re: Star Wars Episode 8: The Last Jedi Discussion Thread ***SPOILERS***

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ETA: the prank call to Hux to open the movie was probably the most ridiculous thing in a movie that included Leia space flying and Luke dying of the family disease (no will to live)

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Thank god im not the only one who cringed when that happened. It was so forced and kept going. So stupid

Because the OT came out 40 years ago. They used some parts of the TLJ to tap in to those movies. R2D2 scene and the Yoda scene are both examples. If you’re building a new franchise you can’t focus on the older generation.

The force is making a comeback, and I have a feeling 9 will lead to more people becoming force sensitive. The Jedi have to make a comeback somehow if they want to get back to the size they were in the prequels.

Man, I don't know what to say. TFA wasn't amazing, but it was a solid kick-off to what could have been a good set of films.....

Then this happened. Johnson took all of the bad stuff, and made it important and tossed aside all of the good stuff. He ruined:
1. Snoke - What a waste of a character. If Ren was the big bad all along there were better ways to go about it. Snoke's mystery...ugh, why cloak him in secrecy in TFA?
2. Rey - She had nothing to do, and the fact that she came from nothing is such a stupid move on the writer's part. This damned the whole thing. I hated this.
3. Kylo - His "rise and fall" wasn;'t really earned and the story did exactly what was expected. Kylo redeeming himself in the face of Snoke would have been interesting. Him throwing more temper tantrums, not so much.
4. Dameron - Let him be his character, but no we just scold him and put him in his place all movie long.
5. Hux - They turned him into a whining child

The villains are straight up terrible in these films, as Snoke is completely surperfluous to the plot....or was meant to be, while Kylo and Hux are just overgrown children. Neither is imposing, and one has tantrums while the other just whines all of the time.

Actually, I don't think he progressed a single character effectively. And this is beyond the politics, which were insufferable stunts. Kill off every major leader so Hodo can take over? Even my better half caught that one. All actions by men leading to problems - Dameron getting scolded, Luke fading away, Kylo's temper tantrums, Finn being saved by a girl....ugh. Putting Politics into a film are fine if you 1) Balance it 2) Don't make it the complete focus of the film at the expense of narrative.

BB8 was a bigger "hero" than nearly any Man in the film. Think about that.

An to top it all off, it was very much an average film. Lots of bad acting, problematic editing, poor writing...etc. And it tried WAY too hard to be funny. There was a lot of slapstick going on that was totally out of place.

Luke tossing the lightsaber aside tells you everything you need to know, because that's what Johnson did with TFA and the OT. Not only that, you throw aside the Jedi.....only to start new Jedi? I mean I get the throwing away story, but doing all of that to start again is...massively boring, there's a political angle to that, but I don't need to go there.

Not a "bad" movie, but certainly a bad movie.

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2. Rey - She had nothing to do, and the fact that she came from nothing is such a stupid move on the writer's part. This damned the whole thing. I hated this.

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I honestly like that Rey’s parents are just a bunch of drunks. Who else would leave a 5 year old girl in such a place where she will almost certainly be dead within the month?

And it also retroactively in some ways fixes the Midiclorian problem. I immediately thought of Ratatouille where the slogan is “Anyone can cook” when it actually means “Not everyone can become a great artist, but a great artist can come from anywhere”. That’s what the Force should be more about that the prequels ruined.

I agree.

I had no issue with Rey's parents being nobodies.

Same.

It plays up to being the opposite of Kylo Ren.

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There's no purpose to her being from nothing, as it does nothing for the story. Purpose to her existence would be something.

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Read my post. I see the purpose of her coming from nothing and I think it’s great.

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You can't handle that you were wrong

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How was I wrong?

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I honestly like that Rey’s parents are just a bunch of drunks. Who else would leave a 5 year old girl in such a place where she will almost certainly be dead within the month?

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I'm not saying that this wasn't an option, but it doesn't showwell enough in these films to make sense. Or, I should say, the reason that she's from nothing is to make the point that she's from nothing. That's the only reason, and when you add that to the rest of the terrible choices, I feel like it's the genesis of nearly every bad decision in the film.

Like the writers said, "Well, what if Rey's from nothing? That she has no important backstory..."

And then followed that up with "Snoke too! He doesn't need a story either. He's just there." "What about Hux?" "Inconsequential, he doesn't need story or a background either?" And so forth. Like Rey not having a story pretty much sent the whole thing in motion. TLJ felt meaningless honestly, and that's reflected in Rey being meaningless.

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And it also retroactively in some ways fixes the Midiclorian problem. I immediately thought of Ratatouille where the slogan is “Anyone can cook” when it actually means “Not everyone can become a great artist, but a great artist can come from anywhere”. That’s what the Force should be more about that the prequels ruined.

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Agree and disagree with this. There were better ways, and better characters to use for this. Using it for Rey makes no sense, but imagine if Finn had a better story and a better actor, and you give him some "force-like" moments throughout two films, then in desperation in the fight with Phasma...he taps into the force.

The question is, What are they trying to do with the Force? If it's about heroes coming from nowhere, there are dozens of better storylines to use than the one they went with.