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Started By
Message
re: Breaking: CNN reporting that 10 years of Trump’s tax returns have been given to the NYT.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:42 pm to Taxing Authority
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:42 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
How did the NYT legally get them?
Sweet baby jeebus I hope they got them from a Russian hacker.
They got them from Trump. 4D time travel chess.
2
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:44 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
Ok. You’re great at calling people ignorant, but you’ve yet to actually show you are any less ignorant.
The problem is you are so uneducated on how the tax code works that having a discussion with you would be like teaching algebra to a preschooler.
Your theories and examples are laughable. Success ratio? Really? That’s comical.
The tax code was written to give real estate investors enormous tax advantages. And, if you qualify as a Real Estate Professional, the tax advantages are mind boggling. Too much to type here, so go research it yourself.
The multiple LLC info you bring up...That’s a normal thing for business owners, real estate investors and other entrepreneurs. Each serves different purposes, and again, is defined by the tax code. I fit the above three categories and the number off llc’s I’m invested in and/or own 100% are in the low to mid double digits. 500 seems realistic to me.
I would be surprised to see that Trump has paid much in taxes over the past 20 yrs. He’s in the most tax friendly profession in the world. He can afford the best CPA’s and Tax Attorney’s in the world. They will know the code better than just about anyone.
I know you hate Trump and want so bad to see he isn’t worth as much as people think, or that Russia has loaned him money, or blah blah blah. But these arguments you are making are foolish.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:46 pm to tilco
I am glad I do not watch a second of cnn/MSNBC or read any newspapers.
None of this crap bothers me. Lies and more Lies and crimes committed to fabricate more lies.
Something must be getting close for this to come out now.
None of this crap bothers me. Lies and more Lies and crimes committed to fabricate more lies.
Something must be getting close for this to come out now.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:46 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
A financial advisor was working for a company and Trump was one of their clients. He discovered that the bonds for one of Trump’s casinos were junk, and he warned his own clients about this as was his responsibility.
The bonds were issued as junk bonds meaning the underlying entity had less than bbb+ credit rating or insufficient history to rate. The investors bought the junk bonds knowing they were junk and the risk profile of junk, because they were issued as junk.
All debt doesn't start out investment grade and get weaker as performance weakens or concerns over performance grows.
The analyst made a call on the prospects of Atlantic City and the broader economy and how it would impact the value of the debt.
There was no issue of the investors not knowing they were invested in junk bonds. They knew and were attracted to the higher return junk bonds offered.
What you described is investor fraud and a serious crime. You were some combination of ignorant or dishonest. I pegged it 50/50 on a hunch.
Do I need to continue?
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:48 pm to tilco
Actually, Trump releasing them would be freaking genius.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:50 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
Besides the analyst is there to tell his story, so the author can be pretty much ignored. And the analyst even says it ended up being a silver-lining in the end and led him to a much happier career.
That same analyst also says he signed an NDA. That same analyst was the opposing party in litigation. A bit of confirmation bias if you take this as the complete story.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:54 pm to StrongSafety
quote:
Or show that he’s the horrible business man facts show
You need to seek psychiatric treatment ASAP.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 9:56 pm to deathvalleytiger10
quote:Besides speculating about his filing status (which I did mix up), and saying that losing money is a legal way to have to pay taxes, I haven’t even discussed the tax code. So at least point to something I discussed.
The problem is you are so uneducated on how the tax code works that having a discussion with you would be like teaching algebra to a preschooler.
quote:A poster listed the number of businesses he had, and the number of bankruptcies out of that total. That gives us a ratio, and I could have used the failure ratio instead, but I chose the successes. What else would you want me to call (business successes/total businesses)?
Success ratio? Really? That’s comical.
quote:I’m aware of the advantages, but let’s not pretend that it’s something that is uniquely advantageous to real-estate businesses.
The tax code was written to give real estate investors enormous tax advantages. And, if you qualify as a Real Estate Professional, the tax advantages are mind boggling. Too much to type here, so go research it yourself.
quote:I know. I wasn’t the one who brought it up. I was actually pointing out that the aforementioned ratio was a pointless way to judge the overall success since some of those are way larger than others.
The multiple LLC info you bring up...That’s a normal thing for business owners, real estate investors and other entrepreneurs.
quote:Well we’ve already known this since he claimed a billion dollar loss that he could carry over for 20 years about 20 years ago.
I would be surprised to see that Trump has paid much in taxes over the past 20 yrs.
quote:I don’t think it’s as friendly as it was since they closed that loophole he used for the billion dollar loss, a year or two after that.
He’s in the most tax friendly profession in the world.
quote:I’ve literally never said this. I did say the Bank of China holds a significant portion of his debt, because that’s true and not some secret.
or that Russia has loaned him money,
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:02 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:Nope. It can't be both.
