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re: Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19) ***W.H.O. DECLARES A GLOBAL PANDEMIC***
Posted on 6/24/20 at 12:33 pm to KamaCausey_LSU
Posted on 6/24/20 at 12:33 pm to KamaCausey_LSU
quote:
A couple of weeks ago, they reported a couple of studies that showed that asymptomatic people may not retain antibodies. And that they are at risk for reinfection. I think the data came from China, so take it for what you will.
Didn't they finally chalk this up to the initial positive test being a false positive rather than an asymptomatic infection?
1
Posted on 6/24/20 at 12:37 pm to Sasquatch Smash
No, this was a new study from South Korea. Really just looking at antibody levels over time and demonstrated that for most people the levels started to fade after a few months.
Those people who had mild or even no symptoms while being COVID positive saw their antibody levels fall more quickly.
1. Doesn’t mean that people would be reinfected, but certainly could, especially given what we know of other coronaviruses.
2. Says nothing of possible T cell mediated immunity.
Those people who had mild or even no symptoms while being COVID positive saw their antibody levels fall more quickly.
1. Doesn’t mean that people would be reinfected, but certainly could, especially given what we know of other coronaviruses.
2. Says nothing of possible T cell mediated immunity.
Posted on 6/24/20 at 12:41 pm to escatawpabuckeye
quote:
There is no such thing as herd immunity for any other coronavirus known to infect humans. If anything it might be a temporary lull in transmission in a population but could simply mean ubiquitous and likely seasonally predominant transmission - just like the common cold.
It’s also possible that as we develop some form of immune memory re-infection could be a much less severe infection. But who the hell knows?
There is research out there that suggests that the bad 1889-1890 flu pandemic was actually caused by HCoV-OC43, one of the current common cold viruses, as that's when they think it first crossed over into humans.
Posted on 6/24/20 at 12:45 pm to escatawpabuckeye
quote:
No, this was a new study from South Korea. Really just looking at antibody levels over time and demonstrated that for most people the levels started to fade after a few months.
Those people who had mild or even no symptoms while being COVID positive saw their antibody levels fall more quickly.
1. Doesn’t mean that people would be reinfected, but certainly could, especially given what we know of other coronaviruses.
2. Says nothing of possible T cell mediated immunity.
Is this it? Looks like it is out of China.
Definitely no reason to truly panic based on these results, as that is only one level of our immune system, especially considering the data involving T-cells.
Posted on 6/24/20 at 1:42 pm to Sasquatch Smash
quote:
Definitely no reason to truly panic based on these results, as that is only one level of our immune system, especially considering the data involving T-cells.
Agreed, no need to panic. And the odds are probably very small. But it does indicate that there is likely at least some chance of reinfection.
Posted on 6/24/20 at 1:48 pm to Sasquatch Smash
Really? That’s pretty interesting.
I was actually just spit balling the other day about whether this is what it looked like when the other 4 coronaviridae crossed over.
Thanks for that info
I was actually just spit balling the other day about whether this is what it looked like when the other 4 coronaviridae crossed over.
Thanks for that info
Posted on 6/24/20 at 1:54 pm to Sasquatch Smash
Yeah, that’s it. My bad.
Thanks for finding that and correcting me.
It seems like good research all the same
Thanks for finding that and correcting me.
It seems like good research all the same
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:03 pm to escatawpabuckeye
Italian seroprvalence preprint.
From abstract (entire abstract rather):
Pretty short paper.
From abstract (entire abstract rather):
quote:
Castiglione D’Adda is one of the towns earlier and more severely affected by the SARS-CoV-2 epidemic in Lombardy. In a mass screening involving 4174 out of about 4550 total inhabits, significant age-related differences in anti SARS-CoV-2 IgG seroprevalence were found, with the lowest prevalence in the youngest inhabitants
quote:
In conclusion, our findings suggest that IgG seroprevalence for SARS-CoV-2 increases with increasing age and these data suggest a lower susceptibility to infection in the lower age groups.
Pretty short paper.
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:04 pm to escatawpabuckeye
quote:
Really just looking at antibody levels over time and demonstrated that for most people the levels started to fade after a few months
I mean isn't this to be expected? Does anyone expect our immune system to have antibodies floating around for stuff we beat 20 years ago? Our immune system thwarts virus and bacteria all day, every day.
You can take an agar plate, swish it around in the room you are in right now, close it up, throw it in an incubator, come back two days later and it will be growing all kinds of stuff.
I read a paper earlier this year about how people who beat SARS v1, didn't have antibodies, but still had some form of immunity 15 years later. On my phone and don't feel like searching for the paper right now.
ETA: paper from 2017 > T-cell immunity of SARS-CoV: Implications for vaccine development against MERS-CoV
This post was edited on 6/24/20 at 2:21 pm
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:04 pm to escatawpabuckeye
quote:
Really? That’s pretty interesting.
I was actually just spit balling the other day about whether this is what it looked like when the other 4 coronaviridae crossed over.
