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re: Foremost Ukraine experts: This War is the USA's fault

Posted on 3/8/22 at 7:07 am to
Posted by LookSquirrel
Old Millville
Member since Oct 2019
7654 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 7:07 am to
DECLARATION - Msgr. Carlo Maria Vigano, Archbishop - on Ukraine - Russia Crisis

SCRBD

He explains it all and brings the receipts to back it up. But it is 24 pages and therefore TLDR.

I can almost write any comments to this, before they are made.

He is a Putin apologist conspiracy theory Wack job...

Predictable.
Posted by Srobi14
South Florida
Member since Aug 2014
4009 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 7:17 am to
quote:

I don’t have any trouble figuring out who the bad a good guys are.


I seriously doubt this, unless you study geopolitics full time and even then it is complex and difficult to gauge because every country has its own interests. But I guess generally you can tell based on where the conflict is taking place. By who the foreign invaders are that are acting for imperialist or over-stepping geo strategic goals.
This post was edited on 3/8/22 at 7:20 am
Posted by Fontainebleau Dr.
Mid-View New Orleans
Member since Dec 2012
2401 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 7:25 am to
quote:

But in the end our hands are just as dirty as the nations we deem “bad guys”. Only difference in most cases is we keep our dirty work hidden better than most.


The US Government/CIA arguably ARE the global bad guys.

Look at what the US did in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan, etc.

And it always gets packaged to the American populace as some sort of crusade of liberty.

I mean is any corporate media outlet going to acknowledge that we joined forces with NAZIS to wage the Maidan coup in 2014? Not Nazis in the way American leftists throw around the word to people they disagree with. Not like new wave neo-Nazis. But good old fashioned, old school NAZIS.

Posted by JJJimmyJimJames
Southern States
Member since May 2020
18496 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 7:45 am to
Vigano is a treasure.

Much to read there and worthy of foundational respect.

Again Carlo Vigano is a treasure
Posted by Eurocat
Member since Apr 2004
16590 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 8:05 am to
And here is who "Russia Expert" Clint Ehrlich actually is.

Just 5 years ago he called himself a "Hacker/Law Student"
LINK

The SAME YEAR somehow, this man who I can't even find where he got his bachelor degree became a researcher at MOSCOW STATE UNIVERSITY. This is a BIG job, everyone knows that this is the "Harvard of the former USSR" and any kind of fellowship or something is hard to get there. Yet he as a law student (his current Linked In bio does not list him as a lawyer, thus making me seem he either never graduated, gave up, or couldn't pass the bar).

LINK

He runs a pro-Putin fact checking website that has a name that is even deceitful. You guys will have heard of factcheck.org probably. so what does he do but start a website called factcheck.net Yes indeed.
People called him out in 2017 already about this.
LINK

QUOTE -

When contacted by BuzzFeed News, Clint Ehrlich said he is behind the site trying to debunk "bogus claims about Mr. Trump and Russia's government."
Updated on January 24, 2017, 4:28 pm


After the publication of this story, the site posted a response "officially announcing" that Erlich is its editor-in-chief.

"I was the primary person involved in writing the content of the report, but the project was a collective effort that drew on the expertise of likeminded professionals, both for sourcing and analysis," Ehrlich said in an email to BuzzFeed News. "Some of those people work inside Russia's foreign-ministry and/or intelligence community, but the site was not created with the approval of anyone in Russia's government."


Upon its release, someone with the username FactCheckDotNet began submitting a link to the report in different Reddit subgroups to try and get attention for the work. One redditor was immediately skeptical of a site that mimicked US fact-checking site FactCheck.org, and said that it was making big claims with no evidence or authors to back it up.

The man behind the DrJackMegaman account provided BuzzFeed News with a screenshot of the author information he found in the PDF.

He says he is a 35-year-old based in New Jersey who has worked with computers for a long time. He became suspicious about the quality of the information and its source after seeing it pop up on Reddit, he said. So he began looking into the site and PDF.


Ehrlich now estimates that he paid roughly $1,000 for the domain name back in 2014.

“I’m not hiding the fact that I like Russia,” Ehrlich previously told BuzzFeed News. “I feel like my views about international relations are something I can say [in Russia], because I agree with a lot of what the foreign ministry has to say and I value the culture and the people."

Posted by JJJimmyJimJames
Southern States
Member since May 2020
18496 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 8:08 am to
your support for escalation of war and for the New World Order is amazing

in light of the truth that you so comfortably ignore
Posted by theunknownknight
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2005
60183 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 8:09 am to
quote:

It’s time Zelensky drops the MOAB of all the Clinton, Obama, Biden, Pelosi, Schumer, Kerry, Graham, McConnell, etc family crimes laundering money from American tax paying citizens back to their own filthy pockets.




Who do you think installed him? Zelensky is a deep state asset.
Posted by Ag Zwin
Member since Mar 2016
25401 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 8:13 am to
quote:

Let’s put the blame for this war where it belongs and that would be right square on the shoulders of Vlad Putin.

As time goes on and social media has allowed the ability to see how people think, I am just flabbergasted at how little people are able to process multiple levels of “cause and effect”.

Putting this solely (and maybe even primarily) on Putin simply infantile.
Posted by Decatur
Member since Mar 2007
31768 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 8:21 am to
quote:

He is a Putin apologist conspiracy theory Wack job...


