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Started By
Message
re: To Anyone Considering Suicide, This Is How Your Actions Torture Those Who Love You
Posted on 12/3/17 at 11:03 pm to TigersSEC2010
Posted on 12/3/17 at 11:03 pm to TigersSEC2010
Most often times there were cries for help and signs, but they usually are dismissed, not taken seriously among other reasons.
Most people don't want to believe it and families aren't trained to recognize some of the more subtle signs.
Your thread won't stop anyone because those who follow through with their suicide are not very rational anyways. They believe the opposite is true most times. They feel they can alleviate their family's disappointment, anger, embarrassment, etc. by taking their life.
It's tragic all away around and it's best we try to understand mental illness, depression, etc rather than find fault with anyone.
Most people don't want to believe it and families aren't trained to recognize some of the more subtle signs.
Your thread won't stop anyone because those who follow through with their suicide are not very rational anyways. They believe the opposite is true most times. They feel they can alleviate their family's disappointment, anger, embarrassment, etc. by taking their life.
It's tragic all away around and it's best we try to understand mental illness, depression, etc rather than find fault with anyone.
0
Posted on 12/3/17 at 11:03 pm to Fivestarschief
quote:
Enlighten me on where you are getting this from.
The OP.
Posted on 12/3/17 at 11:20 pm to TigersSEC2010
Logic doesn't exist when you're in a dark place. Everything is out the window. No way someone that hasn't seen it can begin to ascertain what goes through a person's head.
Posted on 12/3/17 at 11:35 pm to TigersSEC2010
That's agonizing to read. Poor guy and family
Posted on 12/4/17 at 12:47 am to Vegas Eddie
quote:
no sense in crying over spilled milk
Admit to yourself that you’re not intelligent. Most folks already know it.
This post was edited on 12/4/17 at 9:54 am
Posted on 12/4/17 at 1:43 am to TigersSEC2010
frick man
This thread was tough to read
This thread was tough to read
Posted on 12/4/17 at 5:08 am to GeorgeTheGreek
quote:
Suicide is incredibly selfish.
“Trolled the OT today and man did I get em good!”
fricking douche.
Posted on 12/4/17 at 5:51 am to TigersSEC2010
Tim Ferris wrote a great article on depression and suicide. Hes a guy that you look at and and say no way this guy ever could be depressed. Depression sucks bad but its an ebb and flow thing that is natural for people. Some unfortunately feel an incredible amount sometimes and can't think rationally at the time.
Very very sad
Very very sad
Posted on 12/4/17 at 6:03 am to TigersSEC2010
Yes, it tortures family. That is often the first thing that is brought up. I can guarantee that Michael Nicellette considered this. There is no telling what kind of torture his own mind was putting him through.
One of this biggest issues when you are depressed is not wanting to be a burden to your friends or family. That is why so many people kill themselves when there are no signs of anything being wrong or nobody being told. The thought of their friends and family worrying about them is horrible, the stigma associated with mental illness also dissuades folks from getting help. It's everything you can do to hold it together. You withdraw socially because keeping up appearances is exhausting.
I've been through this. I almost ended it all a few years back. It kind of changed my opinion of folks who do it. Unless you know what they are going through it shouldn't be judged. It's a serious issue and the thought of getting help can be terrifying. I was lucky enough to have friends who noticed something was off and came to me about it. If you are going through depression don't be afraid to tell somebody or seek help. If you have friends who are going through it then please make an effort to understand it so that you can better help. It isn't something that can be snapped out of. The mental anguish translates to an almost physical pain. Nothing feels right. You get tired of fighting and can't see any way forward without having to keep fighting.
One of this biggest issues when you are depressed is not wanting to be a burden to your friends or family. That is why so many people kill themselves when there are no signs of anything being wrong or nobody being told. The thought of their friends and family worrying about them is horrible, the stigma associated with mental illness also dissuades folks from getting help. It's everything you can do to hold it together. You withdraw socially because keeping up appearances is exhausting.
