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Started By
Message
re: Left-Wing News Hired Hitman Charged W/ 2nd Degree Murder Of Patriot
Posted on 10/13/20 at 8:43 am to auggie
Posted on 10/13/20 at 8:43 am to auggie
quote:good Lord, I have addressed the same question 20 times.
auggie
Keltner stalked away from BGM.
Reporter said or did something which apparently provoked Keltner.
Dolloff stepped between Keltner and reporter, probably putting hands up and on Keltner’s chest in the process as Keltner moved toward reporter. No, I do not consider that an assault. I consider it an attempt to prevent a physical altercation between the other two men. Opinions may vary.
Kellner‘s response was to affirmatively assault Dolloff by hitting him in the head.
Dolloff replied by pulling (and not yet firing) his weapon. At about the same tine, Keltner raised his right hand and pointed an object (now known to be a gas cannister) at Dolloff.
Keltner then deployed his gas against Dolloff.
Next, Dolloff fired his weapon at Keltner.
This sequence is not even remotely in controversy, and it all happened in the span of 2-3 seconds. The question is whether the actions of each man were reasonable under the circumstances.
This post was edited on 10/13/20 at 9:36 am
5
Posted on 10/13/20 at 8:49 am to AggieHank86
quote:Great. I wasn't replying to you.
Yes. I have said the same probably two dozen times.
Posted on 10/13/20 at 8:51 am to AggieHank86
quote:
Surely we can agree that an accurate timeline will help us understand the sequence of events, correct?
Maybe. But it does not serve as justification for shooting someone, wouldn't you agree?
Posted on 10/13/20 at 8:53 am to NC_Tigah
quote:
Wow! So Dolloff drew and leveled the gun at Keltner before Keltner ever started to spray.
I am going to go out on a limb, and do some further speculation, into what we are soon going to find out: Keltner made a grave mistake, he never thought he would run into anyone as evil as Dolloff, and have things escalate so quickly. The cops retrieved two guns at the scene. I think the other one is going to be Keltner's, and it will be something similar to a Ruger light carry Semi-auto, that he was carrying in his right back pocket, but he made the mistake of having the mace in his right hand. That's just a hunch that I have, because it doesn't seem like Keltner would be the type, to walk around unarmed.
Posted on 10/13/20 at 8:54 am to BugAC
quote:If you were asking whether Keltner’s assault upon Dolloff, standing alone, would justify Dolloff shooting Keltner… yes, I would agree with you. That alone would likely NOT be adequate justification.
But it does not serve as justification for shooting someone, wouldn't you agree?
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:00 am to AggieHank86
quote:Weapon leveled. No gas deployed.
The question is whether the actions of each man were reasonable under the circumstances.
Keltner never came close to "reaching into his jacket". Both hands were visible the entire time.
This post was edited on 10/13/20 at 9:01 am
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:01 am to AggieHank86
First, Dolloff put his hands on Keltner and shoved him, and he has no right to do that. That is assault. Keltner has no idea who the frick Dolloff is. He has no uniform, no badge or anything. He's just some frick on the street. He had no right to ever touch Keltner.
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:03 am to AggieHank86
quote:
No, I do not consider that an assault.
Statutorily?
Lolz
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:09 am to the808bass
quote:Let's take a look.quote:Statutorily?
No, I do not consider that an assault.
quote:I have trouble seeing "placing hands on chest to prevent a fight" falling into any of those three provisions.
Colorado law defines assault as unlawfully causing injury to another person. This crime may be charged as a misdemeanor or a felony depending on the circumstances. There are three degrees of assault (from most serious to least serious):
First-degree assault (18-3-202 C.R.S.): Intentionally causing serious injury with a deadly weapon.
Second-degree assault (18-3-203 C.R.S.): Intentionally causing serious injury without a deadly weapon.
Third-degree assault (18-3-204 C.R.S.): Negligently causing injury with a deadly weapon.
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:10 am to AggieHank86
looks like an open-palm slap doesnt meet any of those definitions either 
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:11 am to Tiguar
quote:Statutory/Criminal assault (as referenced by Bass)? I agree. Probably not.
looks like an open-palm slap doesnt meet any of those definitions either
As an aside, I see that Colorado is one of the states that still treats "assault" and "battery" as separate torts, so it would be more accurate to say that Keltner "battered" Dolloff.
This post was edited on 10/13/20 at 9:25 am
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:12 am to AggieHank86
quote:
Exactly what Colorado statute is violated by attempting to piss people off?
WOW! You know. You are a lawyer!
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:13 am to Tiguar
quote:
looks like an open-palm slap doesnt meet any of those definitions either
It certainly doesn't.
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:20 am to NC_Tigah
quote:Agreed.
Keltner never came close to "reaching into his jacket". Both hands were visible the entire time.
That lawyer is hurting his client. He needs to shut his pie hole until he learns the facts better.
This post was edited on 10/13/20 at 9:21 am
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:21 am to AggieHank86
Friend, if the lawyer is saying that right now, that means they probably have no case and are positioning for a sweet heart plea deal.
I’d bet money he’s saying that to try to get rid of the “malice” component and just look like his client is an idiot with an itchy trigger finger.
It was all a horrible mistake. Tragic.
I’d bet money he’s saying that to try to get rid of the “malice” component and just look like his client is an idiot with an itchy trigger finger.
It was all a horrible mistake. Tragic.
This post was edited on 10/13/20 at 9:23 am
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:22 am to omegaman66
quote:Someone has a crazy theory, and I am supposed to just ... know it?quote:WOW! You know. You are a lawyer!
Exactly what Colorado statute is violated by attempting to piss people off?
Sorry, clairvoyance is not in my skill set.
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:23 am to AggieHank86
quote:
I think they are freaking insane
What leads you to the conclusion that a conservative judge with a skeleton in his closet that begins voting left because he is being blackmailed is insane?
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:29 am to omegaman66
quote:Because I understand that John Grisham writes FICTION.
omegaman66
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:39 am to AggieHank86
quote:
Because I understand that John Grisham writes FICTION.
What part of the theory do you find insane was the question.
Posted on 10/13/20 at 9:45 am to AggieHank86
Dolloff was not assaulted he put his hands on the victim first.
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