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Message
re: Teacher Pay Is So Low in Some U.S. School Districts That They’re Recruiting Overseas
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:24 am to Wayne Campbell
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:24 am to Wayne Campbell
quote:My point is that quality is already shite because that is already what is happening and people who have no business teaching, well, are.
You can replace a 5* chef with a McDonald's fry cook, just don't be surprised when quality goes to shite.
The field is not selective enough.
1
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:25 am to lynxcat
quote:
Those careers provide strong financial upside that doesn't exist in teaching...
You don't think teachers would get better pay if we made it harder to get into it? What's the use in making it a tough, selective job if we still pay $40k?
quote:
there is
quote:
will face a shortage of between 61,700 and 94,700 doctors by 2025
And psychiatrists
This post was edited on 5/3/18 at 10:26 am
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:28 am to Wayne Campbell
quote:
You can replace a 5* chef with a McDonald's fry cook, just don't be surprised when quality goes to shite.
I can vouch for this. I've seen several colleagues who were excellent teachers retire over the years. The people who have replaced them, for the most part, are not so great. That's being kind. The truth is that not many want to do this anymore. There are many more careers out there in which a person can be paid much more without having to deal with half of the things that today's teachers have to deal with.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:31 am to TH03
quote:
America, where education for the future members of our society gets sold to to lowest bidder.
Considering the downward spiral of the teachers output over the last few DECADES they earned this low bid situation.
Maybe they should use their Union to demand accountability, not just to themselves but to administration, school boards, all of it. A total revamp is required to improve education.
The Chalk Wall is tougher to break than the Blue Wall. Demand bad teachers get the boot, stop covering for bad teachers, pay for performance system. If the constant is bad parents, then strengthen the support system. Perhaps since taxpayers are already paying for the food, housing, clothing of poorly parented kids, a new wave of boarding schools can be implemented to get the kids outta the negative "hood" and into a reinforced structured upbringing.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:37 am to AA77
I thought teachers made more individually than the average household income in most southern states and only work 9-10 months per year. What are they doing to supplement their incomes with all the free time?
Forbes Low Teacher Pay Myth
Forbes Low Teacher Pay Myth
This post was edited on 5/15/18 at 3:11 pm
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:41 am to TH03
quote:
You don't think teachers would get better pay if we made it harder to get into it? What's the use in making it a tough, selective job if we still pay $40k?
No, it's tax payer funded. Education gets X dollars of funding per year, not dependent on school quality. Maybe a little, but not like industry where results drive pay.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:42 am to BigB0882
quote:
You can't count the time off in teacher's pay because they are not paid for that time off. Teachers are paid for working 180 days a year. They have a contract that stipulates that (the number may slightly change from district to district). So no, I am NOT getting paid during the summer, nor am I getting paid over Christmas break.
This is also why I don't complain about my pay. I know it isn't a lot but I also know I work very little over the course of a year compared to others. If I was paid for working 52 weeks a year then my pay would be very nice assuming the pay per day didn't change
You don't pay social security, have denied benefit retirement and have really really low insurance costs, those are all forms of compensation.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:43 am to Sidicous
quote:
quote:
America, where education for the future members of our society gets sold to to lowest bidder.
Considering the downward spiral of the teachers output over the last few DECADES they earned this low bid situation.
Maybe they should use their Union to demand accountability, not just to themselves but to administration, school boards, all of it. A total revamp is required to improve education.
The Chalk Wall is tougher to break than the Blue Wall. Demand bad teachers get the boot, stop covering for bad teachers, pay for performance system. If the constant is bad parents, then strengthen the support system. Perhaps since taxpayers are already paying for the food, housing, clothing of poorly parented kids, a new wave of boarding schools can be implemented to get the kids outta the negative "hood" and into a reinforced structured upbringing.
this 'downward spiral' can be attributed to a great many things ... yes, part of it is poor teacher performance ... much of it is societal and structural ...
yes, a total revamp is required ... most republicans and democrats have no desire for a total revamp ...
pay for performance is asinine and anyone who favors it should be dismissed in the education discussion ...
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:43 am to Sidicous
quote:
If the constant is bad parents, then strengthen the support system. Perhaps since taxpayers are already paying for the food, housing, clothing of poorly parented kids, a new wave of boarding schools can be implemented to get the kids outta the negative "hood" and into a reinforced structured upbringing.
I agree completely that our education system needs a complete overhaul from the ground-up.
What I quoted is the tricky part however.
Lots of people like to spout off about how teachers need to perform better and be held accountable. For the most part, I agree with that. However...
The traditional "free-market performance" argument (whereby better talent/performance naturally commands better results/compensation) doesn't really hold weight in K-12 education.
Educators can't be treated the same way that private-sector businesses are treated, because the "product" they are providing is oftentimes not even desired by the "customer" (the student). The teachers need the willing cooperation of their students in order to succeed.
That's often not true in most businesses, because the cooperation of the customer is a given (because why the hell would you freely spend your money on something you don't want?)
