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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Posted on 3/16/24 at 7:59 am to
Posted by CitizenK
BR
Member since Aug 2019
16113 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 7:59 am to
quote:

I think it will take a lot of burned refineries for Putin to change course.

This is just a good start.


The goal is more to create unease among the public. We already know that Putin's re-election is assured. The Kremlin handpicked the opposing candidates.
Posted by No Colors
Sandbar
Member since Sep 2010
13507 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 8:00 am to
quote:

massively expand his own remote attacks on vulnerable Ukrainian infrastructure.


How did that work these past two winters? Did it freeze out the Ukrainean people and force them to capitulate?

Or did it just waste a lot of resources on both sides while galvanizing the resolve of the resistance?

Nat Gas prices in Europe are lower than they were before the invasion. And that's with Russian gas cut off to Germany.

If that Ukrainean infrastructure is so vulnerable, then why did Putin's plan fail so dramatically?
Posted by Hateradedrink
Member since May 2023
4156 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 8:02 am to
no bro the gloves are about to come off
Posted by No Colors
Sandbar
Member since Sep 2010
13507 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 8:02 am to
quote:

no bro the gloves are about to come off


I think you're right. Russia is gonna start trying in this war any minute now
Posted by CitizenK
BR
Member since Aug 2019
16113 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 9:02 am to
Russians on golf carts made me think of this.

LINK
Posted by DMAN1968
Member since Apr 2019
13437 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 9:14 am to
quote:

According to analysis by Vorstka of Russian Pension and Social Insurance Fund data, there has been a record growth between 2022 and 2023 in the amount of Russian men aged 31-59 years with disabilities, over the eight years of available data. In 2022, there were officially 1.67 million men with disabilities in Russia aged 31-59 years. This figure increased by 507,000 or 30% in 2023.

quote:

Over the last 18 months, the Ministry of Social Policy has reported an increase of approximately 300,000 individuals with disabilities.

Ukraine requires an increasing number of rehabilitation specialists, varied centers, and departments to aid in the recovery of our citizens’ functionality. The number of people sustaining injuries is increasing.

International partners’ support and assistance are crucial at present.


I'm kind of surprised Ukraine let these numbers out.
gov.ua
Posted by No Colors
Sandbar
Member since Sep 2010
13507 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 9:28 am to
That's a mix of combat injuries and guys claiming disability to avoid military service.
Posted by DMAN1968
Member since Apr 2019
13437 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 9:45 am to
Well, I don't know about all that. If you factor in the fact that 13% of families that have fled Ukraine had at least one disabled family member then the actual number of newly disabled is probably higher.
Posted by WeeWee
Member since Aug 2012
45711 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 9:46 am to
quote:

"Around 50 religious ministers, Protestant pastors, Orthodox priests, Catholic priests have been imprisoned or killed,"


SirWinston would you like to explain this Christian behavior?
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
42751 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:07 am to
quote:

Let's add some context to that infographic GIF you posted.

Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria, and East Germany all had Soviet troops in them by 1945 and after the war, they were FORCED to become communist without any choice. Why is it surprising they became part of NATO as soon as they could to hopefully prevent that sort of thing from ever happening again?


Yes thank you. Why did they not paint the situation as they were before Hitler took Austria. That way you can see the ebb and flow and how Russia conquered Eastern Europe and hung on.

Then you could understand that when these countries were finally freed from Communism and how they elected to join the West and NATO.

Unlike Russia, NATO never invaded or conquered. That continued on today and we saw both Sweden and Finland ask to join NATO.
This post was edited on 3/16/24 at 10:32 am
Posted by GOP_Tiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2005
21027 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:14 am to
Alexander Kamyshin posts:

quote:

He who controls the spice controls the universe, says Vladimir Harkonnen.

He who can destroy a thing controls a thing, says Paul Atreides.

Burning down russian refineries, we destroy russian “spice” - oil. To approach the victory of Ukraine we have to #BurnDownCrazyGasStation


Posted by cypher
Member since Sep 2014
5729 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:20 am to
Russia Lost 12% of Its Oil Refinery Capacity in a Day: What’s the Impact?

