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Started By
Message
re: New York State Just Legalized Abortion up to Birth
Posted on 1/23/19 at 5:53 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
Posted on 1/23/19 at 5:53 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:
Cool. The death penalty is banned for anyone who committed crimes while they were under the age of 18. Why 18?
No matter how I answer this question it will not say anything about when life begins which is the crux of the argument.
Try another analogy
Every argument about abortion ultimately leads to that question.... when does life begin.
The burden of proof is on you (the person who wants to end a perfectly viable life) to clearly define life and be able to support it with evidence.
1
Posted on 1/23/19 at 5:57 pm to VitoAndolini
quote:
No matter how I answer this question it will not say anything about when life begins which is the crux of the argument.
We're still working on your question. You could always admit that it was a pointless question.
quote:
The burden of proof is on you
Wrong. Abortion is legal, which means people have decided that it should be legal. If you disagree, you need to make an argument for why it should be banned.
Your feelings are not an argument, either.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:00 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:
We're still working on your question. You could always admit that it was a pointless question.
No the designation of 24 weeks in the bill is pointless. I simply asked why it’s 24 weeks. I mean did they just get a random number generator and pick 24 weeks? I’m just trying to figure out where that comes from.
quote:
Wrong. Abortion is legal, which means people have decided that it should be legal. If you disagree, you need to make an argument for why it should be banned. Your feelings are not an argument, either.
the appeal to authority fallacy Ok. That’s how deep your logic runs? Slavery was legal. Lots of things have been legal before. That just about the worst argument I’ve ever heard.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:09 pm to ShreveportHog94
I’m conservative and pro choice simply due to my own ideas regarding women and their power over their bodies. I don’t begrudge anyone else’s opinion either way. The alarming part of this story for a seemingly large swath in this thread is the jubilation of people after extending the legal date of abortion. That’s sickening..and indeed a slippery slope to abortion on demand regardless of the ‘health of the mother”.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:18 pm to shamrock
quote:
and indeed a slippery slope to abortion on demand regardless of the ‘health of the mother”.
That's where I'm at. I always thought the mother had a choice if her life is At high risk (has other kids to provide for, for example).
Can't they take a baby like 3 months early these days in neo natal? Maybe that's where the problem is, instead of them taking it 10 weeks early and saving it, they can instead choose to abort it?
If it can survive, that would indeed be murder by any definition.
This post was edited on 1/23/19 at 6:20 pm
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:18 pm to RebelExpress38
I watched a "late term abortion" video once.
It reminded me of Dr. Pol when he reaches way up inside a cow and pulls a calf out, only he doesn't suck the brains out of it while it is hanging off the back end.
It reminded me of Dr. Pol when he reaches way up inside a cow and pulls a calf out, only he doesn't suck the brains out of it while it is hanging off the back end.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:25 pm to RebelExpress38
It doesn't take a genius to see people are going to cite depression and get a late term abortion.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:33 pm to VitoAndolini
quote:
This isn’t the argument and you don’t understand what a zygote is.
4/10 strawman
Tell it to the poster I was responding to who said:
quote:
It is no longer about you, it is about that kid. From a zygote to an adult.
The point he's missing is that without the parents, the child's chances at success plummet dramatically. So it's really about what "you" can do for the "zygote to an adult".
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:33 pm to onmymedicalgrind
quote:it's not even a matter of medical ethics. It has been widely determined and argued that the health exception has wide latitude. I even linked one such example in this thread. The pro-abortion people are very open about using the health exception to allow for the greatest possible access. They wanted interpreted to mean basically anything related to health. And they've been successful more often than not
Again, different discussion. Medical ethics has not been touched upon at all in this long thread
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:34 pm to VitoAndolini
quote:
No the designation of 24 weeks in the bill is pointless. I simply asked why it’s 24 weeks. I mean did they just get a random number generator and pick 24 weeks? I’m just trying to figure out where that comes from.
You asked the following:
quote:
What is different about the fetus at 23 weeks 6 days versus 24 weeks?
Let's get you past this nonsense.
I asked:
quote:
What's the difference between 18 years and 17 years, 364 days?
You thought I was talking about cigarettes.
quote:
the appeal to authority fallacy
You should take another elective because you don't know what this means.
quote:
That’s how deep your logic runs? Slavery was legal. Lots of things have been legal before. That just about the worst argument I’ve ever heard.
