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Started By
Message
1
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:12 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
It doesn't show how many firearms are used in the commission of homicides from the time they were purchased to within that waiting period time frame, i.e. X number of people were shot within X days of legally purchasing a firearm.
That's not a reasonable statistic to gather without some way to know definitively which gun fired every bullet used in a crime, even if it's not recovered.
quote:
They don't even address how many people are killed with legally purchased firearms.
Every firearm starts its life as a legally purchased firearm, unless we're talking African warlords.
quote:
Efficacy of medical care is a giant variable that should be accounted for.
Are you saying the variable they missed that would swing this study is the quality of care in states with waiting periods vs those without, and that it somehow biases the study?
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:12 pm to BamaAtl
Still waiting mon frere. Will you ever comment on why you are for/against common sense mental health and background checks on alcohol?
Why aren't you calling for common sense alcohol control? Why do you feel that it's okay to sell domestic abusers alcohol to fuel their next domestic assault?
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Why aren't you calling for common sense alcohol control? Why do you feel that it's okay to sell domestic abusers alcohol to fuel their next domestic assault?
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:12 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
as a whole, do the owners who own a disproportionate amount of guns account for a corresponding large % of violent gun crime?
We don't really know, since number of guns a person owns when they commit a crime isn't a published statistic.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:13 pm to BamaAtl
See what I mean when I call you disingenuous?
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:14 pm to BamaAtl
So about that common sense alcohol control.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:17 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
We don't really know, since number of guns a person owns when they commit a crime isn't a published statistic.
well then saying that the number of people with a "gun fetish" having any impact on anything is a bad assessment, correct?
if we don't know in my scenario, you don't know anywhere
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
i'm looking at cities within state to control for the state gun laws
Not sure anyone has those data at the city level. You could create your own dataset combining the city gun homicide rates with gun law ratings, have fun?
However, it still doesn't account for things like over half of Chicago's guns used in crimes coming from outside the state. Illinois strengthening gun laws won't do anything for that.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:18 pm to BamaAtl
Your appeal to emotion and failure to be intellectually honest is noted.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:18 pm to BamaAtl
Why aren't you calling for common sense alcohol control? Why do you feel that it's okay to sell domestic abusers alcohol to fuel their next domestic assault?
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:18 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
That's not a reasonable statistic to gather without some way to know definitively which gun fired every bullet used in a crime, even if it's not recovered.
It's the crux of the argument. How many guns are used to commit homicides or shootings within a certain amount of time after their legal purchasing.
quote:
Every firearm starts its life as a legally purchased firearm, unless we're talking African warlords.
Yes, and the question is how many of those that are legally purchased are used in the commission of crimes within a certain window in states that have or don't have that waiting period law.
quote:
Are you saying the variable they missed that would swing this study is the quality of care in states with waiting periods vs those without, and that it somehow biases the study?
I'm saying that is a reason why they should use shootings as a variable instead of homicides. You can't fricking read, dude.
That study is absolute garbage. The people that reviewed it should be ashamed of themselves.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:19 pm to Centinel
quote:
a symptom instead of the underlying disease.
The underlying disease is the fetishization of guns in America, which is what I'm addressing.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:19 pm to BamaAtl
Why aren't you calling for common sense alcohol control? Why do you feel that it's okay to sell domestic abusers alcohol to fuel their next domestic assault?
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:20 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
well then saying that the number of people with a "gun fetish" having any impact on anything is a bad assessment, correct?
I mean, there are over 500 families in Vegas that might disagree with that of late.
My point toward the fetish crowd is more that they drive policy debates by rolling out boogeymen and attempting to scare the low-information voter who watches Fox News.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:20 pm to BamaAtl
Why aren't you calling for common sense alcohol control? Why do you feel that it's okay to sell domestic abusers alcohol to fuel their next domestic assault?
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:24 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
You could create your own dataset combining the city gun homicide rates with gun law ratings, have fun?
gun law ratings become irrelevant in most scenarios b/c almost all gun laws are federal or state
so comparing cities within the same state will control for gun laws, unless a city has an outlier ordinance (like NYC or Chicago)
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:24 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
It's the crux of the argument. How many guns are used to commit homicides or shootings within a certain amount of time after their legal purchasing.
The crux of the argument is that adding additional obstacles (in this case, waiting periods) to gun purchases helps to lower gun violence.
quote:
I'm saying that is a reason why they should use shootings as a variable instead of homicides
They used homicides, not shootings. Because there wouldn't be any appreciable difference between medical care in states with and without waiting periods that would bias it one way or the other - it's all in the US.
quote:
That study is absolute garbage.
Very cogent critique.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:25 pm to BamaAtl
Why aren't you calling for common sense alcohol control? Why do you feel that it's okay to sell domestic abusers alcohol to fuel their next domestic assault?
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Why do you think it's okay to sell someone alcohol knowing they are exponentially more likely to commit suicide than had you not sold them alcohol?
Why do you think it's okay to sell habitual offenders alcohol when alcohol is a root cause of their criminal activity?
Why you you want to keep minorities down and in an ever revolving door of crime and incarceration due to alcohol addiction?
A simple mental health and background check could conpletely change these people's lives.
You're a cruel and shitty person for enabling such horrible and vindictive practices.
You'd think as a champion of minorities you would be on board with a plan that will overwhelmingly bring happiness and healthiness to minority communities by halting alcohol sales to at risk citizens.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:25 pm to beerJeep
You can keep dodging all you want. Your hypocrisy is duely noted.
Posted on 11/14/17 at 3:27 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
I mean, there are over 500 families in Vegas that might disagree with that of late.
again, why are you bringing up outlier mass killings?
you said this LAST page when confronted with the same emotional appeal:
quote:
Which is why I've said it's a terrible idea to craft policy around preventing them.
Better to prevent the violence/deaths as a whole.
i'm talking about the "whole" argument and you fall back on mass shootings. why?
quote:
My point toward the fetish crowd is more that they drive policy debates by rolling out boogeymen and attempting to scare the low-information voter who watches Fox News.
so the gun fetishists cannot be associated with a direct link to our gun violence issues?
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