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Posted on 12/6/22 at 7:52 am to Athanatos
quote:
It seems so unlikely that this aircraft would be able to cross that much territory without being intercepted. Did they spoof it as a civilian aircraft?
Russian MoD reported they were Low Flying UAVs.... Take it for what its worth, but tactically, makes it harder to track, intercept. Other reports were these are jet uav and not propeller type so faster moving. kina of like a remote piloted cruise missle.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 8:09 am to tigeraddict
I think that everyone agrees now that these were Soviet TU 141 recon drones that were reconfigured as suicide drones. Since there's no previously recorded Ukrainian use in this conflict, it's very likely that Ukraine was able to spoof these as Russian jets (either civilian or military). I also saw a report that Ukraine timed the attack to occur right when there would have been a shift change among Russian air defense troops.
The most likely explanation is that Russian air defense personnel weren't looking for this drone because Ukraine hasn't used a jet-powered drone before, so they just assumed that it was Russian.
Even if Ukraine still has more of these modified Soviet jet drones, I don't think that Ukraine will be able to pull off more of these attacks anytime soon, because Russia will now be looking for them and would shoot them down.
The most likely explanation is that Russian air defense personnel weren't looking for this drone because Ukraine hasn't used a jet-powered drone before, so they just assumed that it was Russian.
Even if Ukraine still has more of these modified Soviet jet drones, I don't think that Ukraine will be able to pull off more of these attacks anytime soon, because Russia will now be looking for them and would shoot them down.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 8:38 am to GOP_Tiger
quote:
I think that everyone agrees now that these were Soviet TU 141 recon drones that were reconfigured as suicide drones.
I haven't seen any confirmation of this. The only mentions have been twitter posts that seem to be pro-russian.
Is there another source?
Posted on 12/6/22 at 8:51 am to LSUPilot07
If I had to bet, those two planes have seen their last flight. No way Russia fixes them
Posted on 12/6/22 at 8:53 am to cypher
I've seen it from pro Ukrainian sources. If I come across them again, I will post the links.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 9:09 am to cypher
quote:
The Russian chain of command will probably seek to identify and impose severe sanctions on Russian officers deemed responsible for allowing the incident.
These icons aren’t polishing themselves, Officers.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 9:25 am to GOP_Tiger
quote:
I think that everyone agrees now that these were Soviet TU 141 recon drones that were reconfigured as suicide drones. Since there's no previously recorded Ukrainian use in this conflict, it's very likely that Ukraine was able to spoof these as Russian jets (either civilian or military). I also saw a report that Ukraine timed the attack to occur right when there would have been a shift change among Russian air defense troops.
Max warhead is 75 kg for these. Maybe it was, maybe it wasn't one of these converted, but Russia claims that to be the case.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 9:34 am to CitizenK
In today's Washington Post: LINK
Support slipping for indefinite U.S. aid to Ukraine, poll finds
Exerpts:
Support slipping for indefinite U.S. aid to Ukraine, poll finds
Exerpts:
quote:
A strong majority of Americans continue to support sending arms and economic aid to Ukraine, according to a poll released Monday. But as the conflict drags into winter, Americans are divided over whether Washington should push Ukraine to reach a negotiated peace as soon as possible.
More than two-thirds of respondents back supplying Ukraine with weapons and economic assistance, and about three-quarters support accepting Ukrainian refugees and sanctioning Russia, according to the survey conducted by the Chicago Council on Global Affairs last month.
While support among the American public for assistance to Ukraine remains robust, Republican backing for aid to Ukraine has slipped since the spring, with 55 percent of Republicans saying they support sending military aid, compared with 68 percent in July and 80 percent in March. Half of Republicans favored providing economic assistance to Ukraine last month, compared with roughly three-quarters in March, according to the Chicago Council’s findings.
quote:
With Russia’s war in Ukraine in its 10th month, and no end in sight, Americans are split over whether Washington should urge Ukraine to reach a peace settlement with Russia imminently, the survey found. A plurality — 40 percent — said the United States should continue its current levels of support to Ukraine indefinitely. Fifty-three percent of Democrats favor this approach. In July, however, 58 percent of American respondents said the United States should help Ukraine for as long as it takes, even if that meant higher gas and food prices for American consumers. Now, 47 percent say Washington should push Kyiv to reach a peace settlement soon.
quote:
Americans held differing perceptions of which side has the upper hand, the Chicago Council survey found. Around a third of Democrats say Ukraine has the advantage, compared with 23 percent of Republicans and 22 percent of independents. Overall, 46 percent of respondents think neither Ukraine nor Russia has the advantage.
