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Message
re: tv show about the JFK assassination coming up on the History Channel.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 12:50 pm to tigerfan84
Posted on 2/14/23 at 12:50 pm to tigerfan84
quote:
A man named James Files claims to have been the shooter from the Knoll.
So would that have been the clean bullet hole in the front windshield that people at the hospital witnessed and people at the Ford Factory saw?
1
Posted on 2/14/23 at 12:56 pm to L1C4
On Netflix there is JFK: the Smoking gun documentary. The conclusion was the fatal shot came from a Secret Service agent from the car behind JFK. Supposedly after the first 2 shots the agent, George Hickie, picked up a Colt AR and accidentally shot JFK in the head.
Is that what really happened? It was interesting but whether true or not, no way I believe Oswald acted alone nor was anything was an accident.
Is that what really happened? It was interesting but whether true or not, no way I believe Oswald acted alone nor was anything was an accident.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:01 pm to Kino74
quote:
accidentally shot JFK in the head
Totally false.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:10 pm to L1C4
We've had many of these threads before and i'll repeat what i always do:
1) I liked the movie JFK too. It was NOT a documentary.
2) After watching a special on JFK in the 2000's, where every aspect of the assassination was examined and replicated, it was pretty apparent, Oswald was the lone gunman.
3) The connections everyone tries to make does not follow a coherent timeline. These people that the movie said "died mysteriously" right before the trial, actually died many years later, and those people, themselves state that Garrison lied about their statements.
4) Garrison was a desparate lawyer looking to make a name for himself. He nearly got disbarred for falsifying testimonies in previous trials.
5) There's also a website that goes into debunking everything in the movie, JFK.
6) Multiple scientific and unbiased gunshot tests have disproven the conspiracy that the shot came from the grassy knoll. LINK
7) Nothing i say here will sway anyone that is determined to believe the JFK assassination was a conspiracy. There are even people that think the RFK assassination was a conspiracy.
1) I liked the movie JFK too. It was NOT a documentary.
2) After watching a special on JFK in the 2000's, where every aspect of the assassination was examined and replicated, it was pretty apparent, Oswald was the lone gunman.
3) The connections everyone tries to make does not follow a coherent timeline. These people that the movie said "died mysteriously" right before the trial, actually died many years later, and those people, themselves state that Garrison lied about their statements.
4) Garrison was a desparate lawyer looking to make a name for himself. He nearly got disbarred for falsifying testimonies in previous trials.
5) There's also a website that goes into debunking everything in the movie, JFK.
6) Multiple scientific and unbiased gunshot tests have disproven the conspiracy that the shot came from the grassy knoll. LINK
7) Nothing i say here will sway anyone that is determined to believe the JFK assassination was a conspiracy. There are even people that think the RFK assassination was a conspiracy.
This post was edited on 2/14/23 at 1:12 pm
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:28 pm to BugAC
I don't use the movie as a documentary. I've never looked at it that way.
Just some of the testimony and docs lay ground work for skepticism.
Where did the clean bullet hole come from in the windshield?
It can be seen in a photo outside the hospital. Then the windshield disappears at the Ford plant and I don't think that evidence is addressed in the reports.
Just some of the testimony and docs lay ground work for skepticism.
Where did the clean bullet hole come from in the windshield?
It can be seen in a photo outside the hospital. Then the windshield disappears at the Ford plant and I don't think that evidence is addressed in the reports.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:30 pm to jp4lsu
quote:
Where did the clean bullet hole come from in the windshield?
I don't know what you are talking about, link?
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:31 pm to BugAC
One of the documentaries I saw showed the limo outside the hospital and you can see a clean small hole in it. They had a lady from an interview say she saw it.
I'll have to see what doc that was.
Here is the info in text that I remember from the documentary. I think it is from "The men who killed Kennedy".
