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Posted on 10/15/16 at 10:55 am to EvrybodysAllAmerican
I like Orgeron but his past has me skeptical. He seems much improved but at the moment any change to LSU is good.
Posted on 10/15/16 at 11:12 am to Datbayoubengal
quote:
He'll fire up this already uber talented and very experienced team and win no less than 5 regular season games, but even if he only has one loss or no regular season losses, almost all that experienced and immense talent will be gone after this year. We have no idea how he can run a program 24/7, 365, and his ability to sustain success
So we are not going to have any talent next year? Returning qb, most of oline 2deep and guice. More than half of Dline 2deep, Key, lose 2lb but White, Divinity, and Alexander will have plenty of experience. Our 2nd and 3rd corner are returning and now that RJ is out Battle will be starting and returning.
On that recruiting wiishlist on the bottom of your post, the only coach we hire that probably gets those 5 kids is O. He's up there with Saban as a recruiter and if he wins out he would be walking high school halls with HC of LSU on his chest not Ole Miss
Posted on 10/15/16 at 2:11 pm to Datbayoubengal
I almost get tired of upvoting your comments bro 
Posted on 10/15/16 at 2:19 pm to Random LSU Hero
I'm not sure I want this. I love coach O, but man...he comes with a price. The chance of him recruiting dirty and jeopardizing our program with sanctions. He has a rough history with Ole Miss and USC.
Posted on 10/15/16 at 2:33 pm to TheCaterpillar
I understand exactly where you are coming from but even O acknowledges that he ran Ole Miss wrong. He said he tried to run it like a Dline coach which was the wrong approach. He said he learned a lot from USC about delegating.
That would be awesome but what if O were head coach and let his Off Coordinator match wits. I mean I doubt Saban is over there telling Kiffin plays to run all the time. I think he lets Kiffin game-plan and sometimes gets upset with the results of the calls. Key here is to hire top notch coordinators and let them and their position coaches coach. Aranda was hired to be smarter than the off coord across the field and stop them. He wasn't hired to let the head coach dictate his play calling (otherwise you could hire an idiot if head coach is going to meddle with his play calling).
At LSU Miles could have been the best coach ever if he would have just been the overseer of the staff and team instead of meddling with everything. If we could hire a great Off Coord as head coach with Aranda as Def Coord, then I am all for it. But really we just need a manager if we can hire the right coordinators.
quote:
LSU fans have been craving an intelligent head coach that matches wit with guys like Saban and Meyer.
That would be awesome but what if O were head coach and let his Off Coordinator match wits. I mean I doubt Saban is over there telling Kiffin plays to run all the time. I think he lets Kiffin game-plan and sometimes gets upset with the results of the calls. Key here is to hire top notch coordinators and let them and their position coaches coach. Aranda was hired to be smarter than the off coord across the field and stop them. He wasn't hired to let the head coach dictate his play calling (otherwise you could hire an idiot if head coach is going to meddle with his play calling).
At LSU Miles could have been the best coach ever if he would have just been the overseer of the staff and team instead of meddling with everything. If we could hire a great Off Coord as head coach with Aranda as Def Coord, then I am all for it. But really we just need a manager if we can hire the right coordinators.
Posted on 10/15/16 at 3:15 pm to tigersaint26
quote:
I understand exactly where you are coming from but even O acknowledges that he ran Ole Miss wrong. He said he tried to run it like a Dline coach which was the wrong approach. He said he learned a lot from USC about delegating
Just because he admitted he ran ole miss wrong, does not mean he knows how to do it right today. He hasn't shown anybody that he can run a program full time.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 1:12 pm to Arkansasrazorback
quote:
Please 8 pound 6 ounce baby Jesus let LSU hire Ed Orgeron. The SEC West needs an auto win for the rest of the division....
hmmm. kind of looks like Arky has resumed it's roll as the SEC West auto-win.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 1:43 pm to Klark Kent
O having sustained success will be dependent on always having 2 elite coordinators. That's a fact. And it's a big problem.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 1:52 pm to tigersaint26
quote:
I understand exactly where you are coming from but even O acknowledges that he ran Ole Miss wrong. He said he tried to run it like a Dline coach which was the wrong approach. He said he learned a lot from USC about delegating.
Why does it matter what he says? You think he'd say otherwise? The facts are the facts. He's had success as an interim HC, which is not even remotely close to what it takes to build and maintain a successful program.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 1:55 pm to Tiger Ryno
quote:
O having sustained success will be dependent on always having 2 elite coordinators. That's a fact. And it's a big problem.
Correct
I don't know how some folks just can't face the facts. He has not earned the right to be HC at LSU. He was our DL coach a month ago for frick's sake.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:05 pm to cas4t
quote:
quote:
O having sustained success will be dependent on always having 2 elite coordinators. That's a fact. And it's a big problem.
