re: Is regime change the only acceptable outcome for the US in Iran?

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People will claim Trump didn't finish the job and that we got ran out of Iran and lost.

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I have obviously been super critical of how we’ve played this. I didn’t think JCPOA was flawless, but it was a step. I definitely didn’t agree with Netanyahu’s hawkish hyperbole & didn’t like that we renegged so early.

But if this ends with regime change & a more cooperative Iran without an extended occupation then all those choices are justified.

So we’re on the same page, just have to see how it plays out. At this point the regime can’t survive.

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Please show some of the parallels...because I can assure you they simply don't exist in any meaningful way.

They're "a problem" but they aren't anywhere near the problem that Nazi Germany was.

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The Iranian Islamic Regime is more fanatical than Nazi Germany was. Nazi Germany's regime was not based on Religion. This Iran Islamic Regime is determined to obtain nuclear weapons and to use them to accomplish their foreign policy objectives. Their Religion dictates that the Jews and their allies must be defeated or destroyed. Iran is a faith-based long-war entity committed to war, not peace.

Nazi Germany was worse due to the Jewish Final Solution genocide. Nothing can compare to that, UNLESS Islamic Iran gets nuclear weapons.

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At this point the regime can’t survive.

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How does this happen?

As has been said, it seems highly unlikely you can force regime change by bombing alone.
Seems like the likely scenario is either
1 - U.S./Israel/Arab coalition to send troops in and force a new regime; and/or
2 - Forment some type of revolution/civil war.

Given the current political state of the USA, #1 seems almost impossible for a variety of reasons.
#2 seems more likely but has a lot of danger in the sense that who knows how many factions will emerge in Iran given such a situation, and what those factions will look like. Ideally, it would just be two: pro-regime and anti-regime, but I highly doubt it would really be that simplistic.

It will likely take boots on the ground just to push back the Iranians to keep the strait open. It will almost definitely take ground troops to change the regime.

The best case scenario is that the United States and the Iranians sit at the negotiation table and end this shite.

And it cannot be iterated more strongly that the Israelis should NOT have a seat at the table. They don't want this to end and do not share the same goals as we do.

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And it cannot be iterated more strongly that the Israelis should NOT have a seat at the table. They don't want this to end and do not share the same goals as we do.

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This feels like a pipe dream. You saw what happened the last time we negotiated with Iran without buy-in from Israel.

My crystal ball, and I have thought something along these lines once this started is that a revolution/civil war.

At some point - at least after we get some degree of control over the Striaght, we cease/"pause" the campaign. WE declare our objectives met. We then wait for some type of anti-government activity to begin within Iran. Hopefully, those forces do emerge and hopefully the only powerful factions are fairly moderate, like say the Kurds and the pro-Shah people. We arm and help these forces and after a relatively short period the regime is defeated.

A lot of hopeful thinking in there. What seems more than possible though is that such a war will not be so easy. With our attacks it is eay to frame the battle as a nationalist and even religious war - which will attract people to the regime, or otherwise anti-American factions. You will have a protracted struggle that requires hundreds of billions to be spent on our part, a lot of refugees, instability crossing into other countries (iraq, for example).


Or, we could just go to the negotiation table - work out a cease-fire or peace agreement and let the regime claim victory and survive.

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Germany at the time of WW2 had one of the most powerful and technologically cable armies in the world.

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Revisionist history much?

It's well known that if Europe had made the stand they should have made when Germany invaded Poland the Nazis would have toppled within a couple of weeks.

At the beginning of the war they weren't even fully motorized. They had a significant percentage of soldiers still on horseback, for Pete's sake.

They weren't modernized with respect to logistics either. Not nearly to the degree that American forces were. They often had to rely on captured equipment.

I rate your claim FALSE.

If we don't regime change, they'll be x10 worse when the next Dem admin helps them rebuild. It's freedom or nothing for the Persians, assuming they step up when the time is right

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It is the only acceptable outcome for the Iranian people anyway.

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It may seem less acceptable when they see what that would require.