somehow repressive and that freedom exists in everything BUT motherhood.

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Not really. Or at least this isn’t the brand of feminism discussed in modern academia. I’m the board’s liberal social justice warrior mascot (or villain?) and I’m a church-going married mother of three.

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Well ... maybe not 40million men ... but ... your point (dating back centuries) is an excellent one, nonetheless.

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Men start wars that millions of men die in. And men continue to start wars.


Poor men. Maybe someone should help them connect the dots.

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And men continue to start wars.

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During the period in the British Empire when queens ruled the throne, they started more wars than men.

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And men continue to start wars.

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Yeah, and teachers sexually abuse children. Didn't you say that you were a teacher above?

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Poor men.

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Poor men? Naw, poor women. Out of the 168 hours in the week, men have 3.5 hours more leisure time. That's right! A whole 2%. I don't know how women are going to make it in the face of that kind of oppression.

All men do is die.

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I didn't say most or all husbands routinely opt out of anything (except for housework I guess). this is stupid.

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We can only respond to the words you post. We were responding to the following -

“There were some significant moments in my life that my husband opted out of“


That doesn’t sound like housework.

It’s stupid because you don’t know what the frick you’re saying half the time.

Men have done such a good job of civilizing the world that women think they don’t need men anymore. It’s a thin line between the good men who protect them and those who want to hurt them.

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Men start wars that millions of men die in. And men continue to start wars.

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The majority of men are not powerful. It’s a small percentage of the population that’s not even 1%. The least valuable human in history is a young man that has no value to society. They are routinely sacrificed for basically nothing. Young men like my father in law who went to fight in Vietnam at age 18 right out of high school. I told you before I pray you don’t have any sons. The BS and contempt you have for men is palpable. Evil does exist and good men are what stands between evil and your nice cushy life men have made for you.

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You aren't serious. And if you are, then yeah this is a hard conversation. If you can't wrap your head around how certain kinds of ideas are intentionally codified into cultural and pushed through art, news, media, education etc., I can't help you.

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Could have sworn you or someone else recently explained this, and she didn’t respond to it. Purposely playing dumb is a liberal virtue

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If you can't wrap your head around how certain kinds of ideas are intentionally codified into cultural and pushed through art, news, media, education etc., I can't help you.

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Fair. It seems that the media the average PT poster consumes is far more pro-feminist than what I have been exposed to, perhaps.

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I'd also ask, if feminism doesn't exist,

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It can exist. At this point, “feminism” feels more like a rhetorical weapon than a clearly defined framework. It gets blamed for things people dislike and credited for things people support. The phrase has been weaponized, imo, and has lost its teeth.. to the point that I don't know what people mean when they blame or credit "feminism" with anything.

A lot of what people reflexively label “feminism” looks to me more like downstream effects of broader cultural and economic shifts: dual-income households becoming a necessity, credential inflation, rising costs of living, delayed adulthood, a labor market that reshapes family life whether people want it to or not, etc. Those forces would have changed gender roles even if the word “feminism” had never existed.

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You aren't anomalies at all, you're women. You find a lot of solidarity in the emotional struggles of peers, particularly women, and will end up agreeing for comfort even if you don't totally agree or see this problem at the exact same level. You want to feel included and like someone listens, therefore, you will allow your emotions to be swayed so you can be "part of the pack." This is why trends are generally a feminine thing. Women, in general, have the same approach to fashionable things. This is all pretty predictable.

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Dismissing the real experiences of women (along with the data that demonstrates measurable imbalances in the distribution of domestic labor in heterosexual marriages) as "just emotions" is not reflective of the actual data.

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The very article posted here is continuing the idea, that you support, that marriage isn't worth it for women. So yes, detaching women from familial responsibility is still very much the goal of feminism.

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Marriage is another sacrifice women make for the greater societal benefit. Feminism didn't "teach" me that. Experience and observation did.

Historically and presently, marriage has operated as a social institution that smooths over men’s instability, channels male risk-taking into acceptable forms, and produces order. Women supply much of the unpaid labor that makes that possible. Emotional regulation, domestic management, caregiving, social planning, and the invisible work of keeping a household and family coherent still fall primarily on women, even in supposedly egalitarian marriages.

Marriage often narrows women’s economic mobility, career trajectories, and personal autonomy in ways it does not for men, especially once children enter the picture. Men are more likely to benefit from marriage through improved health outcomes, increased earnings, and social legitimacy. Women are more likely to experience increased workload and responsibility with less structural support.

None of this requires ideological indoctrination to notice. You see it in who scales back at work when a child is sick, who remembers birthdays and appointments, who manages relationships with extended family, who absorbs emotional fallout so the household keeps functioning.

Feminism didn't “teach” women to be skeptical of marriage. Women became skeptical because they paid attention. They noticed that marriage, as currently structured, often asks them to give more than they receive in the name of family, children, and social order. Pretending these tradeoffs are imaginary doesn't do anything to make marriage more appealing to girls or women.