(4) Mr. George Whitaker, Sr., a senior manager at the Ford Motor Company's Rouge Plant in Detroit, Michigan, told attorney (and professor of criminal justice) Doug Weldon in August of 1993, in a tape recorded conversation, that after reporting to work on Monday, November 25th, he discovered the JFK limousine---a unique, one-of-a-kind item that he unequivocally identified---in the Rouge Plant's B building, with the interior stripped out and in the process of being replaced, and with the windshield removed. He was then contacted by one of the Vice Presidents of the division for which he worked, and directed to report to the glass plant lab, immediately. After knocking on the locked door (which he found most unusual), he was let in by two of his subordinates and discovered that they were in possession of the windshield that had been removed from the JFK limousine. They had been told to use it as a template, and to make a new windshield identical to it in shape---and to then get the new windshield back to the B building for installation in the Presidential limousine that was quickly being rebuilt. Whitaker told Weldon (quoting from the audiotape of the 1993 interview): "And the windshield had a bullet hole in it, coming from the outside through...it was a good, clean bullet hole, right straight through, from the front. And you can tell, when the bullet hits the windshield, like when you hit a rock or something, what happens? The back chips out and the front may just have a pinhole in it...this had a clean round hole in the front and fragmentation coming out the back." Whitaker told Weldon that he eventually became superintendent of his division and was placed in charge of five plant divisions. He also told Weldon that the original windshield, with the bullet hole in it, had been broken up and scrapped---as ordered---after the new windshield had been made.
When Doug Weldon interviewed Whitaker in August of 1993, his witness insisted on anonymity. Weldon reported on the story without releasing Whitaker's name in his excellent and comprehensive article titled: "The Kennedy Limousine: Dallas 1963," which was published in Jim Fetzer's anthology Murder in Dealey Plaza, in 2000. After Weldon interviewed Whitaker in August of 1993, Mr. Whitaker subsequently---on November 22, 1993 (the 30th anniversary of President Kennedy's assassination)---wrote down all he could remember about the events he witnessed involving the Presidential limousine and its windshield. After George Whitaker's death in 2001, his family released his written testament to Nigel Turner, who with their permission revealed Mr. Whitaker's name, as well as the text of his "memo for history," in episode 7 of The Men Who Killed Kennedy, "The Smoking Guns."
In "The Smoking Guns," the text of Whitaker's memo can be read on the screen employing freeze frame technology with the DVD of the episode. It said, in part: "When [I] arrived at the lab the door was locked. I was let in. There were 2 glass engineers there. They had a car windshield that had a bullet hole in it. The hole was about 4 or 6 inches to the right of the rear view mirror [as viewed from the front]. The impact had come from the front of the windshield. (If you have spent 40 years in the glass [illegible] you know which way the impack [sic] was from.)"
(5) The sixth credible witness to a bullet hole in the windshield of the limousine was Secret Service agent Charles Taylor, Jr., who wrote a report on November 27, 1963 in which he detailed his activities providing security for the limousine immediately after the car's return to Washington following the assassination. The JFK limousine and the Secret Service follow-up car known as the "Queen Mary" arrived at Andrews AFB aboard a C-130 propeller-driven cargo plane at about 8:00 PM on November 22, 1963. Agent Taylor rode in the Presidential limousine as it was driven from Andrews AFB to the White House garage at 22nd and M Streets, N.W. In his report about what he witnessed inside the White House garage during the vehicle's inspection, he wrote: "In addition, of particular note was the small hole just left of center in the windshield from which what appeared to be bullet fragments were removed."
I'll have to see what doc that was.
Here is the info in text that I remember from the documentary. I think it is from "The men who killed Kennedy".