Thanks for that info
quote:
The 1889–1890 pandemic probably originated in Central Asia (3) and was characterized by malaise, fever, and pronounced central nervous system symptoms (53). A significant increase in case fatality with increasing age was observed. Absolute evidence that an influenza virus was the causative agent of this epidemic was never obtained, due to the lack of tissue samples from that period. However, postepidemic analysis in 1957 of the influenza antibody pattern in sera of people who were 50 to 100 years old indicated that H2N2 influenza antibodies might have originated from the 1889–1890 pandemic (45). However, it is tempting to speculate about an alternative hypothesis, that the 1889–1890 pandemic may have been the result of interspecies transmission of bovine coronaviruses to humans, resulting in the subsequent emergence of HCoV-OC43. The dating of the most recent common ancestor of BCoV and HCoV-OC43 to around 1890 is one argument. Another argument is the fact that central nervous system symptoms were more pronounced during the 1889–1890 epidemic than in other influenza outbreaks. It has been shown that HCoV-OC43 has neurotropism and can be neuroinvasive
Here's the paper if you want to peruse it.
Edit: I bolded the nervous system stuff as that's the indicator they are using to connect that virus to the 1889-90 flu pandemic.
This post was edited on 6/24/20 at 2:19 pm
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:09 pm to Sasquatch Smash
Just got a txt from a co-worker. A former co-worker (still in our org, but had moved to another dept) passed away from COVID today. She was 52.
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:11 pm to Ronaldo Burgundiaz
quote:
I mean isn't this to be expected? Does anyone expect our immune system to have antibodies floating around for stuff we beat 20 years ago? Our immune system thwarts virus and bacteria all day, every day.
Memory T-cells FTW.
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:12 pm to Ronaldo Burgundiaz
Sure, of course that’s right.
It’s really only noteworthy in the context of trying to predict Covid 19s behavior in relation to its fellow coronaviruses.
Obviously you can be reinfected with the 4 most common coronaviruses again and again. It may also be so with Covid 19.
But that’s what makes the 1889 flu pandemic speculation so fascinating.
Perhaps what we’re witnessing is Covid establishing itself in the population and several years from now it will just be a fifth coronavirus known to cause common cold. Who knows but curious to speculate
It’s really only noteworthy in the context of trying to predict Covid 19s behavior in relation to its fellow coronaviruses.
Obviously you can be reinfected with the 4 most common coronaviruses again and again. It may also be so with Covid 19.
But that’s what makes the 1889 flu pandemic speculation so fascinating.
Perhaps what we’re witnessing is Covid establishing itself in the population and several years from now it will just be a fifth coronavirus known to cause common cold. Who knows but curious to speculate
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:22 pm to escatawpabuckeye
quote:
Perhaps what we’re witnessing is Covid establishing itself in the population and several years from now it will just be a fifth coronavirus known to cause common cold. Who knows but curious to speculate
Yep.
From the HCoV-OC43 Wiki:
quote:
Along with HCoV-229E, a species in the genus Alphacoronavirus, HCoV-OC43 are among the known viruses that cause the common cold. Both viruses can cause severe lower respiratory tract infections, including pneumonia in infants, the elderly, and immunocompromised individuals such as those undergoing chemotherapy and those with HIV/AIDS.
Those viruses are still somewhat deadly today.
This post was edited on 6/24/20 at 2:25 pm
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:26 pm to escatawpabuckeye
quote:I am fully expecting this.
Perhaps what we’re witnessing is Covid establishing itself in the population and several years from now it will just be a fifth coronavirus known to cause common cold
Even the common cold human coronaviruses are hard on the elderly.
See 2018 paper about a nursing home in Louisiana that had a coronavirus NL63 outbreak that hospitalized 6 of 20 residents and killed 3 of the 20: Severe Respiratory Illness Outbreak Associated With Human Coronavirus NL63 in a Long-Term Care Facility
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:32 pm to Ronaldo Burgundiaz
From a 2007 paper:
Probably what SARS 2.0 will end up being in the long-term, though we aren't necessarily seeing it in young children.
quote:
HCoV-NL63 and HCoV-HKU1 were identified shortly after the SARS-CoV outbreak. The 4 human coronaviruses HCoV-229E, HCoVOC43, HCoV-NL63 and HCoV-HKU1 cause mild respiratory illnesses when compared to SARS, but these infections are involved in 10 – 20 % of hospitalizations of young children and immunocompromised adults with respiratory tract illness.
Probably what SARS 2.0 will end up being in the long-term, though we aren't necessarily seeing it in young children.
This post was edited on 6/24/20 at 2:34 pm
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:32 pm to Ronaldo Burgundiaz
That’s good stuff.
It really does suck to have to deal with it in the moment but it really can’t be argued that there is no better time in human history to be alive trying to deal with something like this.
I wish it wasn’t so damned politicized in this country but C’est la vie
It really does suck to have to deal with it in the moment but it really can’t be argued that there is no better time in human history to be alive trying to deal with something like this.
I wish it wasn’t so damned politicized in this country but C’est la vie
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:50 pm to escatawpabuckeye
Mounting evidence that Covid can cause Type I diabetes even in otherwise asymptomatic individuals LINK
Posted on 6/24/20 at 2:50 pm to Jim Rockford
quote:
Mounting evidence that Covid can cause Type I diabetes even in otherwise asymptomatic individuals
Posted on 6/24/20 at 3:44 pm to Jim Rockford
quote:
Mounting evidence that Covid can cause Type I diabetes even in otherwise asymptomatic individuals
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