Tom O’Donnell, PhD, an expert on energy and geopolitics, sat down with Kyiv Post to explain what Ukraine’s attacks on Russia’s energy sector will mean for the larger Russian energy sector.

It sounds like a huge number. But how much do you think losing 12 percent of production, in a day, will affect Russia?

First off, although these refineries hit by Ukrainian drones yesterday represent about 12 percent of Russian production, experience shows that they might not each be totally impaired from production. Nevertheless, there are two particularly significant implications for Russia.

First, whatever percentage of Russian refined oil products this impairs, the damage will both deprive the war economy of needed export revenues and/or of much-needed fuels to keep the domestic war economy running.

Already, Russia had announced it will ban the export of gasoline from March 1 in order to tame prices for consumers in the runup to the presidential elections mid-month. In 2023 about 17 percent of Russian gasoline was exported.

What is the origin of the current price pressure?

The present price pressure is both a result of the demands of the war economy as well as previously successful Ukrainian hits on other refineries that began in January.

This gets to my second point – the successful refinery strikes of yesterday, involving a reported launch of 58 drones, as well as recent hits on a Russian domestic gas transmission pipeline, all demonstrate that the January successes were not one-off special operations, but rather the beginning of what will be a sustained Ukraine armed forces campaign capable of, over time, significantly disrupting Russia’s all-important oil and gas import revenues and internal refined-product supplies.

more on strategic implications...

The Kyiv Post

Bloomberg reports suggest that the raids in March have affected approximately 12% of the country's refining capacity.

The Kyiv Post
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
42751 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:28 am to
quote:

t is surprising that NATO offered.
Why?
Because it was unnecessary. It was counter to US assurances associated with German reunification. It was and is destabilizing. It led to Putin's ascendance. It directly led to furtherance of counterproductive Sino-Russian alliances. After 15yrs of failed diplomacy, it eventually triggered a predictable and well predicted war.


You blame everything that happens on NATO which is an underfunded defensive coalition.

Let me ask you this; if the east European nations had not joined NATO how do you know Russia wouldn’t have decided to attack Poland, Romania, Hungary or the Baltic States? History proves that they have repeatedly attacked their neighbors in order to dominate and control them.

Ukraine isn’t a one of. There have been plenty of other nations who felt the savage Russian military. Poland, Hungary, Georgia, Afghanistan among others.

Being in NATO has brought peace for its members. Finland and Sweden saw the benefits and rushed to join after what they saw in Ukraine.

Russian history is filled with ruthless dictators. Blaming NATO for Putin’s Russ to power is ridiculous. If Putin didn’t become premier it’s likely some other Russian goin would have.

The Sino-Russian alliance has been in place as long as the Commies dominated China. They allied themselves against the US and together they helped kill American troops in Korea and then Vietnam. NATO didn’t cause that.

Sure there have been 15 years of failed diplomacy. You are dealing with Russia who agreed to let Ukraine go in exchange for their nukes and then changed their minds. The same people who invaded Georgia. They fought against our interests in Syria by allying themselves with a brutal dictator.

Now they are actively trying to spread their influence in Africa. Why would anyone think Russia would be a peaceful nation if only NATO would have stayed in Western Europe.
To think Russia would not have been actively spreading turmoil and their influence in Eastern Europe if there was no NATO there is ridiculous.

This post was edited on 3/16/24 at 10:36 am
Posted by WeeWee
Member since Aug 2012
45711 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:29 am to
quote:

Putin’s dilemma: Continue the invasion, illegally occupy Ukraine territory, and watch his refineries burn or withdraw completely and salvage the oil and gas industry.Putin’s dilemma: Continue the invasion, or withdraw, or massively expand his own remote attacks on vulnerable Ukrainian infrastructure.


Putin tried that already and Ukraine rebuilt its infrastructure and improved its air defenses. Ukraine’s critical infrastructure is in better condition now and better protected than it was before the invasion.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
42751 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:37 am to
It’s either or

Putin attacks Ukraine’s infrastructure and Ukraine’s military retools and rebuilds.