(4) Mr. George Whitaker, Sr., a senior manager at the Ford Motor Company's Rouge Plant in Detroit, Michigan, told attorney (and professor of criminal justice) Doug Weldon in August of 1993, in a tape recorded conversation, that after reporting to work on Monday, November 25th, he discovered the JFK limousine---a unique, one-of-a-kind item that he unequivocally identified---in the Rouge Plant's B building, with the interior stripped out and in the process of being replaced, and with the windshield removed. He was then contacted by one of the Vice Presidents of the division for which he worked, and directed to report to the glass plant lab, immediately. After knocking on the locked door (which he found most unusual), he was let in by two of his subordinates and discovered that they were in possession of the windshield that had been removed from the JFK limousine. They had been told to use it as a template, and to make a new windshield identical to it in shape---and to then get the new windshield back to the B building for installation in the Presidential limousine that was quickly being rebuilt. Whitaker told Weldon (quoting from the audiotape of the 1993 interview): "And the windshield had a bullet hole in it, coming from the outside through...it was a good, clean bullet hole, right straight through, from the front. And you can tell, when the bullet hits the windshield, like when you hit a rock or something, what happens? The back chips out and the front may just have a pinhole in it...this had a clean round hole in the front and fragmentation coming out the back." Whitaker told Weldon that he eventually became superintendent of his division and was placed in charge of five plant divisions. He also told Weldon that the original windshield, with the bullet hole in it, had been broken up and scrapped---as ordered---after the new windshield had been made.
When Doug Weldon interviewed Whitaker in August of 1993, his witness insisted on anonymity. Weldon reported on the story without releasing Whitaker's name in his excellent and comprehensive article titled: "The Kennedy Limousine: Dallas 1963," which was published in Jim Fetzer's anthology Murder in Dealey Plaza, in 2000. After Weldon interviewed Whitaker in August of 1993, Mr. Whitaker subsequently---on November 22, 1993 (the 30th anniversary of President Kennedy's assassination)---wrote down all he could remember about the events he witnessed involving the Presidential limousine and its windshield. After George Whitaker's death in 2001, his family released his written testament to Nigel Turner, who with their permission revealed Mr. Whitaker's name, as well as the text of his "memo for history," in episode 7 of The Men Who Killed Kennedy, "The Smoking Guns."
In "The Smoking Guns," the text of Whitaker's memo can be read on the screen employing freeze frame technology with the DVD of the episode. It said, in part: "When [I] arrived at the lab the door was locked. I was let in. There were 2 glass engineers there. They had a car windshield that had a bullet hole in it. The hole was about 4 or 6 inches to the right of the rear view mirror [as viewed from the front]. The impact had come from the front of the windshield. (If you have spent 40 years in the glass [illegible] you know which way the impack [sic] was from.)"
(5) The sixth credible witness to a bullet hole in the windshield of the limousine was Secret Service agent Charles Taylor, Jr., who wrote a report on November 27, 1963 in which he detailed his activities providing security for the limousine immediately after the car's return to Washington following the assassination. The JFK limousine and the Secret Service follow-up car known as the "Queen Mary" arrived at Andrews AFB aboard a C-130 propeller-driven cargo plane at about 8:00 PM on November 22, 1963. Agent Taylor rode in the Presidential limousine as it was driven from Andrews AFB to the White House garage at 22nd and M Streets, N.W. In his report about what he witnessed inside the White House garage during the vehicle's inspection, he wrote: "In addition, of particular note was the small hole just left of center in the windshield from which what appeared to be bullet fragments were removed."
This post was edited on 2/14/23 at 1:42 pm
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:33 pm to L1C4
quote:
For all you theorists
fify
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:35 pm to jp4lsu
LINK
FWIW, this is the documentary from 2003 that dispelled a bunch of the conspiracies behind the movie, JFK.
LINK
One of the things people don't realize is that the open top car kennedy was riding in was not a standard car. It was retrofitted and connelly's seat was situated a few inches towards the center of the car and either sat lower or higher (lower i think, can't remember) than the president's seat so the President was more visable.
FWIW, this is the documentary from 2003 that dispelled a bunch of the conspiracies behind the movie, JFK.
LINK
quote:
Single Bullet Theory
Myers' animation has introduced a new way of investigating the Kennedy assassination — and debunking the conspiracy theories which have flourished over the last 40 years.
