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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 3/6/23 at 10:03 am to CitizenK
Posted on 3/6/23 at 10:03 am to CitizenK
quote:
hat has been its modus operandi in Africa to own minerals
Same in Syria. Wagner makes about 10 mil a month on oil "liberated" in parts of Syria the govt cant take and/or hold.
0
Posted on 3/6/23 at 10:16 am to Lakeboy7
quote:
They are at the mercy of the Ukrainians. Its a private military not affiliated with a state. For state actors to receive the benefits of the conventions they (their state) have to be a signatory.
Well Ukraine has to capture them before Wagner can be at their mercy.
And if it does ever get to an international court I’m not sure “private military” gets any traction. I read or heard a quote somewhere
“If anyone ever gets convicted of being a mercenary they should be executed right along side their lawyer for his incompetence”
This post was edited on 3/6/23 at 10:17 am
Posted on 3/6/23 at 10:26 am to GeauxxxTigers23
From @wartranslated:
quote:
Update on Bakhmut from the Ukrainian correspondent Yuriy Butusov (LINK
"The situation in Bakhmut
Ukrainian forces hold most of the city, including the center. Although some of our units were withdrawn from the city, this is more a matter of rotation and not a general order to withdraw. A significant number of our troops are still fighting here. There are people and equipment.
The enemy captured the eastern part of the city, up to the Bakhmutka River. The main attack of the Russians is not in the city, but from the north, bypassing the city. The battle is over the supply path that remains. This path is under enemy fire. The enemy is encouraging our troops to withdraw from Bakhmut, as a real threat of encirclement has been created. But the enemy is advancing slowly, and that is why the Ukrainian command is sure that there are still opportunities to hold the escape routes for a while, slowing down the pace of advance and inflicting even more losses on the Russians.
Holding the city for us in conditions of limited communication is not profitable now from the point of view of tactics. This is a matter of strategy - the Ukrainian command will hold the city until the last moment, as always. Unlike Kherson, Balaklia, Izyum, Lyman, and Kupyansk, which the Russians fled from, the Ukrainians are not leaving the city without long resistance.
The enemy is forced to pay dearly, and slowly moves from woodline to woodline, from house to house.
Everyone who fights in the city in unfavorable conditions hopes that the time of this heroic resistance is used to create reliable, well-equipped and camouflaged defense lines to cover Siversk, Chasiv Yar, Kostyantynivka, Druzhkivka, Sloviansk, Kramatorsk, the lines to which these combat-capable troops will be withdrawn in time. These will be reliably entrenched to be able to defeat the enemy.
Ukrainian soldiers demonstrate high combat capability. And where there is effective management, intelligence, organization, support, at least some ammunition for artillery and mortars, the Russians are being defeated there. We have an advantage due to higher quality, more motivated and more resilient people. But war is a clash of two systems, and everything depends not only on soldiers."
Posted on 3/6/23 at 1:25 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
It’s being reported that President Zelensky today has ordered Commanders in Eastern Ukraine to hold Bakhmut and that additional Ukrainian Military Units have been observed being deployed in the direction of the City.
This seems to be a change in the Steady Withdrawal from Bakhmut that I and other Analysts have been hearing about from Sources on the Ground for the last few weeks, however I have no clue what could have warranted this change.
Interestingly, earlier today Zelensky’s Office released a statement that, “Commander-in-Chief Valery Zaluzhny and the Commander of Ukraine’s Ground Forces Oleksandr Syrsky agree that Ukraine should continue Defensive Positions in Bakhmut,” although this contradicts previous reports that Zaluzhny had supported a Full Withdrawal from Bakhmut but that Zelensky and Syrsky had disagreed with him.
LINK
Posted on 3/6/23 at 1:37 pm to StormyMcMan
I think there could be a good chance this is intentional misinformation designed to keep Russia from easing up.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 1:41 pm to Chromdome35
quote:
I think there could be a good chance this is intentional misinformation designed to keep Russia from easing up.
Wishful thinking. Most people have been predicting Ukraine’s withdrawal from Bakhmut for like a month now and it still hasn’t happened. Ukraine has decided that Bakhmut is worth defending it appears. The simplest explanation is usually the correct one.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 1:48 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
It could very well be wishful thinking.
I'm having a hard time understanding Ukraine's desire to continue defending Bakhmut. The city is destroyed, and almost all of the residents have fled. There is various reporting leaking out that Ukraine's casualty rate is very high and concerning.
