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re: Discussions about MVP Awards (In General)
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:21 am to bobbyray21
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:21 am to bobbyray21
I think VORP is an excellent way of picking MVP.
And I think Lebron provides the most value over an average replacement.
And I think Lebron provides the most value over an average replacement.
1
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:24 am to bobbyray21
It's essentially saying $1000 is more valuable to me than to Bill Gates. The objective value is the same, $1000 is $1000, but it would make more of an impact on me than it would on Bill, who wouldn't even notice it.
I think a "value" argument is perfectly valid, especially to break ties or separate two players who extremely close on objective measurements. It's the old Branch Rickey line, "We could have finished fourth without you." I don't think it should be given more weight than everything else, but it is still something to consider.
I think a "value" argument is perfectly valid, especially to break ties or separate two players who extremely close on objective measurements. It's the old Branch Rickey line, "We could have finished fourth without you." I don't think it should be given more weight than everything else, but it is still something to consider.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:24 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
*ETA: CFB is THE WORST at this
CFB has an MVP award?
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:24 am to SlowFlowPro
If you go by win shares, LeBron contributed 19.3 wins. Carmelo contributed 9.5 wins (14th in the league).
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:26 am to SlowFlowPro
Because by and large, reporters and writers need narratives and storylines for their business. As it is, Lebron might be the MVP for the next few years. Variety is interesting for them, if only as a futile 2nd place vote.
Or he actually believes that the MVP award is a measure of how one's contributions tangibly affects the course of a team by arbitrary guidelines.
Or he actually believes that the MVP award is a measure of how one's contributions tangibly affects the course of a team by arbitrary guidelines.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:35 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
cassell doing well when brady was hurt doesn't indict brady, and cassell being better than peyton manning's backup doesn't make manning inferior, either.
THANK YOU
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:35 am to cornhat
I could see Lebron keeping this up for atleast 3 more seasons without injury. There isn't another player in the game currently capable of what he is doing.
I doubt he gets the next 3 MVPs though because of the ridiculous media. He should already have 5 also. The one that went to Rose was dumb.
I doubt he gets the next 3 MVPs though because of the ridiculous media. He should already have 5 also. The one that went to Rose was dumb.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:37 am to Colonel Flagg
quote:
I doubt he gets the next 3 MVPs though because of the ridiculous media. He should already have 5 also. The one that went to Rose was dumb.
Not as dumb as Karl Malone winning in '97.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:38 am to Zamoro10
quote:
Posted by Zamoro10 on 5/6 at 8:58 am to SlowFlowPro I loathe this reasoning as well and you hear it all the time...like your example: "I believe Brady is the best player in the league and had a better year than Manning but you take Peyton off of those Colts and they don't win 3 games while the Pats have Belichick! Manning has to be MVP!" This post was edited on 5/6 at 8:59 am
Like the people that wanted Manning to get the MVP the season he didnt play a snap
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:38 am to castorinho
quote:
CFB has an MVP award?
best player/MVP award
the heisman relies far too heavily on "best player on the best team" in too many years
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:38 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
and PER is mainly an offensive judgment. defensively lebron blows melo out of the water
yep
Lebron has a great PER and he is probably the best defender in the league due to him being able to guard effectively all 5 positions on the court.
He is the best player in the game. People who say otherwise just aren't watching.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:43 am to bobbyray21
quote:No Rose winning was worse. Malone had a great season that year. He lead the league in PER and was second in WS/48. Jordan probably should have won, but it doubt it was more ridiculous than Rose winning.
Not as dumb as Karl Malone winning in '97.
quote:I actually think the strongest argument for LeBron being the best defender in league isn't for his versatility. It's his ability to be all over the court on the same possession. His ability to cover the perimeter, dip down into the lane to take away the passing lane to the big man or roll man, and then recover back to the perimeter in time for his guy to receive the pass is incredible. All that while also being great in the pass lanes and his versatility make him an elite defender in the league for sure.
he is probably the best defender in the league due to him being able to guard effectively all 5 positions on the court.
I think next year they'll end up giving the MVP to Durant or someone and throw LeBron the DPOY, especially if he comes out before the season saying he's focused on winning the DPOY. The narrative will write itself.
This post was edited on 5/6/13 at 9:50 am
Posted on 5/6/13 at 9:57 am to jturn17
I think he should focus on FT shooting and chase the 50-40-90.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 10:22 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
how does this argument make any sense? is the MVP award really a judgment of teammates and not individuals? that's what you're doing if you buy into this line of thought. you are putting more weight into the quality of the star's teammates than the stars themselves. how is that logical?
I see it the other way around - this perspective attempts to "control" for the teammates and assess the player's individual contribution.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 10:23 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Discussions about MVP Awards (In General)
quote:
SlowFlowPro
Holy shite. You are going to have 500k posts once this thread ends.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 10:27 am to SlowFlowPro
In general, the term, "MVP" is pretty subjective. We're all used to it and understand it to mean the "best" player, but WTF does "MVP" actually mean?
It it is the most valubale player, you presume it is the player who is the most valuable. Valuable to his team, league, what? Under that guise, you get arguments like Payton Manning being the MVP in 2011, a year he didn't play a down, because his "value" was evident. Of course, that that woudl be ridiculous, but not a bad argument.
Rename it Player of the Year because that's what you're awarding.
It it is the most valubale player, you presume it is the player who is the most valuable. Valuable to his team, league, what? Under that guise, you get arguments like Payton Manning being the MVP in 2011, a year he didn't play a down, because his "value" was evident. Of course, that that woudl be ridiculous, but not a bad argument.
Rename it Player of the Year because that's what you're awarding.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 10:28 am to Vlad The Inhaler
quote:
Payton Manning
:inb4who?:
Posted on 5/6/13 at 10:30 am to SlowFlowPro
I think they should change the name to MOP like the Final Four does. That would eliminate the "Valuable" argument.
Posted on 5/6/13 at 10:33 am to wildtigercat93
quote:
Like the people that wanted Manning to get the MVP the season he didnt play a snap
Im pretty sure that was said in jest for the most part
Posted on 5/6/13 at 10:34 am to jturn17
quote:
No Rose winning was worse. Malone had a great season that year
Nash winning over Shaq was equally silly.
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