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Posted on 12/19/23 at 10:28 pm to gaetti15
quote:Marriage is simply a covenant that a man and woman make with each other as God as their witness whereby they are joined together in the sight of God. Once married, God gives only a couple reasons for lawful divorce, which are adultery and desertion, both of which are sinful acts that are to be avoided. The victim is free to lawfully remarry in those cases, otherwise if separation occurs, neither spouse is to engage in sexual union with another or else that is considered adultery, and likewise, neither can marry another while being married to their previous/current spouse.
ok what about a coerced wedding. or a wedding that either person didnt gave the faculties to commit to a marriage?
or if a partner hid before the marriage that they weren't open to life (i.e. didnt want to have kids)
Adding other ways to end a marriage beyond what God has provided is unbiblical.
This post was edited on 12/20/23 at 12:29 am
Posted on 12/19/23 at 10:29 pm to gaetti15
When God chastised Israel for bowing before idols, it was almost always referring to them bowing down in front of some statue, graven image or brazen beast that represented other gods or deities. How can a Catholic bow in front of a statue to pray and not consider this idol worship?
And what possible purpose does any believer have to justify bowing to statues?
And if you claim you aren’t actually praying to the statue, why did the church feel the need to split one of the 10 Commandments into two in order to remove the commandment about worshiping idols?
Posted on 12/19/23 at 10:48 pm to Revelator
I'll respond to this.
No, it was referring to them worshipping the image. See the bronze serpent, the Ark of the Covenant, etc. as examples of God commanding the creation of "images". They only become idols when you worship them.
Because they're not worshipping the statue. They're showing reverence to what it represents.
As a former Protestant, I do agree that it's kind of weird, but as long as they're not worshipping it, it's not idolatry, so who cares?
The commandments were not originally numbered in scripture. There are two ancient traditions concerning how to come up with Ten Commandments.
One of these is from Origen of Alexandria in the third century, which is used by Eastern Christians, like the Eastern Orthodox and Eastern Catholics, as well as Protestants, like Presbyterians and Baptists.
The other is from St. Augustine in the fourth century, which is used by Latin Catholics and other Protestants like Lutherans.
So, it's not that Catholics changed the Ten Commandments, since some rites use the same numbering as you.
Rather, it's just that different numberings exist since there isn't one clear one given in Scripture.
quote:
When God chastised Israel for bowing before idols, it was almost always referring to them bowing down in front of some statue
No, it was referring to them worshipping the image. See the bronze serpent, the Ark of the Covenant, etc. as examples of God commanding the creation of "images". They only become idols when you worship them.
quote:
How can a Catholic bow in front of a statue to pray and not consider this idol worship?
Because they're not worshipping the statue. They're showing reverence to what it represents.
quote:
And what possible purpose does any believer have to justify bowing to statues?
As a former Protestant, I do agree that it's kind of weird, but as long as they're not worshipping it, it's not idolatry, so who cares?
quote:
And if you claim you aren’t actually praying to the statue, why did the church feel the need to split one of the 10 Commandments into two in order to remove the commandment about worshiping idols?
The commandments were not originally numbered in scripture. There are two ancient traditions concerning how to come up with Ten Commandments.
One of these is from Origen of Alexandria in the third century, which is used by Eastern Christians, like the Eastern Orthodox and Eastern Catholics, as well as Protestants, like Presbyterians and Baptists.
The other is from St. Augustine in the fourth century, which is used by Latin Catholics and other Protestants like Lutherans.
So, it's not that Catholics changed the Ten Commandments, since some rites use the same numbering as you.
Rather, it's just that different numberings exist since there isn't one clear one given in Scripture.
Posted on 12/19/23 at 10:51 pm to Stitches
quote:
So, it's not that Catholics changed the Ten Commandments, since some rites use the same numbering as you.
Removing completely the commandment about worshiping idols isn’t about a numbering discrepancy. It was obviously removed because of the Catholics belief in the veneration of saints by praying to statues
This post was edited on 12/19/23 at 10:54 pm
Posted on 12/19/23 at 10:54 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
Once married, God gives only a couple reasons for lawful divorce, which are adultery and desertion, both of which are sinful acts that are to be avoided.
according to the Protestant Bible.
