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The problem with nearly every TV Series ever made
Posted by Wasting Time on 10/24/21 at 8:27 pm
31
2I love me some great TV but for all shows that are series in nature(as opposed to episode based), it seems that with very rare exception, they all end up falling victim to Gilligan's Island syndrome.
Namely, they're successful, so they keep wanting new seasons. The problem is, the reason you liked the show in the first place was likely because of some key problem/conflict that you found interesting and enjoyed the journey to potential resolution.
This puts shows in the position of either 1, resolving that key element within 1 or 2 seasons then having to come up with some segway that still works or 2, constantly getting close, then snatching defeat from the jaws of victory
Basically, "oh look, we almost got off the island again.......better luck next season!"
I think that show creators would all do better if they started shows with a defined number of seasons in mind and followed a rational trajectory to land at the end.
Yeah. I know. This goes against, "but we're popular so let's make some more money".
But there's no getting around it. This is why so many shows just end up going off the rails and train wrecking at the end.
Namely, they're successful, so they keep wanting new seasons. The problem is, the reason you liked the show in the first place was likely because of some key problem/conflict that you found interesting and enjoyed the journey to potential resolution.
This puts shows in the position of either 1, resolving that key element within 1 or 2 seasons then having to come up with some segway that still works or 2, constantly getting close, then snatching defeat from the jaws of victory
Basically, "oh look, we almost got off the island again.......better luck next season!"
I think that show creators would all do better if they started shows with a defined number of seasons in mind and followed a rational trajectory to land at the end.
Yeah. I know. This goes against, "but we're popular so let's make some more money".
But there's no getting around it. This is why so many shows just end up going off the rails and train wrecking at the end.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by La Place Mike 
on 10/24/21 at 8:32 pm to Wasting Time
on 10/24/21 at 8:32 pm to Wasting TimeEvery series should be a limited series.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by Wasting Time on 10/24/21 at 8:39 pm to La Place Mike
quote:
Every series should be a limited series.
Yep
They would ALL be sooooooo much better!
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by Jim Rockford on 10/24/21 at 11:31 pm to Wasting Time
on 10/24/21 at 11:31 pm to Wasting TimeMost TV series in the UK are like this. Two or three seasons at most.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by Othello 
on 10/24/21 at 11:39 pm to Wasting Time
on 10/24/21 at 11:39 pm to Wasting TimeAmerican TV shows go on extremely too long and have too many episodes per season.
Also, they put too much effort on shocking season finales which often paint the shows writers in a corner on now to navigate the next season.
Also, they put too much effort on shocking season finales which often paint the shows writers in a corner on now to navigate the next season.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by arcalades on 10/25/21 at 6:27 am to Wasting Time
on 10/25/21 at 6:27 am to Wasting Timeyou glazed right over the only purpose for every series ever made.
however, did Seinfeld have this problem? taxi? cheers after Diane left?
however, did Seinfeld have this problem? taxi? cheers after Diane left?
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by bad93ex 
on 10/25/21 at 6:55 am to La Place Mike
on 10/25/21 at 6:55 am to La Place Mikequote:
Every series should be a limited series.
Then we would have threads of "which TV series deserved more seasons?"
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by LB84 on 10/25/21 at 7:41 am to Wasting Time
quote:
I think that show creators would all do better if they started shows with a defined number of seasons in mind and followed a rational trajectory to land at the end.
Supernatural was planned for 5 seasons. But a channel like CW was desperate for a big flagship program so they kept making up problems for the heroes and riding the money.
If you view the show in the scope of the first 5 seasons it is excellent.
This post was edited on 10/25 at 7:42 am
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by tadman 
on 10/25/21 at 8:09 am to Wasting Time
on 10/25/21 at 8:09 am to Wasting TimeThis was one thing I really liked about Mad Men. There was four phases of Sterling Cooper ownership, extremely good character development, and a very close attention-to-detail regarding the vast cultural changes from 1960 to 1970. There was also a continuously rotating cast apart from the Sterling Cooper management. It made the show significantly different every year to the point it was like a new show every few years.
Contrast that with Cheers, which was a favorite, but there was two abrupt and big cast changes and it was very stale by season 8-9.
Contrast that with Cheers, which was a favorite, but there was two abrupt and big cast changes and it was very stale by season 8-9.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by Midget Death Squad 
on 10/25/21 at 10:58 am to Wasting Time
on 10/25/21 at 10:58 am to Wasting TimeJustified is the perfect example of how to successfully solve this problem. It began and ended perfectly, and they did not try to force it to continue past its natural due date.
I think series need to be 8-12 episodes per season, and they need to have a beginning and ending mapped out before ever filming. They have to stick to the plan regardless of the show's popularity. I would rather roll 4 seasons and be considered one of the greatest ever than roll 9 and become a disgrace. Then again I am not having money thrown at me from all directions, so I certainly could be corrupted by that...
I think series need to be 8-12 episodes per season, and they need to have a beginning and ending mapped out before ever filming. They have to stick to the plan regardless of the show's popularity. I would rather roll 4 seasons and be considered one of the greatest ever than roll 9 and become a disgrace. Then again I am not having money thrown at me from all directions, so I certainly could be corrupted by that...
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re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by paperwasp 
on 10/25/21 at 11:03 am to Wasting Time
on 10/25/21 at 11:03 am to Wasting Timequote:
I think that show creators would all do better if they started shows with a defined number of seasons in mind and followed a rational trajectory to land at the end.
