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Started By
Message
re: Today is the 75th anniversary of the last "line battle" in naval history
Posted on 10/25/19 at 2:21 pm to Chelsea Blue
Posted on 10/25/19 at 2:21 pm to Chelsea Blue
quote:
Looks like a penis
it is, it's the 'murcan, blue veined, steely, purple headed warrior of badassery and freedom, baw
This post was edited on 10/25/19 at 2:23 pm
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Posted on 10/25/19 at 2:31 pm to RollTide1987
also the Battle off Samar
I encourage anyone to read the whole thing, especially the exploits of USS Johnston and USS Roberts LINK
quote:
The Battle off Samar (Filipino: Labanan sa may Samar) was the centermost action of the Battle of Leyte Gulf, one of the largest naval battles in history, which took place in the Philippine Sea off Samar Island, in the Philippines on October 25, 1944. It was the only major action in the larger battle in which the Americans were largely unprepared against the opposing forces. The Battle off Samar has been cited by historians as one of the greatest last stands in naval history.[2]
Adm. William Halsey, Jr. was lured into taking his powerful 3rd Fleet after a decoy fleet, taking with him every ship in the area that he had the power to command. After subtracting Halsey's entire force the only remaining American forces in the area were three escort carrier groups of the 7th Fleet. The escort carriers and destroyer escorts which had been designed to protect slow convoys from submarine attack had been repurposed to attack ground targets, and had few torpedoes as they could normally rely on Halsey's fleet to protect them from any threats from armored warships.
A Japanese surface force of battleships and cruisers, battered earlier in the larger battle and thought to have been in retreat, instead turned around unobserved and encountered the northernmost of the three groups, Task Unit 77.4.3 ("Taffy 3"), commanded by Rear Admiral Clifton Sprague. Taffy 3's three destroyers and four destroyer escorts possessed neither the firepower nor the armor to effectively oppose the 23 ships of the Japanese force, but nevertheless desperately attacked with 5"/38 caliber guns and torpedoes to cover the retreat of their slow "jeep" carriers. Aircraft from the carriers of Taffy 1, 2, and 3, including FM-2 Wildcats, F6F Hellcats and TBM Avengers, strafed, bombed, torpedoed, rocketed, depth-charged, fired at least one .38 caliber handgun and made numerous "dry" runs at the Japanese force when the American planes ultimately ran out of ammunition.[3][4]
I encourage anyone to read the whole thing, especially the exploits of USS Johnston and USS Roberts LINK
Posted on 10/25/19 at 2:32 pm to AlaTiger
quote:
Was this the battle where Nimitz humiliated Halsey by saying “the world wonders” where he is?
Yes but that phrase was used as padding to thwart Japanese cryptanalysts. It wasn't intended to humiliate Halsey and should have been removed from the message before delivering it to him.
quote:
TURKEY TROTS TO WATER GG FROM CINCPAC ACTION COM THIRD FLEET INFO COMINCH CTF SEVENTY-SEVEN X WHERE IS RPT WHERE IS TASK FORCE THIRTY FOUR RR THE WORLD WONDERS
This post was edited on 10/25/19 at 2:35 pm
Posted on 10/25/19 at 3:05 pm to 777Tiger
He passed a couple years ago, sadly.
He did talk about the poker games on board after they finally saw the paymaster on the way home from the signing ceremony in Tokyo Bay.
He did talk about the poker games on board after they finally saw the paymaster on the way home from the signing ceremony in Tokyo Bay.
Posted on 10/25/19 at 3:21 pm to RollTide1987
Really cool. The dreadnought era is my favorite. Kind of a shame, Historically, that these superpowers built up these massive, powerful navies and warships and yet they didn’t see much action, relatively
Posted on 10/25/19 at 3:31 pm to fr33manator
Halsey was grossly overrated and should’ve been relieved of duty.
Spruance was the brains, he just lacked the media presence and nickname.
Spruance was the brains, he just lacked the media presence and nickname.
Posted on 10/25/19 at 3:32 pm to Jim Rockford
Cmdr evans on uss johnston was a bad mofo.
Posted on 10/25/19 at 3:35 pm to Tigeralum2008
If I'm remembering the timeline correctly he was chasing the defunct Jap carriers up north and the landing fleet was only screened by destroyers and light carriers.
The World Wonders
Edit: I see I'm late
The World Wonders
Edit: I see I'm late
This post was edited on 10/25/19 at 3:38 pm
Posted on 10/25/19 at 3:41 pm to tide06
Halsey had his uses. But strategy was not his thing.
The Navy rotating the attack dog he was with the conservative trees outlook of Spruance was a blessing.
But just imagine the damage if every American sub commander was a Halsey. We'd have strangled the Japs even faster.
The Navy rotating the attack dog he was with the conservative trees outlook of Spruance was a blessing.
But just imagine the damage if every American sub commander was a Halsey. We'd have strangled the Japs even faster.
