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Message
re: Info on Harris and Jennings
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:20 pm to PG
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:20 pm to PG
l
this
quote:
Pretty much a pattern with Miles and our back up young QBs. We could be up 28 or 35 points in the 3rd quarter but the back up never sees the field until sometime in the 4th when we are up by 40 + points. Terrible job developing QBs - terrible and there is a decade of this pattern
this
0
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:20 pm to GFunk
that is great and all but you are missing a pretty key element
In your scenario the unprepared "BEAST" succeeds. What if your BEAST fails? how far beyond himself and his direct report does he/she feel the damage?
Quite a bit more risk and scrutiny for LSU and Miles if Harris fails. the media doesnt cover the story and the aftermath of a salesman failing
not to mention Harris is 18yr/o, he may be a beast one day but right now he is just a cub
Easy there lightenin'
LSU is 7-3 not 3-7
In your scenario the unprepared "BEAST" succeeds. What if your BEAST fails? how far beyond himself and his direct report does he/she feel the damage?
Quite a bit more risk and scrutiny for LSU and Miles if Harris fails. the media doesnt cover the story and the aftermath of a salesman failing
not to mention Harris is 18yr/o, he may be a beast one day but right now he is just a cub
quote:
If I have to choose between the wrong answer and the unknown, I choose the unknown.
Easy there lightenin'
LSU is 7-3 not 3-7
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:24 pm to supatigah
quote:
supatigah
quote:
Info on Harris and Jennings
that is great and all but you are missing a pretty key element
In your scenario the unprepared "BEAST" succeeds. What if your BEAST fails? how far beyond himself and his direct report does he/she feel the damage?
Quite a bit more risk and scrutiny for LSU and Miles if Harris fails. the media doesnt cover the story and the aftermath of a salesman failing
not to mention Harris is 18yr/o, he may be a beast one day but right now he is just a cub
quote:
If I have to choose between the wrong answer and the unknown, I choose the unknown.
Easy there lightenin'
LSU is 7-3 not 3-7
That's what's hilarious to me. Harris is on the bench. He's doing nothing now. Jennings is and Jennings is failing worse than Jordan Jefferson and Jarret Lee ever did (go look it up or check out And The Valley Shook; they ran the stats so I don't have to). So if you can't say he's not the right answer then we simply go back to an option worse than Jordan Jefferson.
If you are okay with saying that what we have isn't working and saying that you'd rather not at least TRY something else, then God Bless.
Logic isn't on your side in this discussion. Analogies were off, statistics support an opposing viewpoint, and reason tells us all what we need to do here. If you can't see it then you don't want to.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:37 pm to wahoocs
quote:
For the record, I agree with everything you're saying, and you're putting it into words every one should understand. I've been privy to some conversations that are second hand from family members and players in the huddle, and much of what is being said in this thread by respectable posters, lines up.
how prepared was harris before he got to LSU?
harris had ZERO fundamentals from what I saw in highlights and the one HS game film I saw so when he came in he immediately had to start working on basic QB skills and techniques
how much has he learned since he came here last spring?
Assuming he is a physical fast learner and he has started to master the basic movements of the QB position. Now start adding terminology, formations, etc in preparation for the Spring game
how much does he need to improve to play more now?
footwork and techniques will be an ongoing process while he is here so assuming to play now he has to have mastered the basic play terminology, the formations/alignments and basic checks over the summer, part of what may be holding him back is reading/recognizing the field in pre-snap and post-snap
how much does he need to improve to start next year?
passable fundamentals, improving accuracy, mastery of the terminology and formations and shifts. Beginning to understand reading the pre-snap and post-snap defense and recognizing what he is seeing
quote:
I think the question becomes when do we ever feel the need to give the more gifted player a chance to get as comfortable as the more experienced one. As good as LSU's talent has been with our offensive philosophy as is, only playoff caliber teams can beat us, but we are handicapping ourselves
usually in these situations there are basic timelines and expectations for development. When the player can't or won't do what you tell them to, when you tell them to and in the expected part of the development timeline, they fall back and you start to lose patience.