In other words, you could hire John friggin Smoltz to teach your kid how to pitch. But if your kid doesn't give a shite about learning how to pitch, it doesn't matter how great of a pitching coach Smotlz is.
This post was edited on 5/3/18 at 12:42 pm
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:43 am to High C
quote:
I've been teaching for 23 years, and don't make near this.
W
T
F?
My ex's kid works in CISD and her first year out, NO MBA or post-grad work, started her out at $53k.
What district are you in?
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:43 am to AA77
Give them a raise and make school year round with small breaks in between semesters. Do away with standardized testing.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:44 am to go ta hell ole miss
And to go back to the point of replaceability, approximately 12% of all public school teachers are in their 1st or 2nd year.
This means that there is a turnover of ~200-300,000 teachers yearly.
That is insane.
This means that there is a turnover of ~200-300,000 teachers yearly.
That is insane.
This post was edited on 5/3/18 at 10:47 am
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:45 am to go ta hell ole miss
quote:
I thought teachers made more individually than the average household income in most southern states and only work 9-10 months per year. What are they doing to supplant their incomes with all the free time?
Forbes Low Teacher Pay Myth
hmm ... articles cites chiropractors as being 'professionals' ... perhaps we can give them a little extra training to be medical doctors to alleviate the shortage ... i'm sure all he resident rant medical doctors would have no problem with that ...
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:48 am to StringedInstruments
quote:
Surprisingly, Alabama is good for teacher pay. My wife currently makes $58k at a public elementary school. 12 years experience.
60 a year and get half the year off and retire earleir than every American. I thought teachers were struggling
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:53 am to Mingo Was His NameO
I'm talking about changing it all, baw. Education isn't where we need to cut costs.
Up the percentage. Pay teachers more, but make it a selective job. And for fricks sake hold them accountable. Shitty teachers should be fired.
Less dropouts, less welfare queens, more higher paid members of society, more tax revenue.
It'll never happen though. I'll just go to the suburbs or pay for Catholic school.
Up the percentage. Pay teachers more, but make it a selective job. And for fricks sake hold them accountable. Shitty teachers should be fired.
Less dropouts, less welfare queens, more higher paid members of society, more tax revenue.
It'll never happen though. I'll just go to the suburbs or pay for Catholic school.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 10:58 am to Scruffy
quote:
arning a teaching degree is not terribly hard. Vast numbers of college students earn them yearly.
You are wrong again. There are not vast amounts of people graduating with degrees in education. In fact, the state of Louisiana is doing a study to try and understand why there are so few people going to college to be teachers. When I graduated Southeastern in 2012, which has the best education program in the state, there were around 100 graduates in Higher (7-12) education. This past spring there were around 20 graduates in the entire college of education including all K-12 levels. So Mr. Scruffy, please explain to me where are all of these vast amounts of people going to be teachers?
While I was at SLU doing my student teaching and methods, there were many students that the college of education kicked out because they could not make it in the classroom. This is what we are running into when you hire some person with a degree in marketing to teach. They have no idea what they are doing, but hey they have a degree lets let them teach! here is the problem we allow them to teach because not enough people are going to school to get a legit teaching degree so we have to take what we can get which is shite.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 11:03 am to tiderider
quote:
pay for performance is asinine and anyone who favors it should be dismissed in the education discussion ...
And there goes the Chalk Wall.
Not a single person is saying all kids have to turn out to be Einsteins. Saying all kids have to read, write, and know basic math is performance. Not talking Ebonics level either, but rather real language skills.
The only standardized test should be: Can they pass the GED? If teachers can consistently meet that low bar = eligible for raises.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 11:09 am to Sidicous
quote:
quote:
pay for performance is asinine and anyone who favors it should be dismissed in the education discussion ...
And there goes the Chalk Wall.
Not a single person is saying all kids have to turn out to be Einsteins. Saying all kids have to read, write, and know basic math is performance. Not talking Ebonics level either, but rather real language skills.
The only standardized test should be: Can they pass the GED? If teachers can consistently meet that low bar = eligible for raises.
ain't no chalk walk here, slick ... try that infantile reasoning with someone else ... been a proponent of school choice and phasing out requirement of education degrees my entire teaching career, which includes every type school there is ... teachers can't overcome parents who don't give a shite, and that isn't limited to the urbanites ... plenty of you suburban baws that don't give a damn about reading skills or actual education ... you're only interested in grades ... a kid who makes it to the 8th grade with 4th grade reading skills won't be passing a GED anytime soon, if ever, unless they have individualized tutoring every day ...
Posted on 5/3/18 at 11:14 am to WHS
quote:
And BTW, I coach football so I work during the summer and late in the fall and in the spring which amounts to less than 50 cents per hour for what I get paid to coach.
Quick hijack. Didn't you and your wife adopt some kids recently? How are you finding the time to still coach? When my daughter was born, I gave it up. It was one of the best decisions I ever made. I had time to get a Masters and am looking for an admin job as we speak.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 11:14 am to tiderider
quote:
teachers can't overcome parents who don't give a shite
Those parents probably don't give a shite because they have a shitty education too.
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