I've been through this. I almost ended it all a few years back. It kind of changed my opinion of folks who do it. Unless you know what they are going through it shouldn't be judged. It's a serious issue and the thought of getting help can be terrifying. I was lucky enough to have friends who noticed something was off and came to me about it. If you are going through depression don't be afraid to tell somebody or seek help. If you have friends who are going through it then please make an effort to understand it so that you can better help. It isn't something that can be snapped out of. The mental anguish translates to an almost physical pain. Nothing feels right. You get tired of fighting and can't see any way forward without having to keep fighting.
This post was edited on 12/4/17 at 8:17 am
Posted on 12/4/17 at 6:16 am to Python
quote:
Are you saying you're considering suicide?
No, I am not.
Posted on 12/4/17 at 6:42 am to oleyeller
quote:
People who think suicide is selfish are very uneducated.
Not uneducated. Just run of the mill dumb.
Posted on 12/4/17 at 7:31 am to Priapus
Not sure why everyone's arguing about this. Can we not all agree the following points?
1. Under certain circumstances, suicide can be a selfish act (e.g., a family is depending on that person economically, emotionally, etc.)
2. Most (not all) people who commit suicide are likely not thinking rationally (e.g., health issues could force the issue and result in a suicide for a very rational person [think aggressive brain tumor with no hope for reversal]).
3. Most (maybe not all) people who commit suicide actually think it is the less-selfish of the two paths forward
Can we all just get along?
1. Under certain circumstances, suicide can be a selfish act (e.g., a family is depending on that person economically, emotionally, etc.)
2. Most (not all) people who commit suicide are likely not thinking rationally (e.g., health issues could force the issue and result in a suicide for a very rational person [think aggressive brain tumor with no hope for reversal]).
3. Most (maybe not all) people who commit suicide actually think it is the less-selfish of the two paths forward
Can we all just get along?
Posted on 12/4/17 at 7:36 am to GeorgeTheGreek
quote:
Suicide is incredibly selfish.
But wanting others to keep on living and suffering through whatever it is they're suffering through for your own benefit isn't, right?
Posted on 12/4/17 at 8:46 am to TigersSEC2010
It's sad because you feel had you known they are that depressed you could have done something to stop out. Suicide puts permanent guilt on those you love.
Face your demons head on.
If only those poor souls realized that everyone faces tough tests in life, but the only sure fire way to fail these tests is to give up on life.
Face your demons head on.
If only those poor souls realized that everyone faces tough tests in life, but the only sure fire way to fail these tests is to give up on life.
Posted on 12/4/17 at 9:22 am to GeorgeTheGreek
quote:
Choosing the other path is still selfish.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being selfish.
Go to therapy/exercise/etc. People die, you grieve, you get over it. You cannot control anyone except yourself.
I thought this forum hates betas?
Posted on 12/4/17 at 9:25 am to Peazey
quote:
Yeah, because trying to make people suffering from depression feel even worse is a really good way to discourage them from committing suicide.
Posted on 12/4/17 at 9:27 am to TigersSEC2010
My brother took his life in August of this year. I found him in his home when he didn't return calls or show up to work. He lived alone, having no children from a failed marriage.
He loved my kids and my other brother's kids. I asked him to be my 4 month old daughter's (1 month old at time of suicide) godfather 6 weeks prior to his death. He was honored by the request, and he showed up at the hospital with all kinds of presents when she was born.
He was very much a loner, who had work friends and my brother and I, but not much else of a social life. We had a 13 year age gap, so I struggled identifying with him in terms of common interests. We hunted and fished together, but he was never the initiator of trips, it was always either me, my other brother or my dad who got him to go. That said, he had an amazing laugh and his smile brightened everyone's day.