I suspect harris will win the job next year because he is obviously physically better and he will grow up and earn what he gets.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:40 pm to GFunk
quote:
Jennings is and Jennings is failing worse than Jordan Jefferson and Jarret Lee ever did (
Except in the w/l category in first years as starters.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:48 pm to GFunk
quote:Sure, Lee was a horrible QB in his first three years. However, Jennings is not that bad.
Jennings is and Jennings is failing worse than Jordan Jefferson and Jarrett Lee ever did.
Jennings in his first year as a starter has a higher passer rating than Lee did in any of his first three years.
Jennings
2014 120.02
Lee
2008 116.92
2009 92.87
2010 119.92
Jennings is also better than Jefferson was in his first year as a starter.
And one point you may be missing is that, as bad as Lee was, he got better. Lee got better in three out of four years. Jefferson also got better. Jefferson got better in three out of four years.
quote:Jennings is 8-2 as a starter. It's working. Not great, and it's getting better, but it's working.
If you are okay with saying that what we have isn't working and saying that you'd rather not at least TRY something else, then God Bless.
They did TRY something else in the Auburn game. Harris was AWFUL. By his own admission, it was a nightmare. Jennings played much better than Harris in that game.
quote:Irony. You don't understand the analogy. You have the wrong stats. You have the wrong history. And if that is not enough, and it really is, reason and experience support supatigah.
Logic isn't on your side in this discussion. Analogies were off, statistics support an opposing viewpoint, and reason tells us all what we need to do here. If you can't see it then you don't want to.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:49 pm to GFunk
Well, on one hand, I want to count drops by receivers that are physically overmatched. Quinn probably has 8 or so catchable balls dropped, Dupre has a couple, and Dural just flat out gets knocked down on anything that isn't over his shoulder. Melvin Jones dropped a ball being delivered by a stork with guidance only found during mid-air refueling of jets.
On the other hand, a perfectly called first down pass on the drive that preceded our punt down to the 1 yd line, left Quinn wide open for a catch that would have positioned us within a first down of a game winning FG attempt, but Jennings short hopped him.
Jennings most effective play in this game was something he has lacked, picking up yards when receivers are covered or he can't make a decision. There's little doubt that Jennings isn't slow on the uptake, but from what I understand, even the players lack confidence in Harris so much as getting a play called, much less executed. He looked good playing sandlot vs Miss St late, but Auburn was more of what the staff has seen.
On the other hand, a perfectly called first down pass on the drive that preceded our punt down to the 1 yd line, left Quinn wide open for a catch that would have positioned us within a first down of a game winning FG attempt, but Jennings short hopped him.
Jennings most effective play in this game was something he has lacked, picking up yards when receivers are covered or he can't make a decision. There's little doubt that Jennings isn't slow on the uptake, but from what I understand, even the players lack confidence in Harris so much as getting a play called, much less executed. He looked good playing sandlot vs Miss St late, but Auburn was more of what the staff has seen.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:52 pm to GFunk
quote:
reason tells us all what we need to do here
there it is, this is personal for you and it shouldn't be
there is no WE here, unless you are Cameron or Miles. there is YOU, ME and THEM. In this case THEY have much better knowledge of the whole picture of what is going on. The advantage they have over you and me is they personally know the two kids we are discussing here.
I am in favor of playing Harris again, but only if he is ready. I am not in favor of running him out there in the snow and freezing cold on the road in Arky without a plan.
I think a better scenario is giving him the start at Texas A&M regardless of what happens in Fayetteville. I doubt it happens but who knows.
Harris and Jennings will battle in the Spring and summer for starter and harris will win because he is better and he will be a year older.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:54 pm to supatigah
Once again I can't disagree with any of that.
Let's hope the timeline isn't in the same hemisphere as the one used for our MLBer position.
