re: “The Painter” (Hitler) movement on social media

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So, my conservative son, who attends a private catholic high school has either been taught, told by his friends or seen TikTok videos that the holocaust is a bit of a hoax.

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It's Tik Tok driving these new narratives.

In 1933 there are approximately 9.5 million Jews living in Europe.

By 1939 the number is higher.

You can look up each country, like Hungary is right at 445,000 living in that country in 1933.


By the end of the war, 2 in every 3 Jewish person living in Europe are killed.

I have books on all the camps; I have over 30 books on the Einsatzgruppen. I have books on the police groups used by the Germans in mass killings. I have books on the personnel and the main leaders of the groups.

I was asked in 2004 to go to the Ukraine to help with the oral history being put together by the French Prist, but due to work I could not help in this project.

There is a good book on German women in Russia during the war and what they saw and did. It was nothing to go to a field to picnic and it be a mass grave with the women shoes being caught on the hands, legs, arms of the dead as they walked across the fields. This book also covers the stories of some of those women who took part in the killings.

6.5 million Jews killed during the war is very close to the real number and remember at the camps only those who were chosen to be workers were given tattoo numbers and photographed (not all camps did this).

The summer of 1944 and the killing of the Hungarian Jews, will tell you just how bad the killings were.

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Please cite your source.

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It's not just one source. I've seen dozens of valid arguments over the past 2 decades.

David Irving is a great source. He's the only historian to use actual documents from the Nazis to support his case. All of his detractors just use the "trust me, bro. If you even think the numbers might be off, then you are antisemitic" defense.

I've also seen discussions with actual funeral directors who performed creations. The number of people supposedly killed in Aushwitz is mathematically impossible with how crematoriums operate.

And the argument "they put multiple people in a single chamber" doesn’t work. Cremation time is based on mass, so this is not a feasible way to increase output.

There is no documentation to support the 6 million number. The world atlas in the early 50s documented more jews in Europe than before the war. There were no mass graves found to support the number either.

We say that 6 million jews died because that is the number given to us by the jews. There is no evidence that backs it up. All of the documentation and logic we have goes against that number.

Shouldn't it be on the people making the 6 million claim to support it with actual evidence instead of just claiming it's common knowledge? The Nazis documented everything, down to the gold teeth they pulled. We have lists of the people who entered camps. But there are no records to support the 6 million number.

If you believe the 6 million number, it's simply because you were told to believe it. You haven't been presented documented evidence that verifies the claim.

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TenWheelsForJesus

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How did I know you'd be one of the people fixated on the "It wasn't really 6 million!" rhetoric?

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I just don’t see how anyone can get behind a guy that killed 6 million Jews (unless they don’t believe in the holocaust).

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Plus the other 40 million people that died as a result of His decisions

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And you did not present any documented evidence that verifies your claim.

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Bro he's seen DOZENS of valid....arguments?

Not one of [Irving's] books, speeches or articles, not one paragraph, not one sentence in any of them, can be taken on trust as an accurate representation of its historical subject. All of them are completely worthless as history, because Irving cannot be trusted anywhere, in any of them, to give a reliable account of what he is talking or writing about ... if we mean by historian someone who is concerned to discover the truth about the past, and to give as accurate a representation of it as possible, then Irving is not a historian.

Irving ... had deliberately distorted and wilfully mistranslated documents, consciously used discredited testimony and falsified historical statistics. ... Irving has fallen so far short of the standards of scholarship customary amongst historians that he does not deserve to be called a historian at all.

David Irving how many counties is banned from, and how many times has he been sued?

I'm not opposed to the theory that 6M is too high, but it's clearly at least 1M

I'll ask my question from page 1 again

What level of genocide is acceptable to avoid focusing so much efforts on this particular debunking?

It sounds like you're disputing even the pitiful 1M number. Correct me if I'm wrong

What is your estimate on Jews killed in the Holocaust?

6.5 million is a good base which are easy to find, Jewish population in 1933 is 9.5 million in Europe. Then check the number post war. And remember by 1939 that number will be higher.


In Hungary alone you get over 400,000 killed. The summer of 1944 was mass murder at Auschwitz; you can get the list of trains and total shipped to the camp and those that are selected to be workers. The Photo album from the camp from that summer shows how the system worked.

Thosee selected to work get the tattoo and are photographed.