My mom knew that he was lonely, and she always pushed to include him in parties (we all work for a large company, very active in the local social scene in terms of tailgating, casino functions, etc.). She knew, a mother's intuition is real. My other brother and I never really understood our mom's concerns, because he always seemed happy to see us and loved both of my parents deeply. I know that he loved all of us deeply.
He shot himself through the chest the morning of Wednesday August 30. I found him Thursday morning. It makes me feel a little better knowing that it didn't take longer for someone to realize that he was missing.
My parents are broken. They will never be the same. At first, I was so, so ANGRY at what he did, at what he put my parents through, at forcing my other brother to explain to his 14 and 12 year old that their beloved uncle, who always spoiled them at Xmas and for their birthdays, had killed himself. Anger really doesn't describe how MAD I was at him. It kills me that my 2 year old and 4 month old won't know their grandparents as they were before this happened. They will never be the same.
He was, in hindsight, depressed. As we unpacked his life and went through his house, we learned of a crippling depression and anxiety. He never sought medical help. He so very much wanted a family, but his social anxiety prevented him from succeeding in dating. He was a very, very private person. All family functions were either at my house, my other brother's house, or my parents house, and when we picked him up to go hunting/fishing, he was always waiting on us with coffee in his carport when we pulled up. His house was a microcosm of his mind and feelings, he did not let anyone in. And maybe I should have done better trying to get in, I'll never know, and that will forever haunt me.
As time has passed, that anger has changed to sadness. I am incredibly sad that he didn't feel he could talk to me or my other brother. I'm sad that he had to live with the weight of depression and anxiety for so long, and It breaks my heart to think of his final moments. My wife still harbors anger about it, and I understand her perspective. The process of finding him really fricked me up, but I can't be mad at him anymore. He deserves better than for us to be mad at him.
I know he is at peace now, and that gives me some solace. Whatever dark passenger he carried with him, and we think he must have carried it with him for quite some time, is now gone. But I'll tell you, it hurts like a bitch to go through this hunting and holiday season without him.
Suicide IS a selfish thing. It harms the people that love the deceased the most. But people who succumb to depression and choose suicide truly feel that they have no other option. In that regard, I'm OK with knowing that what he did was selfish, because, for whatever reason, he felt like it was the only choice that he had. I wish he hadn't, and I don't think he'd make the same choice again if he could see what its done to my parents, but I still love him as much as I did before, and I can't wait to see him again.
Semper Fi brother.
ETA: Sorry for the novel, started writing and it felt good. TL;DR understood.
He loved my kids and my other brother's kids. I asked him to be my 4 month old daughter's (1 month old at time of suicide) godfather 6 weeks prior to his death. He was honored by the request, and he showed up at the hospital with all kinds of presents when she was born.
He was very much a loner, who had work friends and my brother and I, but not much else of a social life. We had a 13 year age gap, so I struggled identifying with him in terms of common interests. We hunted and fished together, but he was never the initiator of trips, it was always either me, my other brother or my dad who got him to go. That said, he had an amazing laugh and his smile brightened everyone's day.
My mom knew that he was lonely, and she always pushed to include him in parties (we all work for a large company, very active in the local social scene in terms of tailgating, casino functions, etc.). She knew, a mother's intuition is real. My other brother and I never really understood our mom's concerns, because he always seemed happy to see us and loved both of my parents deeply. I know that he loved all of us deeply.
He shot himself through the chest the morning of Wednesday August 30. I found him Thursday morning. It makes me feel a little better knowing that it didn't take longer for someone to realize that he was missing.
My parents are broken. They will never be the same. At first, I was so, so ANGRY at what he did, at what he put my parents through, at forcing my other brother to explain to his 14 and 12 year old that their beloved uncle, who always spoiled them at Xmas and for their birthdays, had killed himself. Anger really doesn't describe how MAD I was at him. It kills me that my 2 year old and 4 month old won't know their grandparents as they were before this happened. They will never be the same.
