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re: St. George LA denied incorporation by Court of Appeals

Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:44 am to
Posted by RedHawk
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2007
9658 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:44 am to
quote:

Central had the same lawyers and were able to incorporate under the same process. Explain that to everyone.


One of these maps makes a whole lot more sense than the other to me.





Posted by kingbob
Sorrento, LA
Member since Nov 2010
70538 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:46 am to
That wasn’t the issue that invalidated the petition
Posted by RedHawk
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2007
9658 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:49 am to
quote:

I think I'm gonna have some big decisions to make soon and it really wasn't what I was planning for this immediate. My guess: The subverting of what people legally voted for accelerates the schedule of me or my parents' homes getting broken into at an alarming rate.


What?? Just because your address would have said St. George, wouldn't mean you don't still live in EBR Parish. I'm guessing criminals wouldn't even know if you lived in St. George or BR.
Posted by Dingeaux
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2005
5823 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:52 am to
quote:

It is being used to cyphon money from the un incorporated areas to pay for city services while avoiding providing services to those unincorporated areas. St. George is essentially a tax colony in this system.


City of Baton Rouge is England. Unincorporated areas are colonial US.
Posted by RedHawk
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2007
9658 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:53 am to
quote:

That wasn’t the issue that invalidated the petition


Not saying it was, but WTF with that St. George map? Pockets in the middle that are still BR and that line that goes up the Amite River?
This post was edited on 7/14/23 at 11:54 am
Posted by dallastigers
Member since Dec 2003
10619 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:55 am to
quote:

we pretermit discussion of any other issues herein, including the alleged unreasonableness of the incorporation and the alleged adverse impact on the City of Baton Rouge.


Wasn’t this the focus of initial decisions including challenge being allowed to continue in court after vote?

These court decisions keep shifting the bar on reason people’s vote to equally live within an incorporated city like those in BR shouldn’t happen.

As for StG’s plan it was as detailed as any and met state constitutional and law requirements when voted on and was ready to begin process after the people approved its incorporation. Instead of being allowed to start it got dragged into court battles, faced BR annexing parts of StG, more issues getting pushed into area by Mayor-President, and the long Wuhan delays in initial court processes. I still think plan is still valid, but they have been denied starting the process for years by actions of BR and these annexations by BR. If years later changes are part of reasoning now they shouldn’t be.

When was Central vote and when was it allowed to start transition?

When was the StG vote?

Posted by Kramer26
St. George, LA
Member since Jan 2005
6510 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:56 am to
I think they need to go back to the first map including all unincorporated area if they try the petition again. I believe support has increased over these years.
Posted by SixthAndBarone
Member since Jan 2019
11191 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:57 am to
quote:

I admire the organizers for taking their time and using their resources to better our community


They tried to better our community based on their own wants. St. George does not have overwhelming support. Have they worked in the community to find out what people want? Nobody has ever asked me and I don’t recall a meeting where they let me come tell them.

If you really want change, begin by getting rid of the parish consolidated government.
This post was edited on 7/14/23 at 12:01 pm
Posted by ProjectP2294
West St. Louis County
Member since May 2007
78748 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 11:59 am to
quote:

Not saying it was, but WTF with that St. George map?


It includes all the unincorporated areas that expressed interest in being included.

quote:

Pockets in the middle that are still BR and that line that goes up the Amite River?


That is caused by Baton Rouge annexing specific commercial properties for tax revenue purposes after the petition was filed. Which actually should have put those annexations into a legally questionable status.
Posted by thejuiceisloose
Member since Nov 2018
6392 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:02 pm to
quote:

I don’t understand how they can stop this. It was voted on and passed. It’s more proof that your vote means nothing


You can read a short section of the decision posted on the page you're replying to or you can continue to stick your head in the mud and say "I don't know why this happened, but I damn sure ain't reading what them judges said"
Posted by RedHawk
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2007
9658 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:03 pm to
quote:

It includes all the unincorporated areas that expressed interest in being included.


