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re: Was Jackie Robinson actually really good at baseball?
Posted on 4/15/13 at 9:43 am to bobbyray21
Posted on 4/15/13 at 9:43 am to bobbyray21
Minnie Minoso was 21 in 1947. He hadn't quite developed into the player he would become, and wouldn't get a big league shot until 1951. But he'd be in the conversation.
Jackie was better, though Minoso should be in the Hall of Fame.
Jackie was better, though Minoso should be in the Hall of Fame.
0
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:18 am to bobbyray21
quote:
I have heard that Jackie wasn't the best black baseball player at the time, but I'd like to know who was better than him at 28 or under. Anybody?
I think a case can be made for Larry Doby. He came up late that year with Cleveland at age 23. I don't think he ever became as good as Jackie but I think he was more highly touted. Roy Campanella joined the Dodgers the following year at 26. Willie Mays joined the Giants in '51 at age 20. He was pretty good but probably not better than Jackie when he was only 17. I'd say the answer is Roy Campanella.
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:19 am to TheCaterpillar
Yes, he was very good. But I feel sorry for Larry Doby. Robinson beat him to the color line by just a few weeks and nobody gives Doby credit for making history.
Robinson was signed much earlier but went through the minors. Doby went directly to the Major Leagues.
Two anecdotes about Jackie. In the 1980s I was browsing around the top floor of the Dallas Galleria and walked into a small shop that alternated traveling displays. That day it was historical documents for sale. Most of the stuff was waaay past my price limit. But they had something I could have bought for only $300. It was a handwritten note by Jackie to his wife informing her that he had just signed a contract with the Dodgers. Wish I had bought it.
In the 90s I saw an old photograph of the Dodgers that was truly amazing. In the bottom of the 9th an opposing player had hit a walk off HR. The photo showed the entire infield of the Dodgers trotting off toward the dugout as the batter rounded the bases. But Jackie stayed at his position and was staring at the batter. He was making sure the hitter touched every base. If he missed one Jackie was going to appeal the play. Now, that's competitive.
Robinson was signed much earlier but went through the minors. Doby went directly to the Major Leagues.
Two anecdotes about Jackie. In the 1980s I was browsing around the top floor of the Dallas Galleria and walked into a small shop that alternated traveling displays. That day it was historical documents for sale. Most of the stuff was waaay past my price limit. But they had something I could have bought for only $300. It was a handwritten note by Jackie to his wife informing her that he had just signed a contract with the Dodgers. Wish I had bought it.
In the 90s I saw an old photograph of the Dodgers that was truly amazing. In the bottom of the 9th an opposing player had hit a walk off HR. The photo showed the entire infield of the Dodgers trotting off toward the dugout as the batter rounded the bases. But Jackie stayed at his position and was staring at the batter. He was making sure the hitter touched every base. If he missed one Jackie was going to appeal the play. Now, that's competitive.
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:39 am to TheCaterpillar
Upon further investigation, it appears that Jackie Robinson was a phenomenal athlete. So much more than just a good baseball player.
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:43 am to tmc94
quote:
including the franchises first ever WS title.
Did he get hurt in this series? I was looking at the box scores and he had a bad series, but I was surprised he didn't even play in Game 7.
1955 World Series Box Score
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:46 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
Also, I heard he was not technically the first black guy in the majors. Heard there were others before him that were Latin American but were allowed to play because they weren't African American and they spoke Spanish.
There were some mixed race black players before JR. That's why people always say he "broke the color barrier" and not "first black player". Wasn't the first but entered the league when there were no other blacks and hadn't been for a while. But that doesn't diminish his accomplishments 1 bit.
This post was edited on 4/15/13 at 10:48 am
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:47 am to bobbyray21
That's the thing was that Jackie's timing to enter the show in his prime was perfect. Satch was too old and volatile. Same with Gibson who sadly passed away months before Jackie's debut. Gibson was only 35.
I wish studs like Oscar charleston came around at the right time. Jackie was an incredibly special player, and i think some people take that for granted.
I wish studs like Oscar charleston came around at the right time. Jackie was an incredibly special player, and i think some people take that for granted.
