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re: Supreme Court Blocks Biden's Vaccine Mandate
Posted on 1/13/22 at 11:41 pm to LSUAngelHere1
Posted on 1/13/22 at 11:41 pm to LSUAngelHere1
How'd she file her exemption? Was it thru her employer or is there a formal state-wide/national way to do so?
1
Posted on 1/14/22 at 12:19 am to John_V
quote:
How'd she file her exemption? Was it thru her employer or is there a formal state-wide/national way to do so?
HR told the holdouts that they had to be vaxxed by Dec 9 (approx) or submit the reason why they weren’t. They were also told, “And these will be scrutinized.”
That statement had us believing she’d get canned for sure. I helped her write the exemption request and she received an email at home on Dec 6 informing her that it had been accepted.
We used religious, moral, and personal beliefs for why she opposed it.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 3:42 am to LSUAngelHere1
Posted on 1/14/22 at 5:06 am to iron banks
I just wonder, if Trump would be an office and would have pushed this mandate, with the liberal judges have flipped to the other side just because of that?
Posted on 1/14/22 at 6:11 am to Nutriaitch
quote:
the people giving the money gets to choose the guidelines
Pretty sure the Federal government gets the money from the people.
So what am I choosing again?
Posted on 1/14/22 at 6:22 am to DMAN1968
quote:
Pretty sure the Federal government gets the money from the people.
Exactly. Our government forgets they are representatives not rulers.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 6:39 am to LongueCarabine
I’m curious which healthcare facilities the mandate applies to. If it’s simply Medicare/medicaid offices who are likely already strapped for workers, and now those workers go find other jobs, this could be a huge disruption to those offices and services.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 7:03 am to Jbird
One very disturbing takeaway is this court’s reference to the powers granted by Congress….
I understood the Court’s role was to review the legislation passed by Congress and the enforcement thereof by the Executive for the purpose of determining whether or not either or both infringe upon the rights granted in the CONSTITUTION.
If they are now just going to take Congress word for it……..
I understood the Court’s role was to review the legislation passed by Congress and the enforcement thereof by the Executive for the purpose of determining whether or not either or both infringe upon the rights granted in the CONSTITUTION.
If they are now just going to take Congress word for it……..
Posted on 1/14/22 at 7:10 am to WhiskeyThrottle
The way I understand it is that any facility accepting Medicaid/Medicare funds.
So this is pretty much any hospital, Doctor office, Surgery Centers...etc. I can't imagine there are a whole lot of places not accepting govt funds.
This will create quite a bit of churn in the nurse market and those working in those offices and hospitals.
Will we see some of these facilities stop accepting Medicaid and Medicare patients because of this? So those patients will need to seek new facilities and doctors?
This is not right. It is an over reach and unnecessary act where the vax is proving to be completely useless. The next tactic is to go after the falsehood of reasoning behind this mandate. The risk of the vax, the ineffectiveness of the vax, the unproveness of the vax, lack of long term data typically warranted with a vax, and the fact that so many have been working for 2 yrs with no vax and have been doing fine.
I can maybe buy into protective equipment but crossing the line into forcing an unproven and unknown vax into your body and the vax company has no liability is way too far.
So this is pretty much any hospital, Doctor office, Surgery Centers...etc. I can't imagine there are a whole lot of places not accepting govt funds.
This will create quite a bit of churn in the nurse market and those working in those offices and hospitals.
Will we see some of these facilities stop accepting Medicaid and Medicare patients because of this? So those patients will need to seek new facilities and doctors?
This is not right. It is an over reach and unnecessary act where the vax is proving to be completely useless. The next tactic is to go after the falsehood of reasoning behind this mandate. The risk of the vax, the ineffectiveness of the vax, the unproveness of the vax, lack of long term data typically warranted with a vax, and the fact that so many have been working for 2 yrs with no vax and have been doing fine.
I can maybe buy into protective equipment but crossing the line into forcing an unproven and unknown vax into your body and the vax company has no liability is way too far.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 7:19 am to WhiskeyThrottle
This is the list of facilities the healthcare vaccine mandate applies to, if they see Medicare/Medicaid patients. It’s pretty much everyone except doctors’ offices.
So presumably any of those places could choose not to accept Medicare/Medicaid patients anymore but that is such a large portion of the population, it would cause major problems. Also wouldn’t work for any hospitals with ERs since they have to treat everyone that shows up and then wouldn’t be able to bill medicare/Medicaid for those patients that have it.
quote:
CMS's vaccine mandate will affect staff at only certain enumerated Medicare and Medicaid-certified healthcare providers and suppliers:
ambulatory surgical centers
hospices
psychiatric residential treatment facilities
programs of all-inclusive care for the elderly
hospitals (acute care hospitals, psychiatric hospitals, long term care hospitals, children's hospitals, hospital swing beds, transplant centers, cancer hospitals, and rehabilitation hospitals)
long term care facilities, including skilled nursing facilities and nursing facilities
intermediate care facilities for individuals with intellectual disabilities
home health agencies
comprehensive outpatient rehabilitation facilities critical access hospitals
clinics, rehabilitation agencies, and public health agencies as providers of outpatient physical therapy and speech-language pathology services community mental health centers
home infusion therapy suppliers
rural health clinics/federally qualified health centers end-stage renal disease facilities
CMS's vaccine mandate does not apply to staff of physicians' offices. CMS states that physicians' offices are not subject to Medicare's health and safety regulations; however, they may face state vaccine regulations or other federal vaccine mandates such as those issued by Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA).