Many Americans believe Kennedy and Texas Gov. John Connally were hit by different bullets from separate guns, suggesting a conspiracy of more than one gunman. Myers' simulation, however, proves they were hit from behind by the same bullet.
The animation shows, from the positions of the two men in the car, that any bullet that struck the president in the upper right back and emerged out of his throat, would have continued forward and hit Connally in the back near his right armpit — exactly where the governor was in fact hit. In addition, the fact that both men reacted at the same time clinches it, said Myers.
"So it's not a magic bullet at all," said Myers. "It's not even a single bullet theory, in my opinion. It's a single bullet fact."
If the two men were hit from behind by the same bullet, where did it come from? Using the men's body positions and the locations of their wounds, Myers isolated the source of the shot.
"We can start with, for instance, Governor Connally's entrance wound on his back, connect that with the point of exit on the president's throat, and then take that line and project it rearward," said Myers. "What we end up with is a line that goes right back through the sniper's nest window, the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository."
Dozens of witnesses pointed to the School Book Depository, where Oswald had been working as a clerk, after hearing the shots. One witness reported seeing a gun in the sixth floor window.
One of the things people don't realize is that the open top car kennedy was riding in was not a standard car. It was retrofitted and connelly's seat was situated a few inches towards the center of the car and either sat lower or higher (lower i think, can't remember) than the president's seat so the President was more visable.
This post was edited on 2/14/23 at 1:40 pm
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:51 pm to jp4lsu
That bullet hole was observed by medical staff at parkland as well.
Perfect bullet sized hike in the windshield going front to back -
The hole was perfect and a pencil would slide into it.
And no doubt the body was altered once it left Texas - the medical reports in Dallas do not reconcile to the Maryland records.
Perfect bullet sized hike in the windshield going front to back -
The hole was perfect and a pencil would slide into it.
And no doubt the body was altered once it left Texas - the medical reports in Dallas do not reconcile to the Maryland records.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 1:56 pm to BugAC
quote:
After watching a special on JFK in the 2000's, where every aspect of the assassination was examined and replicated, it was pretty apparent, Oswald was the lone gunman.
Sorry Bigfoot nerds, but this is what happened.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 2:57 pm to KillTheGophers
quote:
Perfect bullet sized hike in the windshield going front to back -
The hole was perfect and a pencil would slide into it.
where the hell did you hear that bullshite???
I remember the spot I was standing when the news first came out - and I also remember that within 2 seconds my mind screamed = "LBJ is behind this"
This was the only political event I had time to pay any attention to - I read and analyzed every theory that came out wrt to just plain everyday logic.
Nothing made sense to me except the Schoolbook Repository conclusion - and Oswald as the most likely trigger puller. The only lingering unknown was = "why - and who orchestrated it" = the answer to that was = "LBJ wanted to be POTUS"
Posted on 2/14/23 at 2:59 pm to L1C4
How about getting a job
Posted on 2/14/23 at 3:02 pm to BugAC
quote:
open top car kennedy was riding in was not a standard car. It was retrofitted and connelly's seat was situated a few inches towards the center of the car and either sat lower or higher (lower i think
Lower is the answer - this puts to rest all the rumors about the bullet having to do zig zags after going thru JFK.
There was a very complete analysis of the geometry of the entire event a decade or so ago - they are able to actually duplicate the official version of the bullet trajectory. Re-created the whole thing.
the bullet came from the 6th floor of the School Book Depository.
p.e.r.i.o.d.
Posted on 2/14/23 at 3:53 pm to ChineseBandit58
This is an interesting interview of a Dr in the Parkland trauma room attending to JFK.
Around 26 min, he feels the bullet came from the front. The other Dr in the room felt the same, but later changed his statement that he thought the bullet entered the rear. Dr. McClelland believes his initial belief was correct that it was a a front entry.
Dr. McClelland
Around 26 min, he feels the bullet came from the front. The other Dr in the room felt the same, but later changed his statement that he thought the bullet entered the rear. Dr. McClelland believes his initial belief was correct that it was a a front entry.
Dr. McClelland
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