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re: Fact or Fiction: The true reason behind the Monument Removal
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:03 pm to slackster
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:03 pm to slackster
quote:
but none of these "statue supporters" really care about the statues as symbols to honor their history either.
I disagree.
Saying that they support the statues remaining because they support white supremacy is just dishonest. Many people in the south are tired of being told that they're just a bunch of toothless, racist, backwoods rednecks by society at large. They're always a target or the villain of media outlets and pundits so I can certainly see how this is a sore subject. Many people don't understand that statues of Lee have been a representation of having some pride and honor even in defeat. When you start deeming that as no different than Hitler (which of whom many a southerner deemed evil and fought and died to defeat), then it really feels as though there is an all out attack to shame and erase their identity.
1
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:03 pm to volod
OP : why don't black seem to erect statues of Martin Luther King or Rosa Parks or any other leaders in major cities?
They seem more interested in tearing down history than creating their own.
They seem more interested in tearing down history than creating their own.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:07 pm to Epic Cajun
quote:
It's all about a win for the leftists. What's their end game? Will their lives change if there are no more statues?
This is merely the foot in the door that they need to start going after other historical figures. Some of these people just want to have a cause to fight for so they can feel relevant and have their "60's moment" and others legitimately want to destroy the foundation of the country in the name of "anti-racism" to create what they deem as an acceptable government. Unfortunately, there are plenty of slimy politicians that are on board with that plan.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:09 pm to volod
It's been a while now since Landrieu took down the statutes in N.O...at a cost of millions of dollars in public funds...and literally not one thing has happened in either the black community or with regards to the racial dynamics in the city. Nothing has changed. Before Landrieu brought it up, few to no blacks even knew who was a Confederate general and where his statute was located.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:12 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
Saying that they support the statues remaining because they support white supremacy is just dishonest.
No argument here, and that wasn't what I was suggesting.
quote:
Many people in the south are tired of being told that they're just a bunch of toothless, racist, backwoods rednecks by society at large. They're always a target or the villain of media outlets and pundits so I can certainly see how this is a sore subject. Many people don't understand that statues of Lee have been a representation of having some pride and honor even in defeat. When you start deeming that as no different than Hitler (which of whom many a southerner deemed evil and fought and died to defeat), then it really feels as though there is an all out attack to shame and erase their identity.
I get all of that, but my argument is that most of the people who feel this way now didn't feel this way a few years ago. If a municipality moved the statues to a museum in the middle of 2010, no one would raise a fuss. The reason people want them removed in 2017 is what has brought to life all of these ardent statue supporters.
I think many/most of the arguments from the take em down crowd are dumb. I also think the arguments in support of the statues are seldom genuine.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:16 pm to SlapahoeTribe
quote:
Just like I explained in another thread - the time that most of these monuments were erected coincided with the dying off of the last of the veterans and their children wanted to honor/remember them. It is the exact same reason the national WWII memorial was dedicated until 2004; people didn't think about it because ma and pa were still around.
Bingo. Was looking for this exact post. Volod is a retarded country bumpkin fricktard.
Do some basic math based on avg life expectancy, Stupid OP.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:19 pm to slackster
quote:
I get all of that, but my argument is that most of the people who feel this way now didn't feel this way a few years ago. If a municipality moved the statues to a museum in the middle of 2010, no one would raise a fuss. The reason people want them removed in 2017 is what has brought to life all of these ardent statue supporters.
I completely disagree with that. These have always been as I described, but we haven't seen an all out assault like this before. Actually, 2010 probably would've been worse since Obama was in office. I'm not even sure that this would be going on in Hillary was elected. This statue nonsense has far more to do with a Trump presidency than it does with "removing racist statues". They're fighting a virtually non-existent enemy because it makes them feel like they're doing something with their empty, miserable lives. They hate Trump so much that they'll set the world ablaze to make themselves feel better, but the irony of the situation is that this behavior and these tactics are the exact reason he was elected.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:20 pm to Jimmy2shoes
How many British Revolutionary War hero statues are there in Boston? DC?
What about the heritage of the loyalists?
What about the heritage of the loyalists?
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:24 pm to volod
It is being used to create racial tension and partisanship and also to take the focus off the good works that Trump is doing.
