re: Religious Leaders Told to 'Prepare Now' for UFO Disclosure and 'Bible-Changing' Revelation

I posted something here just the other day about this guy from MIT working with this group on what he is calling "trace logic." He's saying that the math they're crunching seems to indicate that the universe is actually teeming with life, but the problem is that we cannot perceive most of it. He says that's what the numbers say. That consciousness is the rule, not the exception. He goes on to say that our consciousness being contained in a body is also an exception to the rule.

This may explain why the "aliens" seem to take so much interest in us and refer to us as "containers for the soul." We may be rare in the sense that we are fully corporeal swimming in a sea of disembodied entities. Which, if you really consider it, this is also what the Bible says, in a roundabout way. The Bible lists more than a dozen different types of non-human intelligences and we are the only ones with physical bodies.

There have been quite a few that I am aware of that can't wrap their head around the God of the OT and the God of the NT being the same God. And I can understand that. If you hold to the view that Scripture is inerrant, and you're intellectually honest, they're hard to reconcile.

Marcion understood this almost 2000 years ago and his attempt to explain it got him branded a heretic.

I tend to think that Jews in the OT did some horrible things and blaming it on God was a lot easier than admitting it. I think that we all often attempt to rationalize abhorrent behavior on pointing to "Well, God said...."

I tend to look at the OT as man trying to figure out the world and grasp at the idea of God, too.

IMO, Scripture is essentially a form of 'code', or "parable" as Jesus labeled it. It benefits those who "have ears that hear and eyes that see". God's Children "hear my voice". Those who do not see will think those who do, as crazy. Scripture says a much.

Further, the NT is a New Covenant, as it moved the Spiritual bar higher. But Jesus also said that minus a 'Baptism' and 'rebirth' of the Spirit, and the promised Holy Spirit which accompanies that commitment, one will not clearly interpret the 'parables' and deeper meaning of what seems to be silliness by activist non-believers.

A show down is coming. And sooner than we think. As AI will exponentially push things forward. Along with rising division between Individualist and Collectivist Ideologies and (immigrant) cultures due to Social Media.

And of course the subject of this Thread.

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I’d say by the time I was 10 I had doubts but by the time I was about 12-13 I was an atheist and didn’t yet realize it. I can remember sitting/standing in church at that age looking around and thinking “look at all these mindless drones… they haven’t a clue… what am I even doing here?”

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Reddit atheism is really cringe man.

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Marcion understood this almost 2000 years ago and his attempt to explain it got him branded a heretic.

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The majority of Christians have never heard of this guy who led the most dominant sect of Christianity in the second and early third centuries. During that time, going to a Christian church in Asia Minor and Syria would have been entering a building where the congregation believed the Jewish god was the evil creator that Jesus came to rescue them from.

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I tend to think that Jews in the OT did some horrible things and blaming it on God was a lot easier than admitting it. I think that we all often attempt to rationalize abhorrent behavior on pointing to "Well, God said...."

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Damn, us Israelites just genocided the entire Amalekite people. We even killed all their babies. People are going to remember that and say that was evil. Let’s just write a story that said God commanded us to do it. God can override objective morality with a divine decree.

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I tend to look at the OT as man trying to figure out the world and grasp at the idea of God, too.

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For me, it’s more myths trying to explain the order of things, and fake histories to overwrite the real history to justify previous atrocities.

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Reddit atheism is really cringe man.

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I was an atheist already by the time the Netscape Navigator 2.0 had been released. I’m not sure Reddit was a thing back then.

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You repeatedly said that the biblical viewpoint requires a cosmological view that few Christians hold. I quoted your words. And you reiterate it below
Yes. The language in the Bible that describes the flat disc shape of the earth, set on pillars in a great deep ocean of chaos

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Then do me the courtesy I afforded you and withdraw your claim that I made straw man argument saying this.

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Specifically, you built up the Christian viewpoint as a logic trap. You tried to force an absurd position because it allowed you to more effectively mock. You say language is figurative when it suits your point of view, but argue it must be literal and understood by a 21st century enlightened standard when it gives you an advantage. That was and is the straw man.

