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BeeFense5
Chicago Cubs Fan
Kenner
Member since Jul 2010
30119 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
Orgeron basically got the job because he came to the podium each week last year and said what the popular rant narrative was and got people on his side.
Now that he got the job, he's doing it his way like he always intended.

I am a huge proponent of the coach needing to shut out the outside noise but knowing Orgeron's horrendous history, I would rather him listen to Dukke V than himself.
This post was edited on 1/11 at 9:19 am


BilJ
Kansas State Fan
DANGA ZONE
Member since Sep 2003
141055 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
and hell its one thing to change your stance over time, but he's seemingly flipped on 3-4 different offenses in the span of a few months

Hell, hiring Canada directly conflicts with much of what he said he wanted to do. But hey I figured he did his due diligence and liked what he saw in the offense, but he so quickly pulled the plug on it that it leads me to believe he was either never on board with the offense from the start or didn't truly understand it, just wanted to land a hot name.


therick711
Chicago Cubs Fan
South
Member since Jan 2008
21855 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

Orgeron basically got the job because he came to the podium each week last year and said what the popular rant narrative was and got people on his side.
Now that he got the job, he's doing it his way like he always intended.


He also traded access for media favor. He did that before he even got the D Line Coach job. I don't think he can be a head coach, but the guy is amazing at laying groundwork to get what he wants. That's why he's known as a great recruiter. He knows relationships. He just doesn't know how to be a head coach.


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30
I-59 Tiger
LSU Fan
Vestavia Hills, AL
Member since Sep 2003
30439 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

Hell, hiring Canada directly conflicts with much of what he said he wanted to do. But hey I figured he did his due diligence and liked what he saw in the offense, but he so quickly pulled the plug on it that it leads me to believe he was either never on board with the offense from the start or didn't truly understand it, just wanted to land a hot name


Very frustrating. As good as Aranda is O's background is defense. If he had meddled with him,well... But Orgeron is NOT an offensive guy. He should have stayed the heck away from Canada.


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BilJ
Kansas State Fan
DANGA ZONE
Member since Sep 2003
141055 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

Orgeron basically got the job because he came to the podium each week last year and said what the popular rant narrative was and got people on his side.


oh his interim intro speech was a carefully crafted manipulation of the Miles fatigue crowd.


Lsupimp
Colorado Fan
Acceptance.
Member since Nov 2003
52287 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
Nicely reasoned as always but what is really kind of rankling me, a person who is by nature a realistic optimist , is this idea that the Only outcome here can be negative. When in fact there is every indication that our actual team could be much- improved next year based on interior line play, a pretty filthy defense led by a great coordinator, and maybe having our coaches be on the same page in terms of philosophy.

I’ve never been a “Coach O guy “ because I don’t believe he has the temperament to be a CEO of an entire program and I don’t trust his decision logic . But I balance that skepticism against the boorishness and insufferability of being a constant voice of negativity and dissension . That’s because I understand the power of self-fulfilling-prophecy and the risk of creating this mood of doom and gloom around the program.

And I also realize ( as so many others refuse to acknowledge) that I am only operating with a fraction of the information needed to analyze the actual facts. There are known unknowns and unknown unknowns , as it were. So realizing that, and not wanting to be a boorish a-hole, I choose to bite my tongue , keep my opinions ( mostly ) to myself, speak with a certain level of humility that acknowledges I have no control over any of this, and try to focus on the positives . Of which there are MANY.


Salviati
Virginia Fan
Member since Apr 2006
2880 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

quote:

There is zero actual analysis as to the actual arguments raised by each group

oh i can give you arguments

i did this at length last year when O was hired about how the hire is just not going to work

it's from O as a coach to his history to his coordinator-dependent strategy. many of those things have already shown themselves
I can give arguments too.

But all you really did was say that CheeriOs' are emotional thinkers, and negatigers are rational thinkers, but you NEVER explained WHY each side's arguments can be described as you suggest. You surely defined what emotional and rational thinking are, but, again, you NEVER explained WHY CheeriOs are emotional thinkers and negatigers are rational thinkers.


BeeFense5
Chicago Cubs Fan
Kenner
Member since Jul 2010
30119 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

oh his interim intro speech was a carefully crafted manipulation of the Miles fatigue crowd.




It really was.
He also promised all this honesty but what we are getting is total blatant lies from what he said to get the job.
"Tell da Troot Mondee"


BilJ
Kansas State Fan
DANGA ZONE
Member since Sep 2003
141055 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

I would argue that in the arms race era, an announced CEO strategy cannot work. You see what our adversaries are doing to us on that.



well those guys have capable CEO types, but they have a specific vision and hire accordingly to that vision. With each O hire you never know what kind of overhaul we could be facing


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therick711
Chicago Cubs Fan
South
Member since Jan 2008
21855 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

oh his interim intro speech was a carefully crafted manipulation of the Miles fatigue crowd.