Posted by SDVTiger
Cabo San Lucas
Member since Nov 2011
93758 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 8:23 am to
All of this is so embarassing for you
Posted by Marye
Member since Oct 2020
547 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 9:18 am to
quote:

Who do you think installed him? Zelensky is a deep state asset.


Have we been duped again? Obama redux?

" 11PRESIDENT VOLODYMYR OLEKSANDROVYCH ZELENSKY As has been pointed out by many parties, the candidacy and election of Ukrainian President Zelensky corresponds to that recent cliché , inaugurated in recent years, of a comic actor or entertainment personality being lent to politics. Do not believe that being without a suitable cursus honorum is an obstacle to the rising to the top of institutions; on the contrary: the more a person is apparently a stranger to the world of political parties, the more it is to be assumed that his success is determined by those who hold power. Zelensky’s performances in drag are perfectly consistent with the LGBTQ ideology that is considered by its European sponsors as an indispensable requirement of the“reform” agenda that every country ought to embrace, along with gender equality, abortion and the green economy. No wonder Zelensky, a member of the WEF(here), was able to benefit from the support of Schwab and his allies to come to power and ensure that theGreat Reset would also be carried out in Ukraine.

The 57-part television series that Zelensky produced and starred in, demonstrates that the media planned his candidacy for President of Ukraine and his election campaign. In the fiction show "The Servant of the People" he played the part of a high school teacher who unexpectedly became President of the Republic and fought against the corruption of politics.

Zelensky himself has admitted to having as his inspiration, the Prime Minister of Canada Justin Trudeau."

LINK



This post was edited on 3/8/22 at 9:23 am
Posted by Pettifogger
I don't really care, Margaret
Member since Feb 2012
86097 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 9:22 am to
quote:

Could be our "fault" but we are not the perpetrators. Russia still has agency, and they are using that agency to shoot missiles at apartment buildings.



No way dude Putin just wants us to be the best versions of ourselves
Posted by Fat Bastard
2024 NFL pick'em champion
Member since Mar 2009
89297 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 10:16 am to
quote:

All of this is so embarassing for you




DECATURD has no shame like most commies here.
Posted by ThuperThumpin
Member since Dec 2013
9060 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 1:50 pm to
quote:

No question about it


No offence but I think you are actually doing a disservice to the discussion had on the video by the assertion in your title.

Did you watch the entire video? This was discussion on how American foreign policy failures contributed to the situation. Not everyone agreed with your title post that this is the entirely the USA's fault including one of the host. I do think its important to recognize the POV of Putin and acknowledge our own policy failures but to suggest that Putin is without out fault just doesnt make any sense to me.

As was pointed out by one of the other guests, Putin in the last 20 years hasnt been able to make Russia as a more attractive ally and business partner than the USA, EU, NATO to ex Soviet bloc countries. Is that the fault of the USA too? I've seen Mearsheimer speak on other platforms and I really do appreciate his input but his opinion that might makes right in foreign policy imo sounds like he is contradicting himself. After all if that is the case then any stronger county that feels the least bit threatened by it neighbor has the right to invade it. Also that would also pretty much excuse the actions and policy decisions of the USA and NATO over the last 20 years because after all we are the baddest kids on the block. IDK his logic gets kinda fuzzy there.

Its was a good discussion though and even those that may disagree with your assertion that "This War is the USA's Fault" should give it a listen
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
69838 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 1:54 pm to
quote:

Pretty sure we identified the problem


Indeed.

Putin violated the Memorandum of Security Assurances as it relates to Ukraine, of which Russia was a signatory back in 1994. Ukraine is an independent state who should be allowed to seek closer ties to western Europe and the United States should it choose to do so. I don't see how this is so difficult to understand.
Posted by coachcrisp
pensacola, fl
Member since Jun 2012
30911 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 2:28 pm to
This thread encompasses both sides of an extremely complicated predicament.
There are TWO sides to this crisis, and people shouldn't think that their opinion is the correct one.
Imo, the only way to get through this is for BOTH sides(NATO and Russia) to privately and secretly) to negotiate it, with the U.S. leading the way for NATO.
If the Ukrainian people won't accept the outcome, it should be them that deals with it.
Posted by ThuperThumpin
Member since Dec 2013
9060 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 2:38 pm to
quote:

Ukraine is an independent state who should be allowed to seek closer ties to western Europe and the United States should it choose to do so. I don't see how this is so difficult to understand.


I generally agree with what you are saying but I do think its important to examine the details of our own foreign policy with Putin over the last 20 years. I can understand the arguments that Mearsheimer and McGovern make without agreeing to the OP's assertion that the is War is the USA's fault. As I stated not even the platform's host agrees with that statement but there are lessons in diplomacy that need to be heard.
Posted by Ghost of Barnwell
central alabama
Member since Dec 2013
1826 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 2:40 pm to
You are the worst troll on the net......

Hands down.
Posted by JJJimmyJimJames
Southern States
Member since May 2020
18496 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 2:51 pm to
I consider Mearscheimer to be the predominant leader of the discussion and he essentially comes out within the first 10 minutes and says it is USAs fault (as you say, by faulty foreign policy) - also essentially maintained that through the talk.

I did watch all of it.
Posted by JJJimmyJimJames
Southern States
Member since May 2020
18496 posts
Posted on 3/8/22 at 2:52 pm to
hmm interesting non sequitur - I will be sure to remember your name
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