So presumably any of those places could choose not to accept Medicare/Medicaid patients anymore but that is such a large portion of the population, it would cause major problems. Also wouldn’t work for any hospitals with ERs since they have to treat everyone that shows up and then wouldn’t be able to bill medicare/Medicaid for those patients that have it.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 7:29 am to Quatre Pot
quote:
One very disturbing takeaway is this court’s reference to the powers granted by Congress….
it’s because congress created OSHA and defines their role.
OSHA cannot step outside of those roles.
so the roles would have to be changed for them to pass this regulation.
Only way to change those roles is through Congress. Not through executive actions.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:14 am to Nutriaitch
So how's everyone feeling this morning?
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:41 am to Oates Mustache
quote:
So how's everyone feeling this morning?
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:42 am to Oates Mustache
CEO and I had a drink last night celebrating that we were able to recall the policy and allow our employees the freedom to choose what they put into their body.
At the same time, he is on the board of a hospital in the area and 60% of their revenue comes from medicare/medicaid patients so a bit of a bittersweet afternoon for he.
Reading the 3 dissenting opinions, they seemed filled with emotion and that's frightening. Private industry got a huge win and relief yesterday, but it's an eerie feeling that there are at least 3 justices who sit in the highest court in the land who seemingly judge cases with their feelings.
At the same time, he is on the board of a hospital in the area and 60% of their revenue comes from medicare/medicaid patients so a bit of a bittersweet afternoon for he.
Reading the 3 dissenting opinions, they seemed filled with emotion and that's frightening. Private industry got a huge win and relief yesterday, but it's an eerie feeling that there are at least 3 justices who sit in the highest court in the land who seemingly judge cases with their feelings.
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 8:43 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:48 am to LSUAngelHere1
quote:
Which hospitals or providers do you suggest they apply at?
A. i have literally never asked a place if they do or don't accept medicaid/medicare, so i do not know what facilities do or don't accept it.
B. how many places do or don't accept it is not relevant to the law.
Congress (elected by the people) sets the parameters for the Medicaid/Medicare program. Those parameters have been in effect for years without challenge.
quote:
Congress has authorized the Secretary to impose conditions on the receipt of Medicaid and Medicare funds that “the Secretary finds necessary in the interest of the health and safety of individuals who are furnished services.”
written in clear and plain English, The Secretary of Health and Human Services has the authority to:
quote:
conclude that a vaccine mandate is “necessary to promote and protect patient health and safety” in the face of the ongoing pandemic.
even the people challenging this particular mandate admitted in oral questioning that
quote:
“[T]he Secretary certainly has authority to implement all kinds of infection control measures at these facilities.”
there is also precedence:
quote:
Vaccination re- quirements are a common feature of the provision of healthcare in America: Healthcare workers around the country are ordinarily required to be vaccinated for diseases such as hepatitis B, influenza, and measles, mumps, and rubella.
This case did not even try to challenge the existing law. Just whether or not this mandate falls under that existing rule. And it clearly does.
If you want to argue that the existing rule needs to be changed/abolished/amended/etc. fine.
Thats a different discussion.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:04 am to Lightning
quote:
So presumably any of those places could choose not to accept Medicare/Medicaid patients anymore but that is such a large portion of the population, it would cause major problems. Also wouldn’t work for any hospitals with ERs since they have to treat everyone that shows up and then wouldn’t be able to bill medicare/Medicaid for those patients that have it.
My sister works for a doctors office. A cardiology group. It applies to them but they accepted her request for religious exemption.
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 9:04 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:36 am to jp4lsu
quote:
This is not right. It is an over reach and unnecessary act where the vax is proving to be completely useless
The effectiveness of the vaccine is a policy determination. Not really relevant to whether the government had the authority to mandate its use.
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 9:40 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:46 am to Indefatigable
quote:
Not really relevant to whether the government had the authority to mandate its use.
Imma have to call bullshite.
I think the effectiveness is relevant to whether there is an evidentiary record supporting the requirement. If they can’t prove it will meet the administrative purpose, the rule is an abuse of discretion. See: the Chevron Case the name of which always escapes me.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:56 am to Nutriaitch
quote:
conclude that a vaccine mandate is “necessary to promote and protect patient health and safety” in the face of the ongoing pandemic.
What evidence did Biden present that the vaccine was necessary to promote PATIENT health, in light of the now relatively undisputed fact that it doesn’t prevent transmission by vaccinated staff to patients?
You could probably even make the argument that the vax worsens it - by reducing available care (due to resignations, etc) and increasing risk of spread (a vaccinated person with reduced symptoms passes it along unwittingly).
These mandates have no basis in fact or in law. And without demonstrating that a vaccinated nurse is somehow less likely to infect a patient - the audacity of the government mandating them is ridiculous.
Biden was wrong. He knows he was wrong. He just cannot admit he’s wrong bc this whole thing is a religion to these covidians
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