I guess that is what happens when people didn't vote the way they wanted on the first petition. Just keep redrawing the map until you get the number of signatures you need.
Posted by ProjectP2294
West St. Louis County
Member since May 2007
78748 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:05 pm to
quote:

I guess that is what happens when people didn't vote the way they wanted on the first petition. Just keep redrawing the map until you get the number of signatures you need.


You're saying they shouldn't do the things within their power to better their chances of success? I mean, why would they keep beating their heads against the wall to include areas that aren't interested in being included?
Posted by dallastigers
Member since Dec 2003
10619 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:05 pm to
quote:

Pockets in the middle that are still BR


Did you believe lie that StG was breaking away from BR and that BR & StG were one? At the time of petition and it’s successful vote the entire StG area was unincorporated and not within boundaries of BR city limits.


quote:

that line that goes up the Amite River


This either connected to the city of central or to the central school district.
Posted by Big4SALTbro
Member since Jun 2019
24436 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:09 pm to
No you do not want all of unincorporated BR in this. They actually need to trim some more shite areas off it.
Posted by BigBinBR
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2023
10220 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:12 pm to
quote:

I guess that is what happens when people didn't vote the way they wanted on the first petition.


Nobody “voted” on the first petition. The second petition removed neighborhoods that didn’t want to be a part of St. George.

Why do you support forcing neighborhoods to be included in a petition that they don’t want any part of?

If the city of Baton Rouge actually cared about the neighborhoods that didn’t want to be part of St. George, why haven’t they started the annexation process for those areas?
Posted by dallastigers
Member since Dec 2003
10619 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:15 pm to
quote:

I guess that is what happens when people didn't vote the way they wanted on the first petition. Just keep redrawing the map until you get the number of signatures you need.


Vote didn’t happen on first attempt. A judge or some official ruled enough signatures to be invalid and a vote wasn’t put on a ballot. See the pattern?

BR started annexing some commercial areas even back then, so StG organizers were going to need to redraw boundaries anyway and decided to use the information from signatures to refine boundaries before trying again. Vote passed.
Posted by kingbob
Sorrento, LA
Member since Nov 2010
70538 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:17 pm to
quote:

Not saying it was, but WTF with that St. George map?


Since the voting rights act made expanding a city’s boundaries in a way that would dilute minority voting power illegal, the city moved to the consolidated model. Thus, they could only annex neighborhoods that were as or more black than the city as a whole or real estate that had no residents living on it. The borders were gerrymandered to provide maximum revenue to the city without having to expand city services to the unincorporated areas. This made sense because a portion of parish wide sales taxes were being routed to the city general fund, and the city of BR was the only incorporated city in the Parish. Over time, Baker, Zachary, and Central were able to incorporate so that they could form their own school system apart from the broken EBRPSS that persisted after the 80’s desegregation lawsuit.

The city selectively annexed commercial property after the first petition in order to prevent those businesses from providing sales tax revenue to a potential St. George.

The initial St. George petition included all unincorporated areas south of Baton Rouge and Central, which included that weird little area on the East side of town by the Amite.

After the failure of the first petition, the organizers carved off the neighborhoods most opposed to incorporation (Gardere) and the areas where signature invalidation was most frequently an issue (large apartment complexes). Basically, this was done to gerrymander the lines of the second St. George petition to be as likely to support incorporating as possible.
This post was edited on 7/14/23 at 12:21 pm
Posted by LSUBoo
Knoxville, TN
Member since Mar 2006
104059 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:21 pm to
quote:

Now, it’s being used by a black majority city to control a white majority parish.


Pretty sure EBR isn't a white majority parish anymore.
Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
30358 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:21 pm to
quote:

You can read a short section of the decision posted on the page you're replying to or you can continue to stick your head in the mud and say "I don't know why this happened, but I damn sure ain't reading what them judges said"



or you can think that you live in fricking america and when you have a fricking election the results are honored, and you don't need whatever stupid arse excuse you're being given as to why a lawful election result isn't being upheld.
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
37364 posts
Posted on 7/14/23 at 12:25 pm to
quote:

I guess that is what happens when people didn't vote the way they wanted on the first petition. Just keep redrawing the map until you get the number of signatures you need.

Somehow you are spinning the fact that StG specifically sought to include only the areas that actually wanted to be included as a negative?
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