Maybe it's just a symbolic stance to show they aren't going to easily give up an inch of their country.
I think the next most plausible explanation is that Ukraine views Bakhmut as a place to tie the Russian army up and bleed it as much as possible while Ukraine builds up combat power in the rear areas.
I'm having a hard time understanding Ukraine's desire to continue defending Bakhmut. The city is destroyed, and almost all of the residents have fled. There is various reporting leaking out that Ukraine's casualty rate is very high and concerning.
Maybe it's just a symbolic stance to show they aren't going to easily give up an inch of their country.
I think the next most plausible explanation is that Ukraine views Bakhmut as a place to tie the Russian army up and bleed it as much as possible while Ukraine builds up combat power in the rear areas.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 2:09 pm to Chromdome35
I have no idea. I don’t know what the defensive terrain to the West of Bakhmut looks like. I don’t know what types and caliber or units are being thrown into the defense of Bakhmut. I’m hearing the Ukrainians in Bakhmut are having worse ammunition supply problems than the Russians are.
And while Ukraine may be attempting to bleed the Russians I think the Russians are trying to do the same thing. Using a bunch of convicts and conscripts to tie down and kill as many high quality Ukrainian troops as possible so they can’t prepare for the offensive
And while Ukraine may be attempting to bleed the Russians I think the Russians are trying to do the same thing. Using a bunch of convicts and conscripts to tie down and kill as many high quality Ukrainian troops as possible so they can’t prepare for the offensive
Posted on 3/6/23 at 2:10 pm to Chromdome35
More on continued disruptions in this general region of the world:
Posted on 3/6/23 at 2:11 pm to GOP_Tiger
I'm curious how many troops everyone thinks are still in the Bahkmut salient pictured below?
This equates to about 43km² as calculated below, it doesn't include the extended front on both sides, just the salient itself.
I've seen several figures putting it between 20,000 to 30,000 troops which would mean around 460-700 bodies per square kilometre, which seems a lot of people in a small area considering the devastation and constant artillery fire, is this too high?
This equates to about 43km² as calculated below, it doesn't include the extended front on both sides, just the salient itself.
I've seen several figures putting it between 20,000 to 30,000 troops which would mean around 460-700 bodies per square kilometre, which seems a lot of people in a small area considering the devastation and constant artillery fire, is this too high?
Posted on 3/6/23 at 2:17 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
And while Ukraine may be attempting to bleed the Russians I think the Russians are trying to do the same thing. Using a bunch of convicts and conscripts to tie down and kill as many high quality Ukrainian troops as possible so they can’t prepare for the offensive
My fear as well. And who honestly knows. I think the real question is does Russia really have anything worthwhile in reserve after this batch convicts and conscripts is chewed up, and likewise does Ukraine have capable troops on the sidelines ready to go this spring with its new toys.
I think what Russian troops are going to be asked to do next in coordinating a defense against a Ukrainian offensive will be a more complicated task than banging it’s collectively head against bakhmut, and prisoners and conscripts aren’t going to prove as useful in that task.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 2:22 pm to ned nederlander
i would think that since we are weeks away from an Ukrainian offensive, that ukraine wants to hold the russian troop here, and not allow the troops to be spread out along the front for defense.
if ukraine can keep them focused, then an offense will have a better chance of a break through.
if they fall back, then russia can consolidate the area and redeploy forces.
if ukraine can keep them focused, then an offense will have a better chance of a break through.
if they fall back, then russia can consolidate the area and redeploy forces.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 2:25 pm to OutsideObserver
quote:
I'm curious how many troops everyone thinks are still in the Bahkmut salient pictured below?
quote:
I've seen several figures putting it between 20,000 to 30,000 troops
If true, that is the roughly the equivalent of a corps of two divisions. The destruction of such a force would be catastrophic to Ukraine.
Having said that, I have no idea of those figures are correct or not.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 2:36 pm to Darth_Vader
At the end of the day, we just don't know how many are there until some confirmed reporting emerges (if ever).
Ukraine has done a heck of a job locking down its information space. I understand why they are doing it, they have to keep Russia guessing.
Ukraine has done a heck of a job locking down its information space. I understand why they are doing it, they have to keep Russia guessing.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 2:42 pm to OutsideObserver
quote:
I've seen several figures putting it between 20,000 to 30,000 troops which would mean around 460-700 bodies per square kilometre, which seems a lot of people in a small area considering the devastation and constant artillery fire, is this too high?
