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Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:37 pm to CP3LSU25
quote:
frick wal mart and Coca Cola
Easier said than done. Multi-billion dollar corporations frick back. Like I said, I'm all for it. But I'm highly skeptical that it will happen.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:39 pm to bird35
quote:
This is a great idea to promote healthy eating for the poor.
I agree and that's a point no one has really hit. The current model isn't doing anything to decrease obesity and with all the complaints about "food deserts", this could help promote healthier diets. That'll only benefit us all in the long term.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:40 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
I've always been a fan of having government run grocery stores specifically for the food stamp crowd
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:40 pm to therick711
quote:I think we should try improvements. I question whether this would be one. I don't accept faux-panic arguments along the lines of "We have to do something" -> "This is something" -> "We have to do this!"
Well, by the numbers, the current system doesn't achieve the vast majority of its stated goals, so we should either try something possibly better or scrap it.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:45 pm to Iosh
Oh, I didn't say that. I said do you think we should improve it or scrap it. I think everyone would agree that it has failed in its goals.
Problems with the current system that render it a failure:
It is rampant with fraud
It is poorly understood
It is overutilized
It is inefficient on a cost basis
It creates anti-work incentives for which the beneficiaries cannot be blamed for taking into account
Its restrictions are easily circumvented
It allows non-eligible items to be obtained more easily
The amount of users has actually grown over time
It doesn't function as a safety net as intended
It imposes implementation costs on private actors
It does not promote a healthy diet of any kind despite being deceptively named as a nutrition program.
Problems with the current system that render it a failure:
It is rampant with fraud
It is poorly understood
It is overutilized
It is inefficient on a cost basis
It creates anti-work incentives for which the beneficiaries cannot be blamed for taking into account
Its restrictions are easily circumvented
It allows non-eligible items to be obtained more easily
The amount of users has actually grown over time
It doesn't function as a safety net as intended
It imposes implementation costs on private actors
It does not promote a healthy diet of any kind despite being deceptively named as a nutrition program.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:45 pm to Iosh
quote:
I don't accept faux-panic arguments along the lines of "We have to do something
Of course we have to do something. Are we really going to let politics shame us into kicking the can down the road once again? Hate Trump all you want, but he is the perfect patsy for reform that would be political suicide for anyone else.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:47 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
BamaAtl
Typical what have you done for me lately “democrat” mentality. And you people wonder why......
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:48 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
1. Poor people can't cook. You give most of them a bag of rice or beans, they would have no idea what to do with it. (city poor people)
2. I agree that the extra logistics are not necessary. They should just severely restrict what can be bought, via the card. The technology is there. It is already being used on the EBT cards to prevent non food items being bought.
2. I agree that the extra logistics are not necessary. They should just severely restrict what can be bought, via the card. The technology is there. It is already being used on the EBT cards to prevent non food items being bought.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:49 pm to The Spleen
quote:
The fraud doesn't really occur with teh end users, it occurs with vendors that accept EBT cards.
If Customer X tries to buy cigarettes with his EBT card, and Business Y let's him ring up 2 or 3 Mountain Dews to offset the price, they are both at fault.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:51 pm to Vacherie Saint
quote:I'm interested in substantive cuts to substantive programs. Not speculative bullshite that might or might not actually save money on a program whose percentage of GDP would be about a single pixel on that graph. This is a high-visibility, low-impact bullet point in a DOA budget proposal designed to elicit a favorable reaction from people who forward "muh EBT lobster" chain e-mails. In that sense the job has already been done. Congratulations to the Trump Administration for winning again!
Of course we have to do something. Are we really going to let politics shame us into kicking the can down the road once again? Hate Trump all you want, but he is the perfect patsy for reform that would be political suicide for anyone else.
This post was edited on 2/12/18 at 4:54 pm
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:51 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
Account for a family without a stable address. Or a family that's effectively homeless. Or a family that has their 'food parcel' stolen from their doorstep. Or a package that's lost in the mail.
All of these issues can be dealt with while getting the program put together. Just because there are issues with the initial idea, doesn't mean you scrap the whole thing.
quote:
Guess Americans can starve so you can live out your ignorant Randian fantasies, eh?
hunger is a hell of a motivator
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:52 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
've always been a fan of having government run grocery stores specifically for the food stamp crowd
I’ve always wondered why the Food Stamp program isn’t run the same way WIC is. A list of healthy foods to choose from...everything else is blocked from purchase. Some cities even have WIC “stores” where you can pick that stuff up.
If the Dems try to block it, which they will, the Repubs should offer to increase everyone’s benefits by 10% if they accept. It would end up saving at least 10%.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:52 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
Rice, beans, flour, etc. Staples delivered straight to the homes...
I prefer they go pick it up at a distribution center, but this would be just fine.
I prefer they go pick it up at a distribution center, but this would be just fine.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:52 pm to Iosh
What will be the solution if this program is actually implemented and recipients just start selling the food they receive?
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:55 pm to The Spleen
quote:
You don't think there would be massive corruption with corporations wanting their food in those packages?
Sounds like a good idea for a coporate sponsor. They donate the food, the taxpayers save money.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:55 pm to Iosh
quote:
I'm interested in substantive cuts to substantive programs. Not speculative bullshite that might or might not actually save money on a program whose percentage of GDP wouldn't even be a single pixel on that graph. This is a high-visibility, low-impact bullshite in a DOA budget proposal designed to elicit a favorable reaction from people who forward "muh EBT lobster" chain e-mails. In that sense the job has already been done. Congratulations to the Trump Administration for winning again!
If it is low impact, why the outrage at the idea? It belies the real issue. I don't think people should get to have "choice" AND free stuff. If you want free stuff, it should be selected for you in a way that benefits society the most. If you want "choice," you earn that for yourself. I think treating entitlement programs as an engine to create the kind of society you want is high impact, personally.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:56 pm to The Spleen
quote:
What will be the solution if this program is actually implemented and recipients just start selling the food they receive?
The same solution we have now for those that abuse the system.
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:56 pm to The Spleen
quote:
What will be the solution if this program is actually implemented and recipients just start selling the food they receive?
They starve to death. Problem solved.
You do realize that selling the food would be far more difficult than selling the EBT credits, right?
Posted on 2/12/18 at 4:58 pm to shinerfan
It's like you don't even understand the street value of a 5 lbs bag of rice. 
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