Posted on 10/25/19 at 3:57 pm to WHS
quote:
A good friend of mine was on the USS Enterprise at the Battle of Leyte Gulf. He would always talk about the war and had a kind voice but you could tell that he was a bad arse in his day. After WWII he joined the army and was in the Korean w
So he was in the Navy for World War II and the Army for the Korean War. He must really like killing Asians
Posted on 10/25/19 at 4:04 pm to ZappBrannigan
I knew a very brave man that was a USMC Forward Artillery Observer. He said calling in a strike from the battleships was something else. Lots of firepower. Google- forward artillery observer Iwo Jima He is the fourth pic to the right. Taken at the airstrip on Iwo Jima during heavy combat. Sorry I can’t link. Him and his brother joined up to “ kill japs”.Both near 30 with wives and kids,kids on the way,careers,etc. They dropped everything to go fight. The made 4 major landings and the only wound was one scratched finger between them. The stories he could and would tell. The day I pulled up in a Toyota he gave me a history lesson.There was more disgust than anger.
Posted on 10/25/19 at 7:50 pm to 777Tiger
quote:
my uncle was there on the USS White Plains
Wasn’t that one of the escort carriers in Taffy 3?
Posted on 10/26/19 at 5:55 am to SoFla Tideroller
quote:
He passed a couple years ago, sadly.
He did talk about the poker games on board after they finally saw the paymaster on the way home from the signing ceremony in Tokyo Bay.
The father of one of my college roommates served on the Mississippi in WWII. He passed on in 2017 also.
Posted on 10/26/19 at 6:24 am to LongueCarabine
The Mississippi actually returned to the US at New Orleans, if I remember him correctly.
Posted on 10/26/19 at 6:44 am to AlaTiger
quote:
Was this the battle where Nimitz humiliated Halsey by saying “the world wonders” where he is?
My understanding is “the world wonders” was unintentional but apropos words that were randomly added to the sentence to confuse Japanese code breakers. At least that’s the Navy’s official story. Halsey certainly took it as intentional and directly from Nimitz and was both humiliated and infuriated.
I don’t think it’s necessarily fair to compare Stuart and Halsey. But I see your point. Stuart was trying to circumscribe the Union Army in a show of bravado. His actions were strategically and tactically meaningless and left Lee completely blind. Halsey on the other hand took the bait on a Japanese ruse to lure him away from Leyte Gulf by using antiquated ships that were acting as the main Japanese force. He thought he was doing the right thing by being aggressive.
This post was edited on 10/26/19 at 6:48 am
Posted on 10/26/19 at 6:55 am to AustinTigr
Every strategic decision Halsey made during the engagement was wrong.
They could teach what not to do classes at the naval academy based on this battle. He was completely embarrassed by the Japanese high command, forgot his strategic goals (protect the beach landing), was critically indecisive, failed to communicate effectively with his subordinates and did not use the intelligence at hand.
Only by the grace of god did the US landing avoid a massive loss of life and the critical loss of landing craft.
They could teach what not to do classes at the naval academy based on this battle. He was completely embarrassed by the Japanese high command, forgot his strategic goals (protect the beach landing), was critically indecisive, failed to communicate effectively with his subordinates and did not use the intelligence at hand.
Only by the grace of god did the US landing avoid a massive loss of life and the critical loss of landing craft.
Posted on 10/26/19 at 8:52 am to SoFla Tideroller
quote:Finally something Mississippi does last that is GOOD!
My FIL was on the USS Mississippi. It has the distinction of being the last battleship to fire its main armament at another battleship in this battle.
The mast off the ship is in Biloxi on the beachfront as I recall...
Posted on 10/26/19 at 9:18 am to Jim Rockford
The Battle off Samar is an amazing story. I recommend that everyone read up on it!
Posted on 10/26/19 at 9:43 am to Jim Rockford
quote:
fired at least one .38 caliber handgun
And stay out the Woolworth's, bitch!!
Posted on 10/26/19 at 10:58 am to RollTide1987
quote:
The United States won this action decisively, sinking the vaunted Japanese super battleship Yamashiro in the process.
We did win decisively, that much is true. But the Yamashiro wasn’t a super battleship. It was an obsolete World War I era dreadnaught. You’re thinking of the Yamato which was sunk by carrier-based bombers in April 1945 during a hopeless one-way suicide attack during the Battle of Okinawa. The plan the Japanese hatched was to dispatch the Yamato to Okinawa where it was to literally beach itself on the island and fight until she was destroyed. She never made it there though.
The Yamato was at the Battle of Leyte Gulf thought. However she was not at Surigao Straight. Instead she was further north at Samar where her task force was driven off by the escort carriers and DDs of Taffy 3. The Japanese were fooled by the aggressive attacks of the American destroyers, destroyer escorts, and escort carries into thinking they’d stumbled up the main body of the 3rd fleet. What they didn’t realize was Haley’s had taken the bait of the Japanese carriers (which had virtually no planes) and was Off on a wild goose chase.
What’s ironic is had the Yamato group pressed their attack they would have fallen upon the massive invasion fleet and slaughtered them, which was the plan all along. Basically the Japanese plan to lure away 3rd Fleet and then attack the unguarded invasion force had worked, they just didn’t realize it and missed a golden opportunity.
As for the Southern Force, it too was to attack the invasion force, except it was to come from the South while Yamato’s force came from the north. However, while the Northern force was able to come close to their objective, the Southern Force was intercepted and soundly defeated in Surigao Straight by the battleships of the American 7th Fleet.
This post was edited on 10/26/19 at 11:02 am
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