Let's hope the timeline isn't in the same hemisphere as the one used for our MLBer position.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:55 pm to wahoocs
quote:
Jennings most effective play in this game was something he has lacked, picking up yards when receivers are covered or he can't make a decision. There's little doubt that Jennings isn't slow on the uptake, but from what I understand, even the players lack confidence in Harris so much as getting a play called, much less executed. He looked good playing sandlot vs Miss St late, but Auburn was more of what the staff has seen.
exactly
Jennings is everything you want right up the snap
Harris is everything you want after the snap
one of these will get better with time and experience, one of these probably wont
Posted on 11/12/14 at 4:55 pm to Salviati
quote:
Irony. You don't understand the analogy. You have the wrong stats.
quote:
Salviati
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:00 pm to supatigah
I wish you would post more.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:01 pm to wahoocs
quote:
Let's hope the timeline isn't in the same hemisphere as the one used for our MLBer position.
I firmly believe beckwith is the "just let him play" type of kid and someone else on the field has taken over the "coach on the field" role. I think Chavis fought to keep that responsibility in the role of his MLB and Beckwith just isnt that kind of kid. He is the kind of kid you dont want thinking, you just want him doing.
BAMA targeted Beckwith early with lots of underneath and crossing stuff and Beckwith misplayed some of it. But he also punished the receiver a few times too and BAMA got away from it. So the point was made,"I may not get all of you but the one's I get are gonna hurt."
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:01 pm to Salviati
quote:
I wish you would post more.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:04 pm to supatigah
Yep.
Cooper didn't short arm those drops by chance. Lol
Cooper didn't short arm those drops by chance. Lol
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:11 pm to supatigah
quote:I may not always agree with you, but I do respect your opinions. Your posts are rational, and you support your thoughts with facts.
And at the very least, more posts by you would dilute the idiocy of posters like CptBengal.
quote:
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:21 pm to monsterballads
quote:
it was literally his first start ever as a college QB.
on the road. vs a top 5 team.
That's a lot of pressure. The moment was just too big for him. I would have liked to see him get a start at home in a friendly evironment.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:27 pm to Spelt it rong
I have sources who have verified this same story.
Harris: world class talent but immature and hasn't realized that you can't go on talent alone.
Jennings: decent talent. Hard worker. Doesn't show up in games.
I've said on multiple occasions that Harris does not know the playbook. I've also mentioned how a few WRs have told me that Harris sometimes calls his old high school plays in practice/games or mixes multiple plays together.
He will catch on in time.
Harris: world class talent but immature and hasn't realized that you can't go on talent alone.
Jennings: decent talent. Hard worker. Doesn't show up in games.
I've said on multiple occasions that Harris does not know the playbook. I've also mentioned how a few WRs have told me that Harris sometimes calls his old high school plays in practice/games or mixes multiple plays together.
He will catch on in time.
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:33 pm to MMauler
quote:
Maybe it's time for Jennings to transfer to a community college. He clearly doesn't get it and never will. If Les can't see that by now (especially with all the sh!t we went through with Jordan Jefferson), he never will either.
So you're saying that Les should consider a Community College?!?
Posted on 11/12/14 at 5:41 pm to supatigah
quote:That's fine and dandy... to the point when your season is lost and there really isn't a whole lot left to strive for besides a mediocre bowl game that's only slightly better than the next mediocre bowl game.
Cameron sees these two everyday. He discusses the previous week's performance. He watches film with them. He puts in the game plan with them. He sees them in practice. he quizzes them in the meeting room. he knows the knowledge of the offense of both of them. he knows what they both can and cant do.
Jennings plays, Harris doesnt. I am certain they play the guy who they feel gives LSU the best chance to win. So if harris doesnt play, it is because they dont feel like he is ready. Why is this so hard for some people to understand?
There comes a point where one would hope that one of the highest paid coaching staffs in the country could see the bigger picture beyond just next week. I'm not going to speculate about whether that's the case with Jennings/Harris currently, but it's asinine to believe that what's best for the team in 3 days should always take precedence over what's best for the team for the next 3 years.
What is truly "so hard to understand" is how LSU has been so atrocious at QB throughout Miles' tenure for the most part. I don't think it's out of line to question his decision-making regarding QBs given the level of QB play at LSU during his time here.
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