re: Athlon Debate on Les as a Coach

Posted by TheBob

Metairie

Member since Jun 2005

17049 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 1:28 pm to jdg91878

quote:
I can give Saban credit for laying the foundation, as they point out. But, did LES MILES do the same for OKIE ST and Gundy. You bet your arse he did

Not really. While Miles certainly didn't leave Okie State in the shitter, you can't compare the two. Saban left this bitch loaded, and won a national championship. Miles best season was 9 wins, which Gundy has surpassed quite easily.

LSU was in much better shape for Miles than OSU was for Gundy.

Posted by ATLTiger

#TreyBiletnikoffs

Member since Sep 2003

46374 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 1:29 pm to growler

quote:
There will never be another chance to go down as the best college fb team in history.

umm, this yr's team?

Posted by Adam Banks

District 5

Member since Sep 2009

37947 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 1:33 pm to TheBob

quote:
Not really. While Miles certainly didn't leave Okie State in the shitter, you can't compare the two. Saban left this bitch loaded, and won a national championship. Miles best season was 9 wins, which Gundy has surpassed quite easily.

LSU was in much better shape for Miles than OSU was for Gundy.

And OSU was in much worse shape for Miles than LSU was for Saban. Saban inherited a relatively loaded roster. Miles took an Okie state team that had 1 winning season the previous 10 years and turned them around very quickly. Gundy has raised OSU a little bit from where Miles left it. Miles has raised LSU from where Saban left it.

This post was edited on 6/5/12 at 1:34 pm

Posted by dgnx6

Member since Feb 2006

90255 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 1:46 pm to Adam Banks

Les has handle himself well here. The hurricanes, getting rid of RP, and winning the sec after the shite storm of an off season the team had. Lets not forget his sister dying also.

Posted by austiger

Austin

Member since Apr 2012

1064 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 1:54 pm to dgnx6

Agree... folks at a lot of other places would love to have our high class problems. A UGA grad friend of mine tells me all the time that they'd love a guy like Miles in Athens.

And just because you inherit a great situation doesn't mean that you'll keep it going. Let's give the man credit for that.

Posted by dbt_Geaux_Tigers_196

Dystopia (but well cared for)

Member since Mar 2012

25235 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 2:03 pm to togar tiger

quote:
Overall, seems like a pretty positive and fair assessment of him. There's not much I can disagree with there.
Every coach has his flaws, even St. Nick. Miles' screw-ups just seem to be more high-profile than others, and his eccentricities make for good media fodder.
But who else are you going to take (other than Nick)? Meyer, who basically quit for the past 2 years? Stoops, who can't win the big game? Mack Brown and Mark Richt have their pick of 2 of the most talent-rich states in the country and can't do better than Miles.
There is no perfect coach out there, but Miles is great for LSU and has done a superb job, warts and all.

^^^this^^^
Coach Saban is the best going but...there have been a few eggs, as with every other coach. CLM's winning% has been accomplished at the same time as: Saban/UA, Meyer/UF, Petrino/Hogs, AU being consistently good, etc. Personally I've about given up on the image rehab...just point out facts when appropriate. Don't be terribly surprised if the greatest Field Marshall since Hannibal retires batting 500 or worse against Les. Don't be surprised that if by 2020 CLM simply dwarfs every other LSU coach in accomplishment. Let the jokers joke, let the haters hate, and most importantly, let ButtHurtNation continue buying Vaseline in generous supply.

Posted by cas4t

Member since Jan 2010

72167 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 2:07 pm to jdg91878

I think everyone still kinda remembers the time management stuff. That's something you'd never see Saban mess up. I agree Lester deserves more props, but NS is still the best in the country. Imo

Posted by dbt_Geaux_Tigers_196

Dystopia (but well cared for)

Member since Mar 2012

25235 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 2:07 pm to The Mick

quote:
He has overcome that, and so can Miles. Saban was also never viewed as a goof ball. Miles was and worked his way into a "quirky but great coach". Now he's back to quirky and questionable coach.

That's basically the sum of it. Success covers all sins.

Posted by bojabu

Member since Sep 2010

1275 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 2:34 pm to dbt_Geaux_Tigers_196

Saban is viewed as the best because he fits the bill as a coach. Sure, he's 3'9", but aside from that, he's a hard nosed, defense first, top notch recruiter, who leaves teams for better opportunities at the drop of a hat.

Miles on the other hand, is ridiculed because of the way he darts and dodges questions, and b/c of a handful of bad plays made by bad players. But truth be told, he does a great job of bringing in/retaining the right players and the right coaches, has a defense first mentality,and time and time again has stated in more than words that Lsu is his home. I think when he retires, the statue they build of him in front of Tiger Stadium will be twenty feet tall, wearing a hat that stands another four, and in front will be a tiny dwarf named Nick Saban, bent over, getting asspounded the way they'll say Les did "almost all his career at Lsu".

