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re: Has the Shroud of Turin been proven authentic?

Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:14 am to
Posted by Darth_Vader
A galaxy far, far away
Member since Dec 2011
74660 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:14 am to
quote:

SCIENCE dates the relic from 1260-1390 AD, proves the image is anatomically incorrect, proves the image is incorrectly undistorted, and detects ochre and tempera paint residue on the cloth.



Everything you posted has been proven false by science. My question still stands. Why do you hate science, Rex?
Posted by YouAre8Up
in a house
Member since Mar 2011
12792 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:22 am to
quote:

Jesus told Jessie Duplantis that it's a forgery


Posted by Slippy
Across the rivah
Member since Aug 2005
7845 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:37 am to
How very sad that we live in a world that no longer has room for the supernatural, where the cold, dark, dying or dead material world is all we get.

I really don't like this world.
Posted by Mohican
Member since Nov 2012
7133 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:38 am to
quote:

- No wraparound distortion as would be expected by an authentic burial shroud



I am not an expert on burials in the 1st century or the 12th, 13th centuries, but just by looking at the shroud it appears it was folded rectangularly by the creases in the shroud itself. If they folded it in this manner there shouldn't be any wraparound distortion. It appears they did not wrap it like a mummy but folded it.

quote:

- Anatomically incorrect head, arms, legs, torso to the point that a man of those proportions would be considered freakish if he actually existed.


Rigor mortis is seen in the stiffness of the extremities, the retraction of the thumbs and the distension of the feet. It has frozen an attitude of death while hanging by the arms; the rib cage is abnormally expanded, the large pectoral muscles are in an attitude of extreme inspiration. [ William Meacham, The Rape of the Shroud, 2005, p. 4.]

Rigor mortis could have played a roll in the proportions of the image, especially considering the dead weight of the body would have been hanging by the arms.



quote:

This sixteenthcentury painting by Giovanni Battista shows how the body could have been wrapped
in a burial shroud in a position that would match the image on the Shroud of Turin



Keep in mind that the research says the image is not a contact image. Therefore, the position of the body in relation to the shroud would effect the proportions of the image. In some cases, the body would have been up to 2 inches away from the shroud where the image was formed, according to the link.

I'm not saying this explains your questions, only that there may be an explanation.
Posted by LucasP
Member since Apr 2012
21618 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:39 am to
I'm not reading all this shite, did anybody change anyone else's mind yet? Or does everyone have the exact same opinion that they did when they started?
Posted by MontyFranklyn
T-Town
Member since Jan 2012
24301 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:52 am to
I'm still trying to figure out the argument. Are people saying it is Jesus or just a guy from the biblical times?
Posted by LucasP
Member since Apr 2012
21618 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:54 am to
I kinda gleamed the whole thing. I think one guy is arguing that it isn't actually a shroud.
Posted by rickyh
Positiger Nation
Member since Dec 2003
13191 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 11:46 am to
Great read. Thanks for posting. I seriously doubt that the non believers making snide remarks actually took time to read. The proof stands on it's own. The history of the burial cloth dates back to the time of Christ.
Posted by MontyFranklyn
T-Town
Member since Jan 2012
24301 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 11:52 am to
No matter what it is it definitely wasn't wrapped around Jesus
Posted by Thorny
Montgomery, AL
Member since May 2008
2300 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 11:59 am to
quote:

- Anatomically incorrect head, arms, legs, torso to the point that a man of those proportions would be considered freakish if he actually existed.


Why would a fake have been painted using such freakish distortions?

I can't explain them, but if I were creating a fake, I certainly wouldn't have included them.
Posted by Rex
Here, there, and nowhere
Member since Sep 2004
66001 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:02 pm to
Because he was a bad portrait artist and because he didn't wish to portray Jesus's private parts.
Posted by Thorny
Montgomery, AL
Member since May 2008
2300 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:08 pm to
quote:

Because he was a bad portrait artist and because he didn't wish to portray Jesus's private parts


So, your argument on this point is that an artist skilled enough to create an image that has investigatory scientists wondering how he did it was was also incompetent enough to not get the body dimensions right. Got it.

Posted by taylork37
Member since Mar 2010
15919 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:11 pm to
quote:

Everything you posted has been proven false by science. My question still stands. Why do you hate science, Rex?


Holy deflection batman.
Posted by Rex
Here, there, and nowhere
Member since Sep 2004
66001 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:13 pm to
One really has to ask oneself why if this alleged shroud is part of Jesus's plan of revelation it fails to convince the great majority of the world, and why such relics and apparitions, etc., typically occur in places of this world that are already devoutly Christian.
Posted by Rex
Here, there, and nowhere
Member since Sep 2004
66001 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:18 pm to
We don't have to know the exact method he did it. The fact of the matter is that similar images have been reproduced by other methods, any of which might have been the actual employed. We can CLEARLY see, however, that the maker was a bad portrait artist.
Posted by OLDBEACHCOMBER
Member since Jan 2004
7620 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:19 pm to
quote:

It's been proven to be a hoax.


No
Posted by Chucktown_Badger
The banks of the Ashley River
Member since May 2013
37599 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:20 pm to
It's weird that the image in the shroud reflects what the western world wants him to have looked like. It does not at all match what he most likely really looked like.



Also, for those that say the piece that was carbon dated was pulled from an area that was repaired, why would they be so dumb as to pull a sample from a non-original portion of the shroud?
Posted by The First Cut
Member since Apr 2012
14817 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:28 pm to
quote:

why would they be so dumb as to pull a sample from a non-original portion of the shroud?


The repair area is visible only under a microscope, you can find that information with a quick search.

What does the west "want" Jesus to look like and how is that different than what a Jewish person looks like?
Posted by Mo Jeaux
Member since Aug 2008
64587 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:30 pm to
quote:

No


Yes.
Posted by GeorgeTheGreek
Sparta, Greece
Member since Mar 2008
69577 posts
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:34 pm to
Rex, you sure are mad...
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