Correct
I don't know how some folks just can't face the facts. He has not earned the right to be HC at LSU. He was our DL coach a month ago for frick's sake.
agreed with both of you. We had that in lestard already. Couldn't coach his way out of a wet paper sack on offense. I want a coach great at one side of the ball who can coach that side if need be.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:06 pm to cas4t
quote:
cas4t
I do not see O being a "lock" unless he wins the natty.
This team was supposed to make the playoffs with les for crying out loud and that probably means they expected LSU to win the SECCG en route to the playoffs.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:09 pm to Tiger Ryno
quote:
O having sustained success will be dependent on always having 2 elite coordinators. That's a fact. And it's a big problem.
Even the Sabans and Meyers go out and hire the best coordinators they can find. Y'all are making the whole "you must be an expert on one side of the field to be a HC" thing wayyyyyy overblown.
Urban had Herman who many on here say is an offensive genius even though Urban is known for offense himself.
Saban lost Kirby and went out and hired a top 5 DC in Pruitt.
This post was edited on 10/24/16 at 2:13 pm
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:12 pm to Mickey Goldmill
quote:
Even the Sabans and Meyers go out and hire the best coordinators they can find.
quote:
"you must be an expert on one side of the field to be a HC" thing wayyyyyy overblown.
and youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu are missiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiing
theeeeeeeeeeeeeee poiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnnnt
obviously
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:19 pm to Fat Bastard
Ok then explain it to me. Because I thought the point was that it's easier to only have to find 1 elite coordinator since your HC is already elite on one side of the ball.
And I just showed two examples of how even the best HCs who are "experts" on one side of the ball STILL go out and hire the best coordinators around.
Point being: You need the best possible assistant coaches regardless of the expertise of the HC. Clearly Urban and Saban both feel that way at least.
And I just showed two examples of how even the best HCs who are "experts" on one side of the ball STILL go out and hire the best coordinators around.
Point being: You need the best possible assistant coaches regardless of the expertise of the HC. Clearly Urban and Saban both feel that way at least.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:30 pm to Mickey Goldmill
quote:
Saban lost Kirby and went out and hired a top 5 DC in Pruitt.
Why wouldn't he get the best coordinator he can? He's 64, he can't do everything himself. Why wouldn't you want a coordinator that understands the game as well as you do or at least close to it?
That said I have no doubt he still has a heavy influence on game planning. He doesn't simply let his coordinators do the game planning without his input and approval. Two great minds are better than one. In any business you want to surround yourself with people that may see things that are in your blind spot.
Contrast that with Aranda and Orgeron. Who on the team is he going to consult if he needs input? He can't go to his boss because his boss doesn't know dip about defense despite having coached that side of the ball for decades.
This post was edited on 10/24/16 at 2:34 pm
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:35 pm to Goldrush25
Yeah but the end result is the same...You work your arse off trying to get the best possible coordinators out there. So the job isn't any "easier" for Saban or Meyer even though they are experts themselves.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:37 pm to Goldrush25
quote:
Contrast that with Aranda and Orgeron. Who on the team is he going to consult if he needs input? He can't go to his boss because his boss doesn't know dip about defense despite having coached that side of the ball for decades.
Ed Orgeron doesn't know dip about defense?
Your coordinator, if they are any good, usually isn't deferring the to HC all the time. We saw that under Miles and see how that always turned out.
Posted on 10/24/16 at 2:48 pm to Mickey Goldmill
quote:
Yeah but the end result is the same...You work your arse off trying to get the best possible coordinators out there. So the job isn't any "easier" for Saban or Meyer even though they are experts themselves.
I don't think the results are the same. I believe the accumulation of human capital is reflected in the team.
Don't know what easy has to do with it as guys like Saban and Meyer are going to outwork everyone else too. Guys like them will stack the deck with every possible advantage they can obtain because it all adds up. I don't think LSU can shortcut their way to those results by hiring a HC that isn't an expert on his side of the ball and think great coordinators can prop him up. Saban has great coordinators, AND SABAN.
quote:
Ed Orgeron doesn't know dip about defense?
Relatively speaking of course. He's knows far more than I do. He knows far less than Aranda.
quote:
Your coordinator, if they are any good, usually isn't deferring the to HC all the time. We saw that under Miles and see how that always turned out
The opposite, a hands off approach, is problematic as well. The HC has to make key decisions in high leverage moments. How can someone like O do that when both of his coordinators are more knowledgeable than he is? I think the best coaches strike a balance between micromanaging and being hands off. Neither approach is optimal.
This post was edited on 10/24/16 at 3:02 pm
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