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Started By
Message
re: The Saints have been the third-biggest spenders in free agency
Posted on 3/22/23 at 9:14 am to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 3/22/23 at 9:14 am to SlowFlowPro
The dead money is value factored in at signing.
But they never see that HUGE last year, which is RARELY guaranteed for any player we sign, which means the actual per year average we pay them is always less than on paper. So whether they are on the team at the end or not, the per year is less, and the dead money just evens out those extremely cheap first years.
The only limits are unexpected cap decreases (covid), massive unexpected cuts (Galette), and what the owner is willing to pay.
Anyone else, if we wanted them and agreed to the value they put on themselves, we would sign them. We didn't have the same value on Williams or Onyemata that they and other teams put on them. It isn't always the right call, but we stick to our valuation system.
I REALLY don't think you get the cap.
But they never see that HUGE last year, which is RARELY guaranteed for any player we sign, which means the actual per year average we pay them is always less than on paper. So whether they are on the team at the end or not, the per year is less, and the dead money just evens out those extremely cheap first years.
The only limits are unexpected cap decreases (covid), massive unexpected cuts (Galette), and what the owner is willing to pay.
Anyone else, if we wanted them and agreed to the value they put on themselves, we would sign them. We didn't have the same value on Williams or Onyemata that they and other teams put on them. It isn't always the right call, but we stick to our valuation system.
I REALLY don't think you get the cap.
This post was edited on 3/22/23 at 9:16 am
1
Posted on 3/22/23 at 9:26 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
And you're OK with losing 10-30% of your cap every year with dead money
Absolutely. It is the cost of doing business. The question is why the frick do you care?
Posted on 3/22/23 at 9:55 am to saints5021
quote:
The question is why the frick do you care?
Because that limitation will prevent us from assembling a roster that's a likely Super Bowl contender.
I don't want to settle for maybe being a playoff team in perpetuity.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 9:57 am to bonethug0180
quote:
The only limits are unexpected cap decreases (covid), massive unexpected cuts (Galette), and what the owner is willing to pay.
Or bad contracts (Taysom Hill, Andrus Peat, Macus Maye, Tyrann Mathieu, etc.).
If Carr is only above average, we are F'd. That contract is going to be an albatross to get out from, especially once we restructure his $30M base next year.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 10:46 am to iBack8569
quote:
Khai Harley is a fricking wizard.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 12:33 pm to paulbeasy
quote:
No we wouldnt. Those guys were bought by over-spenders (I.e. not the Saints). Marcus Williams contract is $70 million - huge overpay
How can you over pay if the salary cap isn’t real?
quote:
Mayes' contract is $28 million total - less than 1/2 Williams contract and reasonable.
Is the talent comparable? Also what is the benefit of getting a cheaper player if the salary cap isn’t real.
This post was edited on 3/22/23 at 1:49 pm
Posted on 3/22/23 at 12:58 pm to H-Town Tiger
quote:
Also what is the benefit of getting a cheaper player is the salary cap isn’t real.
They refuse to answer this, especially considering their argument is based in our owner willing to write checks (for signing bonuses).
Posted on 3/22/23 at 1:11 pm to H-Town Tiger
quote:
How can you over pay if the salary cap isn’t real?
Also what is the benefit of getting a cheaper player is the salary cap isn’t real.
These 2 statements should end the thread, but it’s ST so…
Posted on 3/22/23 at 2:29 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
They refuse to answer this, especially considering their argument is based in our owner willing to write checks (for signing bonuses).
It would make zero sense to sign a cheaper but lesser player if the salary cap wasn’t “real”.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 3:07 pm to H-Town Tiger
quote:
How can you over pay if the salary cap isn’t real?
Because there is this one little bitty thing you are overlooking: the cash is real and the owner has to pay it.
Bigger contracts mean bigger signing bonuses and money up front.
If they don't think a player is worth it, it's better to find value elsewhere. This part doesn't always go well, but that is the logic.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 4:11 pm to bonethug0180
quote:
Because there is this one little bitty thing you are overlooking: the cash is real and the owner has to pay it. Bigger contracts mean bigger signing bonuses and money up front.
If it was a matter of the owner being cheap, wouldn’t that apply to all the players and not just some? Just sounds like an excuse we let play X walk because they didn’t want to pay him and it’s not because they couldn’t afford to keep him under the cap
Eta there are of course times you can let a player walk because you don’t want to pay him and or think he’s no good. but there are also obviously times the Saints have let players walk that were cap casualties that they would have liked to keep but were forced to make a decision based on the available cap dollars
This post was edited on 3/22/23 at 4:36 pm
Posted on 3/22/23 at 4:21 pm to H-Town Tiger
its not exactly "the cap isn't real", but there's a finite number of money we can borrow in future years.
Reality is, owners who can spend can borrow millions in the next 2-3 years to spend now. Other owners can't.
That being said, you're still not just going to sign everyone to sign everyone, there's a limitation on what you want to do.
Reality is, owners who can spend can borrow millions in the next 2-3 years to spend now. Other owners can't.
That being said, you're still not just going to sign everyone to sign everyone, there's a limitation on what you want to do.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 4:52 pm to bonethug0180
Hey Bone. Nice to see ya enjoy your post sir!
Posted on 3/22/23 at 5:37 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Because that limitation will prevent us from assembling a roster that's a likely Super Bowl contender.
Because no Super Bowl winning team has EVER had a bad contract on the roster, or dead money. EVER. Right?
Newsflash, this is not the standard for SB success.
It literally has never been the metric for SB success.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 6:06 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
If Carr is only above average, we are F'd
If Carr is only "above average" then we are paying him appropriately at 30 million.
Star QB's in this league make over 45 million a year. fricking Daniel Jones got 40 million a year.
Your just clueless bud. QB's making 20 per year went bye bye about 10 years ago.
How much you think "above average" qb's are supposed to get paid??????????
Posted on 3/22/23 at 6:23 pm to goatmilker
You as well goat!
I still lurk from time to time, but hard to post with the climate here most of the time.
I still lurk from time to time, but hard to post with the climate here most of the time.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 6:34 pm to paulbeasy
quote:
If Carr is only "above average" then we are paying him appropriately at 30 million.
Star QB's in this league make over 45 million a year. fricking Daniel Jones got 40 million a year.
Your just clueless bud. QB's making 20 per year went bye bye about 10 years ago.
How much you think "above average" qb's are supposed to get paid??????????
It's not shocking you missed the point
If he's above average we won't sniff a super bowl and will destroy future years of the cap.
Posted on 3/22/23 at 7:56 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
It's not shocking you missed the point
If he's above average we won't sniff a super bowl and will destroy future years of the cap.
Anndd its not shocking that you missed the point, which is that above average qb's get paid. You think the Saints made a mistake? Tell me which above average QB you think exists, that costs cheap and can win a SB? You got nothing bud.
Daniel Jones getting 40 million. DWatson 50 million. They have not won SB or been remote close.
Carr at 30 is a steal in comparison.
By your evaluation the Saints would only be smart if they had Mahomes - the only guy getting paid 45 mill plus that has won a SB.
No words for your stupidity.
This post was edited on 3/22/23 at 9:04 pm
Posted on 3/22/23 at 9:04 pm to bonethug0180
quote:
I still lurk from time to time, but hard to post with the climate here most of the time.
Post quality is lacking on this board.
Posted on 3/23/23 at 9:04 am to SlowFlowPro
AMEN!! Well said and Dead on balls accurate!!
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