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:50 am to Vicks Kennel Club
Oscar Charleston is widely considered the best player in the Negro League's history. Which would make him one of the best players of all time.
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:52 am to TheCaterpillar
Jackie RObinson was an outstanding athlete and baseball player. The game was played differently, but think of him as the Rickey Henderson of his era. He could hit for average, power, got on base and was a threat to steal at any time. He got teammates better pitches to hit when he was on base.
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:53 am to Vicks Kennel Club
He was probably the first guy to truly intimidate pitchers on the base paths.
Doris Kearns Goodwin describes it really well on Ken Burns: Baseball, just telling one story about how he got on base and scored a run, all through intimidation, base stealing, etc. He made the run himself.
Doris Kearns Goodwin describes it really well on Ken Burns: Baseball, just telling one story about how he got on base and scored a run, all through intimidation, base stealing, etc. He made the run himself.
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:54 am to Baloo
I have read claims that Charleston was better than Willie Mays. I mean, shite, how much better can you be? 
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:55 am to Zach
quote:
In the 90s I saw an old photograph of the Dodgers that was truly amazing. In the bottom of the 9th an opposing player had hit a walk off HR. The photo showed the entire infield of the Dodgers trotting off toward the dugout as the batter rounded the bases. But Jackie stayed at his position and was staring at the batter. He was making sure the hitter touched every base. If he missed one Jackie was going to appeal the play. Now, that's competitive.
super meh
Posted on 4/15/13 at 10:58 am to Maximus
Sounds like jackie was only good enough to win on a technically
Posted on 4/15/13 at 11:00 am to Vicks Kennel Club
Fun fact:
UCLA was the most integrated team in the nation in 1939 starting 4 black players including 3 in the backfield. Jackie #28. Finished 7th Final AP Poll at 6-0-4. Tied USC 0-0 who won the Rose Bowl and winner of the Knute Rockne Intercollegiate Memorial Trophy, at the time emblematic of the nation's No. 1 team) by beating previously unscored upon Tennessee.)
This post was edited on 4/15/13 at 11:02 am
Posted on 4/15/13 at 11:00 am to Maximus
I got to meet one member of the Negro Leagues just before he passed. It was in the late 70s. He had given a talk about what life was like. By the time Jackie had broken the barrier this guy was past his prime and too old to interest the Majors.
At a reception following the talk I asked him "Don't you feel unlucky that you weren't born ten years later and could have made all that big money in the Majors?"
Him: "No. I loved playing. I was amazed that the Negro League paid me. I wouldda played for free."
At a reception following the talk I asked him "Don't you feel unlucky that you weren't born ten years later and could have made all that big money in the Majors?"
Him: "No. I loved playing. I was amazed that the Negro League paid me. I wouldda played for free."
Posted on 4/15/13 at 11:02 am to TheCaterpillar
yes he was good at everything
This post was edited on 4/15/13 at 11:03 am
Posted on 4/15/13 at 11:18 am to StraightCashHomey21
Top 5 second basemen of all time.
Posted on 4/15/13 at 11:29 am to Zach
quote:Let's keep this in mind about Larry Doby, the guy had a near HOF career while learning to play the OF on the fly. Switching positions at the big league level since Cleveland already had HOF Player/Manager Lou Boudreau at short and HOF Joe Gordon @ 2b.
Yes, he was very good. But I feel sorry for Larry Doby. Robinson beat him to the color line by just a few weeks and nobody gives Doby credit for making history.
Robinson was signed much earlier but went through the minors. Doby went directly to the Major Leagues
Posted on 4/15/13 at 11:35 am to Waffle House
He missed a lot of games to injuries that year as he got older. Probably at least in part due to the onset of diabetes which wasn't diagnosed til a year or so later. He was 36 or so and few guys played much longer than that back then anyway.
This post was edited on 4/15/13 at 11:38 am
Posted on 4/15/13 at 11:40 am to TheCaterpillar
Fun fact: Robinson's original HOF plaque omitted his breaking the color barrier (at his request). It was changed years after his death.
This post was edited on 4/15/13 at 11:41 am
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