With the timing of the show and the novelty of internet discussions (and podcasts), Lost could have been one of the greatest shows in history if they had done this.
So many mid-run filler episodes with backstories and new introductions, when the core premise was right there waiting to be fleshed out in a much more satisfying way.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by ell_13 
on 10/25/21 at 11:04 am to Wasting Time
on 10/25/21 at 11:04 am to Wasting TimeIt helps when they don't become truly popular until after the fact. The Wire comes to mind. 5 seasons was perfect.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by mizzoubuckeyeiowa on 10/25/21 at 11:36 am to Wasting Time
The Gilligan's Island isn't really apt because their failure to get off the Island was the joke, the show was the shenanigans on the Island.
But I get your point. Of shows painting themselves into a corner like Lost where they treat resolution of the problem too seriously and that becomes the whole focus.
Which is why people loved Mad Men. There was no endgame or wishing for a solution to a problem. It was just a day in the life. There was no winner or loser like Breaking Bad's ethos.
Breaking Bad was dead set on Walter always being so close to 'getting off the Island' only to be foiled by family, friends and the bad guys time and time again and starting over to have more seasons.
Even shows like The Killing designed to have one Season fell into this trap. A show with one premise does this as they want to make more money and then it just becomes soap opera.
I guess the only solution is to have a show about nothing.
But I get your point. Of shows painting themselves into a corner like Lost where they treat resolution of the problem too seriously and that becomes the whole focus.
Which is why people loved Mad Men. There was no endgame or wishing for a solution to a problem. It was just a day in the life. There was no winner or loser like Breaking Bad's ethos.
Breaking Bad was dead set on Walter always being so close to 'getting off the Island' only to be foiled by family, friends and the bad guys time and time again and starting over to have more seasons.
Even shows like The Killing designed to have one Season fell into this trap. A show with one premise does this as they want to make more money and then it just becomes soap opera.
I guess the only solution is to have a show about nothing.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by Hoodie on 10/25/21 at 11:42 am to Wasting Time
The Shield was unique and so enjoyable in that the conclusion of the very first episode saw the protagonist commit a terrible act. From then on, the show was about how what he did affected him and his teammates; about them trying to dig their way out of a hole. The series was like a rollercoaster ride that climbed, hit the top with a certain incident, then whoosed you toward the bottom at a breakneck pace until the series finale. The pacing of The Shield was masterful.
This post was edited on 10/25 at 11:43 am
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by jlovel7 on 10/25/21 at 1:39 pm to Wasting Time
on 10/25/21 at 1:39 pm to Wasting TimeThat’s actually getting better. When I was younger no series had a fully developed plot at the outset. Now we have tons of them.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by MorbidTheClown on 10/25/21 at 1:43 pm to Wasting Time
on 10/25/21 at 1:43 pm to Wasting TimeBanshee did it right
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by MDB on 10/25/21 at 9:38 pm to Wasting Time
on 10/25/21 at 9:38 pm to Wasting TimeAnd that is why creativity and solid writing are so important. Formulaic thinking is a series killer.
Great writing almost always trumps acting.
Early writers successfully relied on episodic thinking and worked on character development and identification. An ongoing narrative was secondary.
Great writing almost always trumps acting.
Early writers successfully relied on episodic thinking and worked on character development and identification. An ongoing narrative was secondary.
quote:
you glazed right over the only purpose for every series ever made.
however, did Seinfeld have this problem? taxi? cheers after Diane left?
Comedy is the one genre exempt from needing an overarching story arc.
re: The problem with nearly every TV Series ever madePosted by Nodust on 10/25/21 at 9:53 pm to La Place Mike
on 10/25/21 at 9:53 pm to La Place Mikequote:
Every series should be a limited series.
Mini series may be the perfect format. Movies don’t have enough run time to tell a complete story. 6 seasons is normally too long.
Depends on what you're going for, really.
Comedies, and shows you might call comedies but are really more just reflections and observations on daily life with a sense of humor, can go on a long time before getting stale. It just depends on the premise the show is built on.
Speaking of premise- you take Magnum PI (original), and that could go on as long as the actors and writers wanted to. Doesn't matter that it was mostly episodic in nature, because it was the ideal male fantasy (Thomas Magnum, the dashing ex SEAL, lives rent-free in a Hawaiian estate, driving a Ferrari, entertaining countless young hotties, hanging with his buds, jousting verbally with Higgins etc). Yeah, at some point he had to grow up.
For something with a more specific overall story, you do probably need to plot out the course of the show, and hit markers every so often to keep it moving, and when you hit the end, shut it down.
Comedies, and shows you might call comedies but are really more just reflections and observations on daily life with a sense of humor, can go on a long time before getting stale. It just depends on the premise the show is built on.
Speaking of premise- you take Magnum PI (original), and that could go on as long as the actors and writers wanted to. Doesn't matter that it was mostly episodic in nature, because it was the ideal male fantasy (Thomas Magnum, the dashing ex SEAL, lives rent-free in a Hawaiian estate, driving a Ferrari, entertaining countless young hotties, hanging with his buds, jousting verbally with Higgins etc). Yeah, at some point he had to grow up.
For something with a more specific overall story, you do probably need to plot out the course of the show, and hit markers every so often to keep it moving, and when you hit the end, shut it down.
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