I don’t see that as a straw man. I’m not falsifying or misconstruing anyone’s position…

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If you force a false binary, giving options that support your argument either way, then you are creating a straw man. You and I will disagree on whether you are forcing a false binary. I have no problem with you claiming so, BUT you saying there is no room for disagreeing with you presupposes several things. As a simple example, a believer who does not believe in literal inerrancytive? would have absolutely zero problem with this “contradiction.” A view of the Bible as a book of wisdom focused on religious ideas contains scientific errors. Ok. A person writing from a limited scientific knowledge base making mistakes in cosmology is no surprise. It would not change the message that is being conveyed from the writer that God controlled the heavens. Your recognizing the flaw in scientific understanding changes absolutely nothing about that. Do obvious mistakes in Darwin’s understanding of evolutionary theory negate the concept? Do Platonic writings with similar errors negate the importance of the writings from a secular perspective? The analogies are of course limited, but they convey the principle. You clearly said below that a biblical viewpoint requires a literal cosmological view. I asked specifically if I was misrepresenting. I have given a basic third view here that destroys a false binary logic trap. You are insisting on a post-enlightenment view of “knowledge” and “truth” that ancient cultures did not hold. I operate from that too. We are both making arguments from that POV. Judging ancient cultures with that standard will always result in misunderstanding.

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Look man, if you can’t agree that there are “many” flat earthers and that the main justification is their fundamentalist religious beliefs, then we probably won’t agree on much of anything. This is easily verifiable by you if you

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This right here is exactly the kind of thing that is why I started a dialogue with you in the first place. I have no knowledge of flat earthers. I know exactly zero people, whether secular or religious, who hold this view. You made a claim that I asked you to support. (It was one of three things I asked, but you only responded to this). You did so with evidence that did NOT support your view. You then said that you were just pointing out similar things, which makes no logical sense. You have moved to, I should investigate further to prove your point. Then you say, look man you should just verify it. SO, I did. I looked at a website called the flat earth society. It is a mix of a variety of religions (including Muslims shockingly) and a strong atheist group. I actually reported this to you. Here is a quote from their Flat Earth FAQ page (bonding is from me)

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Is Flat Earth Theory connected to a religion? Flat Earth Theory is neither officially nor unofficially associated with any religion. Throughout the ages various religious institutions have championed a flat earth model for the world. Unfortunately this leaves us with the vestigial thought that Flat Earth Theory and religions are symbiotic. They are not, even though many religions today, both mainstream and otherwise, still teach its followers that the world is flat. While they are not incorrect, believing in a flat earth isn't contingent upon believing in a deity or being a part of any religion

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. Here is a link to that very page
Flat Earth FAQs

Is this page representative of FE ideology. No idea. But it definitely isn’t in line with your claim above. Now I actually brought receipts. I went well beyond what you were willing to do.

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You probably forgot you took a position. Remember this?
quote: We can laugh at that video together

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If you want to claim that denying an absurd position is in fact taking a position, then OK, you got me. But is it possible I meant that I hadn’t taken a position for or against the claim you made in the context? You know, in the sense of not unintentionally mischaracterizing what I said.

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Yes I felt you were mischaracterizing my position. I said there were a lot of fundamentalists who believed the earth was flat, but didn’t say all Christians were fundamentalists and didn’t even say it was a majority position among fundamentalists. If it’s 0.5% of a billion people, that’s still 5,000,000 people which is “a lot” of people

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Remember how I conceded this. Would you do the courtesy of examining positions you took that I feel have done the same?

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They have global conferences and put up billboards

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Not that you have demonstrated. And saying that if I don’t verify your claim after already putting in some time trying is not a valid response.

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So at first you tried to argue no one believed that stuff, and then when I said a lot believed it, you tried to say I said it was the mainstream position

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This is not what happened. You made a claim that I asked you to prove by testing and substantiation, which was the threshold you told another poster was necessary for making a claim. I didn’t say no one believed it. I asked you to demonstrate it. That is a mischaracterization of what happened. If you are open minded and discussing in good faith, this is indisputable I definitely overstated what you said by claiming you were calling it “mainstream.” In context you used the wording “a lot of fundamentalists” believe in a flat earth theory as a proof that theists have irrational positions. I took that to mean something that you say you didn’t, so I take you at your word.

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I’m guilty of that too. I can be better. Sorry about that

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Sincerely appreciated.

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The OT stories are self explanatory. The gods sought to enslave and stunt the growth of humanity. It was the light bringer (Enki) who repeatedly argued for and fought on behalf of mankind. And this is why Jesus is also referred to as the light bringer.

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Have you ever read the Hypostasis of the Archons (the Nature of the Rulers)? If not, you would find it fascinating and revealing.

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Have you ever read the Hypostasis of the Archons (the Nature of the Rulers)? If not, you would find it fascinating and revealing.

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Nope. But it sounds like something I would be interested in. Thanks for the suggestion.

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No one says this. Your premise is invalid. This is where you lost me

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It's the entire premise for the Protestant Reformation.