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Message
re: Another math problem for the OT to attack
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:02 pm to brgfather129
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:02 pm to brgfather129
quote:
You're out of your element...I suggest you start with researching what "Common Core" is.
I didn't realize that they're focusing on this "doubles principle" or whatever it is. Otherwise, what part am I missing?
0
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:04 pm to Chad504boy
quote:
they want kids to have a strong doubles foundation
Yes, memorizing is bad... unless it is doubles. Memorize those... then use that memorization to problem solve others.
But don't memorize 4+5 because memorization is bad. Its craziness.
in my kids school the fourth grade teachers are having a tizzy with getting the kids to do long division and the like because they don't have 0-10 multiplication down quickly. They use their problem solving techniques that take forever and by then are lost in the problem.
I understand common core and the benefits of conceptual understanding. But the kids need to know 6*3 = 18 without thinking too. Cant always use base 10 and double friends or draw fricking number lines.
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:10 pm to igoringa
i don't know why people get so upset with the change when this country, on average, is embarrassingly bad at math. While in school I assisted with some courses and in the math learning center to make some extra money.
Students, not even just freshman, were legitimately scared of math were just like "i can't ever figure this out" because they would focus on memorization and not problem solving techniques / methods. That is all math is, patterns, simplification and problem solving, I start at point A, I need to get to point B, what methods do i have in my knowledge base to get there.
I'm not very well versed in common core, but i really don't see how a change in the philosophy is a bad thing given how shitty most Americans are at basic math.
Students, not even just freshman, were legitimately scared of math were just like "i can't ever figure this out" because they would focus on memorization and not problem solving techniques / methods. That is all math is, patterns, simplification and problem solving, I start at point A, I need to get to point B, what methods do i have in my knowledge base to get there.
I'm not very well versed in common core, but i really don't see how a change in the philosophy is a bad thing given how shitty most Americans are at basic math.
This post was edited on 9/29/16 at 5:11 pm
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:12 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
We used simple memorization. We know that 5+4=9. But kids these days are understanding WHY 5+4=9, and that's not a bad thing at all. It's just different than what we learned, so everybody freaks the frick out about it.
How does breaking it down to double facts which are memorized make it beyond memorizing 4+5=9.
Put another way, the kids are not taught per se why 4+4=8 (beyond how it could be visually shown for 4+5). They are told to memorize doubles and use doubles to solve. So unless you are arguing they understand better because a memorized fact (4+4)= 8 plus one (8+1) is more instructional then a memorized fact (4+5).
Don't get me wrong, I want the kids to learn the concepts and why things are the way they are... but what I am observing in schools is the pendulum is fully that way and they are not able to deploy the basic addition/subtraction/multiplication facts quick enough in more advance problems in 3,4,5 grades.
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:18 pm to Sneaky__Sally
quote:
That is all math is, patterns, simplification and problem solving, I start at point A, I need to get to point B, what methods do i have in my knowledge base to get there.
I don't disagree at all, but there needs to be a base of facts to go along with those methods. Forcing methods for those basic facts (instead of using the facts to illustrate for example) is my issue.
4+5 = 9. Kids should be able to just spit that out. And kids should be taught to break that down and show how it got there. Both.
What I see and hear is that the basic facts are not being learned and techniques are being deployed for them at grades it should be known. Those techniques will be helpful in later more advanced course, but a fourth grade should know for example, that 6*4 = 24 without having to apply 'strategies'. She should also be able to derive strategies from that for future application - both.
I'm not very well versed in common core, but i really don't see how a change in the philosophy is a bad thing given how shitty most Americans are at basic math.
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:47 pm to Rouge
They want you to break 5 into 1+4. It's supposed to help kids solve problems more easily by using easier to add numbers. Dumb I know, but that is the rational.
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:47 pm to Rouge
What is Potato?
Posted on 9/29/16 at 5:50 pm to Rouge
undefined...because this shite doesnt exist
Posted on 9/29/16 at 6:05 pm to Oddibe
quote:My ten year old brought work home requiring him to "estimate". Here was the problem:
I remember when my kids where taught to "estimate"..they were like...this is stupid, I know the answer so why do I just have to get close?
Provide an estimate of these three numbers added together:
349
347
304
The "estimate" is 350+350+300 = 1000
THE ACTUAL NUMBER IS 1000.
How fricking stupid is this? Instead of just adding the existing numbers together in one single step, first, you must round up or down three numbers, then add them together to get the "estimated number" number.
Since they use numbers that come out the same, they then tell the kids, "See how useful rounding can be!"
Posted on 9/29/16 at 6:23 pm to brgfather129
Why do you always act like this in math threads without offering anything constructive. 
Posted on 9/29/16 at 6:25 pm to Rouge
Are they just trying to say what else equal 9?
2+2+5=9
4+5=9?
2+2+5=9
4+5=9?
Posted on 9/29/16 at 6:30 pm to Oddibe
Using the Common Core method for simple arithmetic is stupid. If you can't eyeball 4 + 5, or even 14 + 25, you're in trouble.
I can see three digit by two digit multiplication. But if it's that basic, there's no value in making it messy.
I can see three digit by two digit multiplication. But if it's that basic, there's no value in making it messy.
Posted on 9/29/16 at 6:36 pm to Rouge
YOu're using doubles facts to get to that answer.
4 + '4' + '1'
Then since your child should know doubles facts
'8' + '1'
= 9
4 + '4' + '1'
Then since your child should know doubles facts
'8' + '1'
= 9
Posted on 9/29/16 at 6:38 pm to brgfather129
quote:
Another math problem for the OT to attack
It's the doubles +/- 1 technique
4+5
4+4+1
8+1
Nothing difficult or challenging about that representation....very effective and has been around for decades.
Agreed. These folks...
Posted on 9/29/16 at 6:57 pm to tiggerthetooth
just had my 9yr old give this a once over, said this was 1st grade level stuff Dad..
here what he said to do...
4+3+2 (the arrow point to the sum of those two numbers)
7+2=9
So, 4+5=9
Posted on 9/29/16 at 7:11 pm to DeathValley85
9
Posted on 9/29/16 at 7:20 pm to Sneaky__Sally
This shite is fricking stupid.
Al the possible combinations of the digits 1 through 9 only total 45 combinations.
You mean to tell me that this silly horse shite is better than just learning those combos?
The problem is stupid teachers because the best and brightest don't teach elementary school math for the most part.
Imagine when this shite is around long enough so that the teachers only know this shite.
Al the possible combinations of the digits 1 through 9 only total 45 combinations.
You mean to tell me that this silly horse shite is better than just learning those combos?
The problem is stupid teachers because the best and brightest don't teach elementary school math for the most part.
Imagine when this shite is around long enough so that the teachers only know this shite.
Posted on 9/29/16 at 7:26 pm to Rouge
13.
Posted on 9/29/16 at 7:26 pm to Rouge
2+2+2+2+1 = 9
Why not just memorize the simple addition, subtraction, multiplication and division tables like it was done in the past.
Why not just memorize the simple addition, subtraction, multiplication and division tables like it was done in the past.
Posted on 9/29/16 at 7:28 pm to Rouge
Seems like schools are trying to teach the Montessori way without knowing how it's really taught.
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