Putin attacks the military and the infrastructure retools and rebuilds.

Apparently he can’t do both.
Posted by WeeWee
Member since Aug 2012
45711 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:37 am to
quote:

It led to Putin's ascendance.


Bullshite. Putin came to power by using his KGB contacts to get in with the people in power in St Petersburg, his investigation into corruption for the Kremlin renovations that kept Yeltsin and his family and allies from being charged with corruption charges. NATO expansion didn’t become an issue for Putin until 2005-2006 which was years after he was in power.
Posted by DMAN1968
Member since Apr 2019
13437 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:47 am to
quote:

You blame everything that happens on NATO which is an underfunded defensive coalition.


Circa 2008
quote:

The Russian president, Vladimir Putin, today repeated his warning that Moscow would view any attempt to expand Nato to its borders as a "direct threat".

Posted by GOP_Tiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2005
21027 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 10:59 am to
I remember how, for so many months, we had posters in here who insisted that Putin really just wanted to protect the rights of Russian-speaking residents of the Donbas.

Today, we get the former Prime Minister and current Deputy Secretary of the Security Council of Russia insisting that Latvia is not a country (it is, instead, part of Russia).




Every last bit of Biden's concern about "escalation" has only encouraged Putin to do exactly that. We demonstrated weakness, and Russia seized on that.


EDIT: Also note that "Nazi" just means any opponent of Russia, as many of us have said since Russia talked about "denazification" from the very beginning. According to Russia, I and every Russia critic in here would be nazis by definition.
This post was edited on 3/16/24 at 11:13 am
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
42751 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 11:02 am to
Putin tried to stop the spread of NATO so he could try and regain influence of all those ex Warsaw Pact countries.

Of course Putin was against the spread of NATO, but how many times has NATO attacked Russia? Now list the number of times Russia attacked a non NATO country.

Posted by WeeWee
Member since Aug 2012
45711 posts
Posted on 3/16/24 at 11:54 am to
quote:

no bro the gloves are about to come off


I think you're right. Russia is gonna start trying in this war any minute now



What can Russia do that it has not done already other than use weapons of mass destruction? I do not believe that Putin is reckless or stupid enough to do that. Russia has already mobilized its economy for war. Sure it can increase its forces and try to overwhelm Ukrainian positions with lots of human wave attacks. However, it does not have the capacity to sustain that for very long. Russia has been firing an estimated average of 10,000 shells per day over the past few months. That is approximately 300,000 shells per month if my math is correct. However, it is producing an estimated 250,000 shells per month. That means Russia is consuming 50,000 shells per month more than it is making. That is a 600,000 shell per year deficit at its current rate of consumption. Iran and North Korea sent shells to Russia last year but how long can they continue to do that given Israeli tensions are at an all time high and North Korea and South Korea are not exactly on speaking terms at the moment. Russia is producing 100 - 120 MBTs per month but almost 90% of those are old T72s, T62s, and T55s pulled out of storage and repaired. Most are not even modernized. Those old tanks are not only vulnerable to Ukrainian tanks, mines, drones, ATGMs, but also recoiless rifles and even old RPGs. Plus until either side figures out how to effectively protect tanks from FPD drones the role of tanks of the battlefield is somewhat diminished. Russia could intensify its missile and drone attacks on Ukraine but with Ukraine's improved air defenses it takes > 100 missiles and drones per attack to overwhelm the Ukrainian air defenses and have some get through. It is only producing about 100 missiles per month and 300 drones per month. So unless Russia has a big stockpile or production capacity many times greater than western estimates (which usually overestimate Russia's abilities FWIW) I don't see a major change in the war. Russia might capture a few villages and kms of empty fields and kill more Ukrainian civilians but I don't see a major shift in the war in the near term. The only thing that could change the war in the near term significantly in Russia's favor is if they stopped focussing on civilian targets and concentrated all their missile and drone attacks on the 11 rail bridges across the Dnieper which are vital to Ukraine's ability to make war in the east. However, those bridges are heavily protected and Russia has not targeted them in > 2 years of war so I do not predict that happening.
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