Posted on 12/19/23 at 10:58 pm to Revelator
quote:
Removing completely the commandment about worshiping idols isn’t about a numbering discrepancy
You don't understand the context of what ancient Jewish idol worship was. They didn't just worship images. They literally thought of them as gods. So it's not removed from the commandments. It's covered in the very first one when it says "though shalt not have strange gods before me"
quote:
It was obviously removed because of the Catholics belief in the veneration of saints by praying to statues
We don't pray to statues. You prove time and time again that you know nothing about Catholicism, despite claiming you were one at one point. You're always as bad as CorchJay. Almost.
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:00 pm to gaetti15
I agree with Foo. The RCC passes out annulments like candy at Halloween, despite it being a sacrament in our church.
Apparently it was very rare to get an annulment prior to Vatican II
Apparently it was very rare to get an annulment prior to Vatican II
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:00 pm to Stitches
quote:[/quote]quote:
So it's not removed from the commandments. It's covered in the very first one when it says "though shalt not have strange gods before me"
But it is removed and for a purpose
[quote]We don't pray to statues. You prove time and time again that you know nothing about Catholicism, despite claiming you were one at one point. You're always as bad as CorchJay. Almost.
Right, and Joe and Hunter never talked about business on those long flights to China!
This post was edited on 12/19/23 at 11:03 pm
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:03 pm to Revelator
It's not. I literally just showed you the link between what ancient Jewish idol worship was (strange gods) and why the commandment is worded the way it is, which is specifically to address the fact that they worshiped idols as if they were actual gods.
You're a broken record, and not very smart to boot.
You're a broken record, and not very smart to boot.
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:04 pm to Stitches
quote:
agree with Foo. The RCC passes out annulments like candy at Halloween, despite it being a sacrament in our church.
Apparently it was very rare to get an annulment prior to Vatican II
actually will agree with that.
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:04 pm to Stitches
quote:
agree with Foo. The RCC passes out annulments like candy at Halloween, despite it being a sacrament in our church.
Agreed. Annulments should be saved for Kings and dignitaries
This post was edited on 12/19/23 at 11:07 pm
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:06 pm to Stitches
quote:
It's not. I literally just showed you the link between what ancient Jewish idol worship was (strange gods) and why the commandment is worded the way it is, which is specifically to address the fact that they worshiped idols as if they were actual gods.
You actually don’t answer any questions on your own. You simply cut and paste answers from Catholic apologist sites.
You appear to do very little thinking on your own.
This post was edited on 12/19/23 at 11:09 pm
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:08 pm to Stitches
quote:quote:Because they're not worshipping the statue. They're showing reverence to what it represents.
How can a Catholic bow in front of a statue to pray and not consider this idol worship?
Cradle Catholic here. I’ve never seen anyone bow to a statue. Where/when does this happen?
I bow to the tabernacle, because Jesus is inside.
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:10 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
Cradle Catholic here. I’ve never seen anyone bow to a statue. Where/when does this happen?
So you’ve never seen a Catholic person kneel in a kneeler in front of a statue with head bowed in prayer?!
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:11 pm to Revelator
quote:
How can a Catholic bow in front of a statue to pray and not consider this idol worship?
The same way the Jews looked upon the graven image that God commanded Moses to create.
When God said make an image of the serpent on a pole and have the people look upon it to cure them from snake bites.
And so we as Catholics look upon the Graven image of Jesus hanging on a pole and pray for him to enlighten the snakes that continually attack the 2000 year old church that Christ created.
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:12 pm to Revelator
quote:
You actually don’t answer any questions on your own.
I answer all of them on my own.
quote:
You simply cut and paste answers from Catholic apologist sites. It doesn’t take lots of smarts to do that
That's the neat thing about facts. They're still facts, regardless of where the information comes from, and despite how you feel about them.
If that's the best response that Brother Billy Bob has for the factual information I've presented....well....I guess I'm doing something right.
This post was edited on 12/19/23 at 11:13 pm
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:13 pm to Revelator
quote:
So you’ve never seen a Catholic person kneel in a kneeler in front of a statue with head bowed in prayer?!
Are they bowing their heads in prayer or bowing to a piece of stone?
Or is kneeling in a church with statues considered bowing to statues?
Posted on 12/19/23 at 11:15 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
Or is kneeling in a church with statues considered bowing to statues?
So the kneelers are placed right in front of the statues for some other purpose?
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