Flips through script:

Page 1: We gon' flip the script. Turns script upside down (smooth optics Ponamsky)

Page 2: One team, one heartbeat.

Page 3: He gon' do a good job for us.

Page 4: Put up as many points as possible against jamokes to make it look like the offense changed.

Page 5: Play terrified against Alabama and get shut out?

Page 6: Get players to try and fight Florida because they challenged our manhood or whatever.

Page 7: Let players decide when they are well enough or too hurt to play.

Page 8: Let Arden Key do whatever.

Page 9: Rely on Kiffin not stabbing you in the back.

Page 10: Hire whomever as OC without regard to what they do.

Page 11: We comin'.

Page 12: Get the USC/Miami band back together after securing guranteed contract.


BilJ
Kansas State Fan
DANGA ZONE
Member since Sep 2003
141055 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
O is basically Michael Scott....great salesman, but totally inept manager


BeeFense5
Chicago Cubs Fan
Kenner
Member since Jul 2010
30119 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

therick711


Page 13: Hope and Pray


therick711
Chicago Cubs Fan
South
Member since Jan 2008
21855 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

Page 13: Hope and Pray


Page 14: Beg a guy who doesn't want the job to become the OC. Orders Ensminger to put USC or Miami (preferably both) on resume to comply with binder's requirement for hiring.


BeeFense5
Chicago Cubs Fan
Kenner
Member since Jul 2010
30119 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction


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BilJ
Kansas State Fan
DANGA ZONE
Member since Sep 2003
141055 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
bringing the former players back, fattening the media up on practice attendance, and giving donors/insiders more access to the program in decades....all fine manipulation to win support


GeauxTigerTM
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2006
16372 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

We can't assume we will be terrible just because of a hire.


Of course. Just like we can't be sure things will go well with what appears to be an awesome hire. but here's the thing...if/when you hire someone for your business...do you look to hire the very best in hopes that their past performance will help the possibility of them performing likewise in their role with your company...or do you just hire anyone and hope for the best? Why not expect the very same for LSU?

quote:

Look coach O did his job last year when he hired 2 of the best coordinators in the country.


First...Orgeron did not hire Aranda. Miles did. LSU was able to retain him and we were able to keep his this year due to a giant raise and a promise of things to come.

Second...did he hire Canada? Because if he did, then he does not now get to claim that Canada's scheme sucked and was a bad fit as if he had no idea what the man was going to run when he got to Baton Rouge. He also can;t claim that Canada was too hard to get along with, as if this information also should not have been widely available to any potential employer of Canada. So either he did not do his due diligence when he made the hire (not good) or he sat back while someone else made the hire (even worse.) Which is it?

quote:

Now coach O has gone a different direction with the hiring of the new OC which a lot of fans disagree with but at least lets wait to see the product before we make judgment.


See my first paragraph. We fired Miles TO IMPROVE, specifically the offense. And we're now suggesting that Orgeron hiring a man who has not been a full time OC since the Clinton Administration is a good option? Again...if this was the most likely road to success, all programs would hire coordinators who've not coordinated in 20 years. We're not being smart and it's obvious.

quote:

If this doesn't work out then both of them will be terminated.


And then how many years will we have wasted since we fired Miles to upgrade? How many fine young men will have come through Tiger Stadium to have their LSU careers wasted? How much deeper will the hole we're in be by then?

quote:

It's not the end of the world.


It's not even "the end" of the football program. But much like the Hallman years, it may be the beginning of some very dark years that will place us further behind. Even programs like Notre Dame can fall off the map for huge stretches of time. Why jump off voluntarily while we're til on it??

quote:

I actually think we will surprise some folks on offense and go to a pass first offense to open up the run this year. I predict we go 9-3!


Great...and what good will your prediction do for anyone if LSU actually goes 6-6?


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GeorgeTheGreek
Michigan State Fan
Sparta, Greece
Member since Mar 2008
50405 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
Then not doing ANY of those the following year.


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10
BeeFense5
Chicago Cubs Fan
Kenner
Member since Jul 2010
30119 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
just like therick711 is saying, I find it fascinating that we begged a guy on staff for a decade who by all accounts didn't want the job to take the job. That seems ridiculously bass ackwards


S
Texas Southern Fan
Evergreen, LA
Member since Jan 2007
94035 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

Page 1: We gon' flip the script. Turns script upside down




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BilJ
Kansas State Fan
DANGA ZONE
Member since Sep 2003
141055 posts

re: Rational v. Emotional thinking: the posi-nega distinction
quote:

just like therick711 is saying, I find it fascinating that we begged a guy on staff for a decade who by all accounts didn't want the job to take the job. That seems ridiculously bass ackwards


his two coordinators = Miles hires. His best staffer (Raymond)= Miles hire. At this point, why did we fire Les again?



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