FFS.
I didn't say abortion should be legal because it is legal. I said it's legal. If you're making the assertion that it should not be legal, it falls to you to support that assertion.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:47 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
FFS is right
The bill states 24 weeks. Why? What about a 24 week 1 day fetus makes it not ok to kill? I didn’t say anything is significant about 24 weeks, the bill did.
I don’t care about your 18 year old death penalty bullshite analogy. I never said I support the death penalty. It’s not a valid argument for abortion of a healthy fetus of 23 weeks.
You are using current laws as a form of authority. The fact that something is a law doesn’t make it morally right. I proved that by showing slavery was once legal.
I said, you, who wants to act on a perfectly viable fetus needs to provide proof why you should be able to do so.
The bill states 24 weeks. Why? What about a 24 week 1 day fetus makes it not ok to kill? I didn’t say anything is significant about 24 weeks, the bill did.
I don’t care about your 18 year old death penalty bullshite analogy. I never said I support the death penalty. It’s not a valid argument for abortion of a healthy fetus of 23 weeks.
quote:
You should take another elective because you don't know what this means.
You are using current laws as a form of authority. The fact that something is a law doesn’t make it morally right. I proved that by showing slavery was once legal.
I said, you, who wants to act on a perfectly viable fetus needs to provide proof why you should be able to do so.
This post was edited on 1/23/19 at 6:48 pm
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:48 pm to ShoeBang
quote:
As a father, if the doctor would have told me that they needed every drop of my blood to make sure my little girl came into this world safely, I would have asked for a bucket and a knife. My wife would have too. That is the responsibility you have as a parent from the moment of conception. It is no longer about you, it is about that kid. From a zygote to an adult.
Damn if this isn't spot on.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:49 pm to RebelExpress38
Not reading all the pages.
So if you don't want an abortion don't get one.
So if you don't want an abortion don't get one.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:57 pm to VitoAndolini
quote:
The bill states 24 weeks. Why?
Who knows. What I do know is that if you disagree, you're free to lay out your argument.
quote:
I don’t care about your 18 year old death penalty bullshite analogy.
Of course not, because it's inconvenient to your ignorant questions.
quote:
It’s not a valid argument for abortion of a healthy fetus of 23 weeks.
I never claimed that it was.
quote:
You are using current laws as a form of authority.
Wrong. It's the law. That's a statement of fact. You're asserting that it shouldn't be legal. It's on you to support that assertion. That isn't an appeal to authority.
quote:
The fact that something is a law doesn’t make it morally right. I proved that by showing slavery was once legal.
I didn't make that assertion. Your point about slavery is irrelevant.
quote:
I said, you, who wants to act on a perfectly viable fetus needs to provide proof why you should be able to do so.
I didn't make that assertion, either.
So far, you've relied on emotion and assumptions.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:58 pm to VitoAndolini
Whose alter are you, by the way?
Posted on 1/23/19 at 6:58 pm to TbirdSpur2010
I find it hilarious but also extremely disturbing that people who want to terminate a perfectly viable fetus can’t even explain very basic issues surrounding abortion and life.
Why do they constantly deflect? It should be pretty straight forward if they are so sure about their position.
Why do they constantly deflect? It should be pretty straight forward if they are so sure about their position.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 7:00 pm to VitoAndolini
quote:
It should be pretty straight forward
I'm always amused by people who think something like abortion is "pretty straightforward" while doing nothing about it.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 7:01 pm to RebelExpress38
This makes no sense to me especially since a baby can be born almost at anytime in the last tri-mester and still be healthy. Even in the case of fear of the mother's health.
For cases of rape and incest, this decision should have been made within the first month.
I don't know how they can not consider this a life. If that mother were to be murdered, are they now not going to charge the defendant with double homicide any longer since they don't consider it a baby?
For cases of rape and incest, this decision should have been made within the first month.
I don't know how they can not consider this a life. If that mother were to be murdered, are they now not going to charge the defendant with double homicide any longer since they don't consider it a baby?
Posted on 1/23/19 at 7:04 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
What does this even mean? Are you in healthcare? Have you seen a live birth? Abortion?
Posted on 1/23/19 at 7:05 pm to shamrock
What do those questions have to do with anything I said?
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