He was, in hindsight, depressed. As we unpacked his life and went through his house, we learned of a crippling depression and anxiety. He never sought medical help. He so very much wanted a family, but his social anxiety prevented him from succeeding in dating. He was a very, very private person. All family functions were either at my house, my other brother's house, or my parents house, and when we picked him up to go hunting/fishing, he was always waiting on us with coffee in his carport when we pulled up. His house was a microcosm of his mind and feelings, he did not let anyone in. And maybe I should have done better trying to get in, I'll never know, and that will forever haunt me.
As time has passed, that anger has changed to sadness. I am incredibly sad that he didn't feel he could talk to me or my other brother. I'm sad that he had to live with the weight of depression and anxiety for so long, and It breaks my heart to think of his final moments. My wife still harbors anger about it, and I understand her perspective. The process of finding him really fricked me up, but I can't be mad at him anymore. He deserves better than for us to be mad at him.
I know he is at peace now, and that gives me some solace. Whatever dark passenger he carried with him, and we think he must have carried it with him for quite some time, is now gone. But I'll tell you, it hurts like a bitch to go through this hunting and holiday season without him.
Suicide IS a selfish thing. It harms the people that love the deceased the most. But people who succumb to depression and choose suicide truly feel that they have no other option. In that regard, I'm OK with knowing that what he did was selfish, because, for whatever reason, he felt like it was the only choice that he had. I wish he hadn't, and I don't think he'd make the same choice again if he could see what its done to my parents, but I still love him as much as I did before, and I can't wait to see him again.
Semper Fi brother.
ETA: Sorry for the novel, started writing and it felt good. TL;DR understood.
This post was edited on 12/4/17 at 9:38 am
Posted on 12/4/17 at 9:41 am to K E V 8 4
quote:
Not sure why everyone's arguing about this. Can we not all agree the following points?
1. Under certain circumstances, suicide can be a selfish act (e.g., a family is depending on that person economically, emotionally, etc.)
2. Most (not all) people who commit suicide are likely not thinking rationally (e.g., health issues could force the issue and result in a suicide for a very rational person [think aggressive brain tumor with no hope for reversal]).
3. Most (maybe not all) people who commit suicide actually think it is the less-selfish of the two paths forward
Can we all just get along?
Agreed. These threads always breakdown into just blanket statements warring against each other. My family has been close to two suicides where the people involved may or may not have been suffering from depression. Both were young people reacting to concerns about shame/getting in trouble and acting spontaneously without other mood disorder warning signs.
Posted on 12/4/17 at 9:50 am to celltech1981
quote:
the stigma associated with mental illness also dissuades folks from getting help
and the "help" you get doesnt always help. 23 years ago I was struggling with severe depression. every single thing you just said is 100% true to my own situation. it got so bad I was losing everything, friends, family, job, so I decided to face the stigma head on & get help. went to the dr, referred to therapist, long story short they put me on anti depressants. first one seemed to make me worse if anything so I went back and requested to try something else. with the new one within 3 days it was so overwhelming I couldnt function at all. I ate an entire bottle of pills and washed it down with a fifth of bourbon and if not for sheer luck I wouldnt be here today to share this. be careful with the pills they give you. if something doesnt seem right with them dont wait a few days to see if you adjust. those few days can end your life. I have struggled with depression my entire life and the only thing that ever made me feel well adjusted was marijuana. no amount of therapy or anti depressants ever came close and it wouldnt be hyperbole to say I have probably spent a million dollars combined on treatments for depression.
Posted on 12/4/17 at 10:07 am to Kracka
quote:
don't know how my parents deal with it. Some days to me it feels just as fresh as it did 9 yrs ago
My friend killed himself in college. His father at the funeral was gut wrenching. He wasn’t weeping or wailing or anything. His eyes were constantly damp but it was how broken he looked. I was only 20 years old but could tell that man will never be the same. Probably barely middle aged and his life is ruined. Any joy he ever finds in life will be tempered.
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