Posted by udtiger

Over your left shoulder

Member since Nov 2006

115894 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 3:28 pm to jdg91878

Les did himself no favors on January 9, 2012.

Posted by JOJO Hammer

Member since Nov 2010

12426 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 3:31 pm to jdg91878

quote:
Bama and Saban used politics to undeservedly play for the title last year

Bama was the with out a doubt the second best team in the nation last year leading up to the NCG. After that game there was no doubt they were the best team in the nation. So they 100% deserved to be there.

Posted by bojabu

Member since Sep 2010

1275 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 3:38 pm to JOJO Hammer

quote:
Bama was the with out a doubt the second best team in the nation last year leading up to the NCG. After that game there was no doubt they were the best team in the nation. So they 100% deserved to be there.

And their resume` proved it too.

Posted by Labsolut

Wilmington, NC

Member since Aug 2009

358 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 3:44 pm to jdg91878

Amazing that this still gets debated. Miles is a great coach. He got outcoached in the BSCNC, which sucked. Saban is a great coach. If the discussion needs to be about "living off of other coaches players", all BAMA coaches indirectly live off of "The Bear". They fire 9-3 coaches. BAMA has more horsepower than any D1 football program, period. They hadn't maximized it in a while, but St. Nick has. Les is the most successful coach in our history, and will continue to build on that as long as he doesn't get sick of B.S. As far as the best coaches in the SEC, how can we not mention Spurrier? He has taken a total pile of shite program with no winning tradition or history of success and given it life. I hope we whip his arse in BR this year, but we better be ready, because his team will be.

Posted by floridatiger2

Member since Sep 2006

622 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 3:49 pm to zip25

'So you think Miles is a better coach than Saban? I agree that Miles doesn't get the respect he may deserve, but can you really disagree with anyone who says that Saban is clearly the best coach in the SEC?'

saban was a media creation (last year); didn't earn his spot but got the media to work for him; great politician. saban for president !

Posted by RogerTheShrubber

Juneau, AK

Member since Jan 2009

299716 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 3:55 pm to floridatiger2

quote:

saban was a media creation (last year); didn't earn his spot but got the media to work for him; great politician. saban for president !

Actually think Saban did his best coaching job (at Bama) last year.

Posted by TenTex

Member since Jan 2008

15949 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 3:56 pm to jdg91878

The Bama Fans I know in Tennessee were on the verge of a meltdown going into the NC game. If JJ had played football in the NC game and come away with another win it would have been very ugly in T Town. The only way to reverse that is to win an NC which Saban did thanks to JJ. Bama reminds me of Bernie Madoff. It looks so good on the outside, but on the inside there are some severe cracks.

Posted by WildTchoupitoulas

Member since Jan 2010

44071 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 4:59 pm to TigerCard

quote:
What an idiotic thing to say.

I'm going to have to agree here.

A quick analysis shows that among the best recruting classes, 12 losses from 2008-2011 isn't that bad.

First recruiting class rankings 2005-2010 (Rivals):

LSU 22, 7, 4, 11, 2, 6 - 10.4 avg rank
OkU 3, 9, 14, 6, 13, 7 - 10.4 avg
USC 1, 1, 2, 8, 4, 1 - 3.4 avg
UF 15, 2, 1, 3, 11, 2 - 6.8 avg
UGA 10, 4, 9, 7, 6, 15 - 10.2 avg
UT 20, 5, 5, 14, 5, 3 - 10.4 avg
FSU 2, 3, 21, 9, 7, 10 - 10.4 avg

Now records 2008-2011:

LSU 41-12
OkU 42-12
USC 39-12
UF 41-13
UGA 34-19
UT 38-14
FSU 35-18

Talent to losses ratio:

LSU .867
OkU .867
USC .283
UF .523
UGA .537
UT .743
FSU .578

First of all, LSU is not at the top of Rivals average class rankings for the years that would effect the games played from 2008-2011. The perception that somehow LSU has amassed better talent than anyone else is just misguided.

Second, of the teams listed with equal or better average class rankings, LSU is tied for the most efficient with Oklahoma for losses given the talent level based on recruting classes.

So while the idea that LSU should not have lost so many games in the last 4 years, neither should any of those other schools, most of which had more losses with equal to or better class rankings.

Posted by LSU GrandDad

houston, texas

Member since Jun 2009

21564 posts

Posted on 6/5/12 at 5:12 pm to togar tiger

quote:
But who else are you going to take (other than Nick)? Meyer, who basically quit for the past 2 years? Stoops, who can't win the big game? Mack Brown and Mark Richt have their pick of 2 of the most talent-rich states in the country and can't do better than Miles.

and meyer, brown and richt consistently "rank" higher than miles on these damn coach ranking lists. for whatever reason, miles gets shellacked from lots of media folks when he lays an egg. these other guys seem immune from the "personalized" nature of the critisism. anyone that says saban doesn't lay eggs doesn't remember them. ditto the other coaches.