re: Discussions about MVP Awards (In General)

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You can view per 36 and get what you need that would be the same if you did per minute.

Birdman is 12/10 with 2.5 blocks per 36. Solid numbers, but Wade is 22/5/5 with 2 steals and a block. I just don't see how that production, even on a per minute basis, is better than Wade's.

If I gave you those numbers, no names attached and asked you who is producing more, I'm guessing you'd pick Wade's numbers.

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It's the eternal debate between PER and other metrics. PER likes volume scorers. Other metrics like rebounds and scoring efficiency. I mean he's like 5th in TS%, Top 20 in both Oreb%, Dreb%, and Reb%, 5th in Block%. He rates very highly among all categories among his position.

You'd have to read up on how PER and WS were created to understand the choices made. And the advantages and disadvantages of each. Neither are perfect, but if I'm looking for who helps their team win games I'll usually lean towards WS/48.

Edit: If I remember correct, WS/48 attempts to calculate a defensive rating for each player and takes that into account, which helps Andersen. PER doesn't really have this type of equivalent.

Edit#2: I also like that WS/48 doesn't necessarily line up with the perception. I don't like that PER does to be honest. I don't think our eyes are always right when it comes to evaluating players and what contributes to wins.

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That guy

ETA:

Idiotic, stupid. To act like a moron.

From the popular insult "to have your head up your arse". This imagry leads to ones arse being placed on the head like a hat, hence "asshat".

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This was very informative. Thank you.

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Most valuable =/= Best player

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Sure it does.

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Lebon-less heat is still a 3-4 seed.

Curry-less GS is a lottery draft slot

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Why is that the correct hypothetical?

Lebron on GS, they're better than they are now. Curry on the Heat, Heat are worse than they are now. Why can't that be the hypothetical, which clearly shows Lebron's value?

Most valuable to their team.

Putting them on opposite teams is a stretch. Granted Curry is West coast so is treated like an also ran by those with EastCoastSPN bias or looked down on by those LBJGOAT!!!11# ball garblers.

Lebron james is clearly the best player on the best team but I'd argue that Curry is more valuable to his team than LBJ is to the Heat.

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Lebron james is clearly the best player on the best team but I'd argue that Curry is more valuable to his team than LBJ is to the Heat.

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Read the OP, that's sort of the whole point. Value shouldn't be derived by the shittiness and/or quality of someone's teammates.

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So whats the comparison? Stats vs Stats?

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I mean, FWIW, I gave stats, team stats, to back up my point that shows Lebron is more value to his team than Curry.

You're just saying Curry is, that doesn't do much without any tangible proof.

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Personally Ive always believed in the hypothetical "take way" qualifier

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The best way to quantify this "Take away" is to look at the on/off stats, where Lebron is far and away more valuable to his team.

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Thats a telling stat. Puzzle piece but are there other players with that big of a pt diff in the MVP discussion or for that matter using that logic that should be added?

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Fair enough. Like you said it is 1 piece of the puzzle.

I would say though, I think of all the real MVP contenders, none are even at 10points net.

I think Mike Conley, though I'm not positive as I haven't checked in forever, actually had a higher number than Lebron's. So if you took that number as the only factor, you'd say Conley is more valuable.

But like you mentioned, it's just part of the puzzle.