I think it’s too many. My guess would be 4-5 battalions of infantry and whatever necessary support units go along with that.
So maybe 5K troops max in that perimeter. Again, just my best guess.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 3:29 pm to Chromdome35
Remember the strategy in Sievierodonesk?
What happened shortly after that?
What happened shortly after that?
Posted on 3/6/23 at 4:54 pm to AU86
President calls operation in Bakhmut direction one of most efficient for destroying enemy
06.03.2023 23:58
Bakhmut direction yields one of the greatest results in the fight against the occupiers during the entire battle for Donbas.
“The occupier kills for the very fact that we are Ukrainians. For the mere word about Ukraine. For our dream of Ukraine. For our lives – the lives of Ukrainians. And we are destroying the occupier everywhere – wherever it yields results for Ukraine. Bakhmut has yielded and is yielding one of the greatest results during this war, during the entire battle for Donbas. And I thank every soldier who is fighting in this most difficult area. Who is fighting for all parts of our country, in all directions,” President of Ukraine Volodymyr Zelensky said in his latest address.
Zelensky noted that the issue of further defense of Bakhmut became the main issue at today's Staff meeting, and the discussion of further actions in Bakhmut direction lasted for more than an hour. According to the President, the Staff unanimously supported the continuation of the defense of the city.
“Today at the Staff meeting, I directly asked both Khortytsia commander, General Syrskyi, and Commander-in-Chief Zaluzhny about their view of the further defense operation in the Bakhmut sector. Either withdrawal or continuation of defense and reinforcement of the city. Both generals replied: do not withdraw and reinforce. And this opinion was unanimously backed by the Staff. There were no other opinions,” the Head of State said.
UKRINFORM
06.03.2023 23:58
Bakhmut direction yields one of the greatest results in the fight against the occupiers during the entire battle for Donbas.
“The occupier kills for the very fact that we are Ukrainians. For the mere word about Ukraine. For our dream of Ukraine. For our lives – the lives of Ukrainians. And we are destroying the occupier everywhere – wherever it yields results for Ukraine. Bakhmut has yielded and is yielding one of the greatest results during this war, during the entire battle for Donbas. And I thank every soldier who is fighting in this most difficult area. Who is fighting for all parts of our country, in all directions,” President of Ukraine Volodymyr Zelensky said in his latest address.
Zelensky noted that the issue of further defense of Bakhmut became the main issue at today's Staff meeting, and the discussion of further actions in Bakhmut direction lasted for more than an hour. According to the President, the Staff unanimously supported the continuation of the defense of the city.
“Today at the Staff meeting, I directly asked both Khortytsia commander, General Syrskyi, and Commander-in-Chief Zaluzhny about their view of the further defense operation in the Bakhmut sector. Either withdrawal or continuation of defense and reinforcement of the city. Both generals replied: do not withdraw and reinforce. And this opinion was unanimously backed by the Staff. There were no other opinions,” the Head of State said.
UKRINFORM
This post was edited on 3/6/23 at 4:57 pm
Posted on 3/6/23 at 5:01 pm to cypher
quote:
Today at the Staff meeting, I directly asked both Khortytsia commander, General Syrskyi, and Commander-in-Chief Zaluzhny about their view of the further defense operation in the Bakhmut sector. Either withdrawal or continuation of defense and reinforcement of the city. Both generals replied: do not withdraw and reinforce. And this opinion was unanimously backed by the Staff. There were no other opinions,” the Head of State said.
Whenever someone (including a nation's leader) suggests that we are being given direct information about the private discussions of military strategists, I assume the information is not accurate.
Posted on 3/6/23 at 5:46 pm to TBoy
quote:
Whenever someone (including a nation's leader) suggests that we are being given direct information about the private discussions of military strategists, I assume the information is not accurate.
For the most part, I find journalists to be real morons except for ability to write. It doesn't matter what their ideology is
Posted on 3/6/23 at 6:26 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
I think it’s too many. My guess would be 4-5 battalions of infantry and whatever necessary support units go along with that.
So maybe 5K troops max in that perimeter. Again, just my best guess.
I saw a Russian source today boasting that they were trapping 10k Ukrainians in a cauldron, so I think it's safe to say that it's less than 10k.
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