“If people think that Ukraine has the upper hand, they’re much more supportive of continuing aid to Ukraine,” said Dina Smeltz, one of the researchers.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 9:34 am to CitizenK
Meanwhile on the poliboard
quote:
Do you realize this would all be over a long time ago if the USA hadn't stepped in. The vast majority of people that have died would have been avoided.
Their blood is the result of NATO.
Also your side keeps arguing that Russia invaded . But the invaded because the USA went back on their agreement with Russia and kept on expanding NATO eastward for decades before Russia had enough.
So the USA is ultimately the root cause of ever death in this war.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 9:40 am to Obtuse1
Russians are quickly running out of Ka-52 attack helicopters. 1/3rd of the their fleet is gone.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 9:45 am to GOP_Tiger
quote:
A strong majority of Americans continue to support sending arms and economic aid to Ukraine, according to a poll released Monday. But as the conflict drags into winter, Americans are divided over whether Washington should push Ukraine to reach a negotiated peace as soon as possible.
F this! Imagine Europe stepping in and telling us we should just "give up" Arizona and New Mexico to our neighbors down South simply to appease a tyrant. Ukraine has every right to defend their territorial integrity. And the USA should assist because it is in our interests to have the 8th largest producer of grain solidly on Western society's side.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 9:55 am to Tigeralum2008
quote:
F this!
any "peace" that rewards Russia with territory captured, will only result in Russia repeating an invasion down the road. Russia would love nothing more than a pause to re-organize and regroup while holding territory.
hell, i believe the appearance to "talk" is hopeful in buying time.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 10:07 am to cypher
quote:
I haven't seen any confirmation of this. The only mentions have been twitter posts that seem to be pro-russian.
Listen to the sound in this video. If it's accurate, then you clearly hear the sound of a jet engine before the explosion. That would tend to confirm the ID as a TU 141 drone.
LINK
Posted on 12/6/22 at 12:35 pm to Obtuse1
quote:
The Herks seemed like a Toyota Hilux as in it was going to keep flying no matter how many parts it lost.
Can confirm
Posted on 12/6/22 at 12:44 pm to GOP_Tiger
Also this:
LINK
LINK
quote:
Also the time & sound between sighting on the video and impact, indicated a speed of this drone. Now after more analysis of the satellite imagery reveals that the 2 parts which can be seen, together measure around 14 meters which is exactly the lenght of the TU-141
Posted on 12/6/22 at 1:10 pm to WestCoastAg
Incredible how lost that segment of Americana has become- and I’m not referring to the poliboard in a vacuum.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 1:38 pm to GOP_Tiger
Posted on 12/6/22 at 1:57 pm to Highthoughts
quote:
Incredible how lost that segment of Americana has become- and I’m not referring to the poliboard in a vacuum.
There's a blog called Moon of Alabama that I've seen cited on the poliboard and elsewhere. It's not only aggressively pro-Russia, but pro-China, Cuba and Venezuela as well. Bizarro world that people who call themselves conservative make common cause with the likes of it.
The Russian military may suck, but Russia is very good at information warfare. It's not enough to turn the tide by itself, but it's definitely having an effect in the west.
Posted on 12/6/22 at 3:18 pm to Jim Rockford
quote:
There's a blog called Moon of Alabama that I've seen cited on the poliboard and elsewhere. It's not only aggressively pro-Russia, but pro-China, Cuba and Venezuela as well. Bizarro world that people who call themselves conservative make common cause with the likes of it.
The roots of that website are the Whisky Bar of blogger Billmon one of the founders of Daily Kos
This says it all they are far leftists and don't even know it
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