I am not really Trump guy but I do think that he is getting screwed. No other President in history has been treated this way and I think this is going to become the norm for non-democrat Presidents in the future
I am not really Trump guy but I do think that he is getting screwed. No other President in history has been treated this way and I think this is going to become the norm for non-democrat Presidents in the future
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:25 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
I completely disagree with that. These have always been as I described, but we haven't seen an all out assault like this before
Perhaps you're right, I just don't see it that way.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:26 pm to slackster
quote:
slackster
Just out of curiosity, where did you grow up?
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:28 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
Just out of curiosity, where did you grow up?
South Louisiana.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:29 pm to volod
quote:
If the purpose was for intimidation, it failed to stop the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Act (although it did possibly set things back by decades).
I think 50-60 years out 1910 you have sons and daughters groups and you are losing the last of the civil war vets so that might play with it
if you look at when all the Southern States added star and bars to flag you got a yeah that is racist
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:32 pm to slackster
quote:
South Louisiana.
Gotcha. Some of the interpretations may depend on geographical location or maybe how you see things during your formative years.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:33 pm to MontyFranklyn
quote:
You can start by going into your local housing project community and telling it like it is to all the lazy black people you loathe.
Now that's actually racist you pig. At least wait until they wake up.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:33 pm to thelawnwranglers
quote:
if you look at when all the Southern States added star and bars to flag you got a yeah that is racist
I've often said that I'll concede to removing statues that were erected as a resistance to the civil rights act.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:34 pm to volod
It's happening because it serves two purposes for the left.
1. It creates strife, controversy, and tension between groups of people, which the left can point to, and say "see, if we had elected our candidate for president, we'd all be loving our country and each other," just like we did when Obamalama was elected. As proof, note how many Confederate statues were removed/destroyed under Obama. Hell, Jeh Johnson Obama's Homeland Security director, just said the statue removal is a Homeland Security issue. Then why didn't he do it?
2. It serves the left's slow, steady incremental goals of destroying this country, it's foundations, and all it has stood for since it's inception. Think about it. If all vestiges of the Confederacy must be destroyed, disrespected, demeaned, and shunned because of their stance and belief, then the founders must be shunned, and their works destroyed eventually also. These people were slave owners! We must rid ourselves of that pesky Constitution and Bill of Rights!
1. It creates strife, controversy, and tension between groups of people, which the left can point to, and say "see, if we had elected our candidate for president, we'd all be loving our country and each other," just like we did when Obamalama was elected. As proof, note how many Confederate statues were removed/destroyed under Obama. Hell, Jeh Johnson Obama's Homeland Security director, just said the statue removal is a Homeland Security issue. Then why didn't he do it?
2. It serves the left's slow, steady incremental goals of destroying this country, it's foundations, and all it has stood for since it's inception. Think about it. If all vestiges of the Confederacy must be destroyed, disrespected, demeaned, and shunned because of their stance and belief, then the founders must be shunned, and their works destroyed eventually also. These people were slave owners! We must rid ourselves of that pesky Constitution and Bill of Rights!
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:36 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
Gotcha. Some of the interpretations may depend on geographical location or maybe how you see things during your formative years.
I guess my thing is how many people are so obnoxiously pro/anti statue. I think most of the arguments are intellectually lazy. As I said earlier, the whole thing is asinine.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:36 pm to troyt37
quote:
2. It serves the left's slow, steady incremental goals of destroying this country, it's foundations, and all it has stood for since it's inception. Think about it. If all vestiges of the Confederacy must be destroyed, disrespected, demeaned, and shunned because of their stance and belief, then the founders must be shunned, and their works destroyed eventually also. These people were slave owners! We must rid ourselves of that pesky Constitution and Bill of Rights!
People call me crazy for making that point, but it's an inevitability. These people do not stop.
Posted on 8/21/17 at 12:39 pm to slackster
quote:
I guess my thing is how many people are so obnoxiously pro/anti statue. I think most of the arguments are intellectually lazy. As I said earlier, the whole thing is asinine.
Yeah, I can see that side of it. To me, this is just as good of a place to take a stand as any because the next movement will be just as much as a "moral imperative" as this one and so on and so on.
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