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Started By
Message
Frustrated by insecure bosses
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:16 pm
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:16 pm
All - I manage an industrial maintenance department and have come across a constant stream of bosses that reject ideas solely because they are not their own. It is frustrating to see things vividly that need to be done, realize I can help, offer to help (and they can even take all the credit and say it was their idea, I don't care), then get shut down, then watch us fail at yet another thing. And I don't do this often, so I just try to pitch an idea when it's clear it will solve a big problem and full confidence it can get done.
Meanwhile the way I run my department is it is my expectation and our culture that information and ideas trickle from the bottom up to me. I make the final decision and that is respected, but I frequently get pitched ideas and then empower my guys to make it happen, ensuring they are supported. I do not possess a requirement that our improvement path all comes from my ideas.
Just a string of bad luck or is this the norm? Because if so this is pretty sickening. I'm 42, so mid-career, and being boxed out by guys solely on the basis of their insecurity is discouraging. I do find that they readily take inputs from the finance guys, basically their MBA army, even though I have an MBA from a top 25 school. Maybe it's just the low view of maintenance that we're they're to fix what's broken and not participate in the formation of strategy or solving of interdisciplinary problems.
The end result is we regularly fail at projects run by finance guys who do not scope the work in a way that collects inputs from any technically oriented personnel.
Meanwhile the way I run my department is it is my expectation and our culture that information and ideas trickle from the bottom up to me. I make the final decision and that is respected, but I frequently get pitched ideas and then empower my guys to make it happen, ensuring they are supported. I do not possess a requirement that our improvement path all comes from my ideas.
Just a string of bad luck or is this the norm? Because if so this is pretty sickening. I'm 42, so mid-career, and being boxed out by guys solely on the basis of their insecurity is discouraging. I do find that they readily take inputs from the finance guys, basically their MBA army, even though I have an MBA from a top 25 school. Maybe it's just the low view of maintenance that we're they're to fix what's broken and not participate in the formation of strategy or solving of interdisciplinary problems.
The end result is we regularly fail at projects run by finance guys who do not scope the work in a way that collects inputs from any technically oriented personnel.
15
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:18 pm to Browncd81
quote:
a constant stream of bosses that reject ideas solely because they are not their own
You should frick all their wives
That's an idea that isn't their own
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:19 pm to Browncd81
quote:
The end result is we regularly fail at projects run by finance guys who do not scope the work in a way that collects inputs from any technically oriented personnel.
Get used to it. That’s everywhere.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:19 pm to Browncd81
Go around them.
Business is business
Business is business
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:21 pm to Browncd81
Welcome to Boeing. Now ran by accountants and not engineers
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:21 pm to Browncd81
quote:
The end result is we regularly fail at projects run by finance guys who do not scope the work in a way that collects inputs from any technically oriented personnel.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:21 pm to Browncd81
PIIHB
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:21 pm to Browncd81
Learn psychology to make these insecure idiots think things were their idea when you were the one who came up with it.
I’d rather have shite done right than be jockeying for credit for it.
I’d rather have shite done right than be jockeying for credit for it.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:24 pm to teke184
quote:
Learn psychology to make these insecure idiots think things were their idea when you were the one who came up with it.
I’d rather have shite done right than be jockeying for credit for it.
Agreed, and I'm not worrying about jockeying for credit, just haven't learned how fully to pitch it to them. In some cases it is issues this is the first time they're even being made aware of
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:24 pm to Browncd81
move on! I was in that situation and stuck around for 5 years being an ignored underling. I finally got the balls to make a move and in 6 months have moved further up in my new company than I ever did in 5 years at my old one. What your describing is an old school was of management...but there are people out there doing it differently and the correct way.
Find a place where people are gonna listen to your ideas.
Find a place where people are gonna listen to your ideas.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:25 pm to Tshiz
void
This post was edited on 5/13/23 at 11:24 am
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:27 pm to Browncd81
quote:
Maybe it's just the low view of maintenance that we're they're to fix what's broken and not participate in the formation of strategy or solving of interdisciplinary problems.
Well yeah!
quote:
The end result is we regularly fail at projects run by finance guys
The worst. They should listen to maintenance people.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:33 pm to Browncd81
quote:
Maybe it's just the low view of maintenance that we're they're to fix what's broken and not participate in the formation of strategy or solving of interdisciplinary problems.
See, you figured it out. Just fix the light that's burned out and get the toilet in the men's room to quit running. We're dealing with issues likley beyond your scope of understanding so just stay in your lane, monkey boy. Thanks.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:38 pm to Browncd81
It’s easier to get forgiveness than permission. Take the reins and ride that horse to the finish line. Jobs are like busses, there’s always another one coming.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:43 pm to kywildcatfanone
quote:
Now ran by accountants and not engineers
As an accountant
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:52 pm to Browncd81
quote:
we regularly fail at projects run by finance guys who do not scope the work in a way that collects inputs from any technically oriented personnel.
welcome to engineering
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:54 pm to tigerinthebueche
quote:
See, you figured it out. Just fix the light that's burned out and get the toilet in the men's room to quit running. We're dealing with issues likley beyond your scope of understanding so just stay in your lane, monkey boy. Thanks.
Ha.
The latest was a 120,000sq ft warehouse that needed a roof change and they needed to put PV panels on. I told them many times, figure out what loading will be on the roof - PV, suspended fire protection system, lighting, electrical raceway/cabling, etc and then get a structural engineer to review the perlins, then change the roof accordingly.
Instead they changed the roof like-in-kind since it was cheaper and because technical people aren't backed by any support. Then they brought in a structural engineer who told them the roof is not strong enough to support the added weight of PV.
What's idiotic is the roof change could've been claimed in the solar credits, defraying roof costs, which would've more than made up the difference in reinforcing the roof. Now that we can't put PV on the roof we also don't get to deduct some of the few million spent on the roof.
I think the "high fliers" need to stay in their lane and let real men do technical projects.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:56 pm to Browncd81
quote:
In some cases it is issues this is the first time they're even being made aware of
Either fix it and then tell them you did or if that’ll get you in the frying pan. Tell them about the issue and don’t offer a solution until asked.
Posted on 5/10/23 at 4:56 pm to Oilfieldbiology
quote:quote:The worst. They should listen to maintenance people.
The end result is we regularly fail at projects run by finance guys
I
ed
Posted on 5/10/23 at 5:02 pm to Browncd81
I suggest Jocko Willinck's " Extreme Ownership."
Learning how to manage up and across and get them to execute the "good" plan (not the best, which may be yours) is paramount. If it's just your plan, everyone will shite on it. If it's their plan (maybe with a suggestion or two from you) how likely are they to submarine it?
There is never a reason to mention your MBA in industrial maintenance. This may be a reason why they hate you. I hope you only added that for OT perspective, but you clearly didn't graduate from Harvard, otherwise you would have told us.
Boil everything down to saving/making money, time, and shipping product. Nobody has a leg to stand on (except safety and paying workers.)
Start keeping a log of failure costs due to shitty non operational ideas, and the list of things you proposed prior to said failures and the expected cost/time impact. Use in annual review.
If your HQ is in Europe or similar, it may not help, but if you're a non-global shop, eventually someone will notice that they make a bigger margin if they listened to you a couple of times.
Learning how to manage up and across and get them to execute the "good" plan (not the best, which may be yours) is paramount. If it's just your plan, everyone will shite on it. If it's their plan (maybe with a suggestion or two from you) how likely are they to submarine it?
There is never a reason to mention your MBA in industrial maintenance. This may be a reason why they hate you. I hope you only added that for OT perspective, but you clearly didn't graduate from Harvard, otherwise you would have told us
. Boil everything down to saving/making money, time, and shipping product. Nobody has a leg to stand on (except safety and paying workers.)
Start keeping a log of failure costs due to shitty non operational ideas, and the list of things you proposed prior to said failures and the expected cost/time impact. Use in annual review.
If your HQ is in Europe or similar, it may not help, but if you're a non-global shop, eventually someone will notice that they make a bigger margin if they listened to you a couple of times.
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