I don’t know what he should have done, but I know what he did do was despicable
quote:Maybe he was wrong.
but he used his power to try to ruin him,
quote:Trooof.
You criticized me for not making a value judgment,
quote:I asked you to look beyond the carefully crafted, made-for-TV, cliche "rich man bad" version of the story, even giving you the fairy-tale credit that Trump thought they were worthless...
and when I present a story that I found to be important in my judgment, you criticize me for making that judgment.
The obvious--who would have been helped by Trump publicly proclaiming his bonds were worthless? Why should he aid those saying that? Who would have helped?
Clearly not his bondholders -- who were the ones you're trying to say were hurt by their lacking value. Such a public proclamation would have made their vale $0, overnight, with no hope of recovery.
For all you or I know he did that to advocate for people that stood to lose millions of dollars, and give those-that bothered to educate themselves-time to make an exit. Is saving other innocent people from losing millions of dollars a horrible thing to do? You tell us.
quote:Not at all. I think Trump is a douche bag. It has nothing to do with his relative wealth.
And worse you just dismiss Trump’s behaviors.
quote:Terrrible? No. Just sohpmoric, naive, and gullible. I've given you a perfectly viable alternative above. Let's see what you do with it.
Is it so terrible for someone to read that story and form a strong negative opinion about Trump?
This post was edited on 5/7/19 at 10:13 pm
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:05 pm to BBONDS25
quote:Served it's purpose. He now feels "smarter" and "educated" about Trump. Affirmed in his certitude of having a complete picture of the moral character of a person he's never met or spoken to.
That NYT article you believed was pure crap. This one doesn’t seem to be much better.
Classic Dunning-Krueger stuff. It makes the birthers look tame.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:09 pm to Scoop
It's so weird that people act like they care about this.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:09 pm to deathvalleytiger10
quote:I own a couple of businesses. Worse yet I'm about to own share of an aircraft (no brag, it's got props!!). My isht is about to get fileted into as many little pieces as possible.
That’s a normal thing for business owners, real estate investors and other entrepreneurs. Each serves different purposes, and again, is defined by the tax code. I fit the above three categories and the number off llc’s I’m invested in and/or own 100% are in the low to mid double digits. 500 seems realistic to me.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:16 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
I haven’t even discussed the tax code
What? We are discussing his tax returns. The tax code governs how those returns are filed.
quote:
I’m aware of the advantages, but let’s not pretend that it’s something that is uniquely advantageous to real-estate businesses.
You post the above statement and follow with this....
quote:
I don’t think it’s as friendly as it was since they closed that loophole he used for the billion dollar loss, a year or two after that.
This demonstrates your ignorance. Yes, the code changed in the 80’s but as a Real Estate Professional the code absolutely gives tax advantages to those that qualify that others do not get. It is 100% “uniquely advantageous” as you put it.
Your knowledge on this is rudimentary at best. Again, do some research. The IRS has specific guidelines on what constitutes a Real Estate Professional and the tax laws that govern such designation.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:23 pm to BBONDS25
quote:That’s fair, but my issue is that pretty much all of his concerning behaviors have plenty of verifiable examples, decent and distant.
That same analyst also says he signed an NDA. That same analyst was the opposing party in litigation. A bit of confirmation bias if you take this as the complete story.
For example, he actually filed (not just threatened like here) a lawsuit because a journalist estimated his wealth to be a couple hundred million.
And just look at how he responds to even relatively minor comments. Like when Tillerson said something about how Trump would to do things that weren’t legal, not because it was intentional, but because he didn’t care to educate himself. And Trump took to Twitter with the childish (and just untrue) insult that Tillerson was as dumb as a rock.
Or we have the suit and counter-suit over his Chicago property by Deutsche Bank, which was being built during the 2008 financial crash. The bank knew that the 600+ dollar loan was a lost cause, but they sued Trump for the $60ish million he had personally guaranteed. He countered with a $2 billion dollar suit, blaming them for the crash. They ultimately won, and one of their major defenses was a quote from Trump that basically admitted he loved borrowing because he didn’t have to pay it back.
So what was alleged in that story is not even surprising. But regardless let’s get to Trump’s truly inexcusable flaw, one so bad that you would have to give up your dignity to defend it:
He wrote in a blog post during the 2008 primaries that “Hillary would make a good President.”
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:25 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
wrote in a blog post during the 2008 primaries that “Hillary would make a good President.
Unforgivable. You got me. Thanks for sticking around in the thread. Was a nice discussion.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:37 pm to deathvalleytiger10
quote:We don’t have enough information to discuss the intricacies, other than the fact that they noted that depreciation was not a significant function of the losses.
What? We are discussing his tax returns. The tax code governs how those returns are filed.
quote:Like what makes it so advantageous compared to any number of other businesses? In fact, I would argue the biggest benefit of real-estate for most people is not the tax benefits, it’s the ability to leverage debt.
This demonstrates your ignorance. Yes, the code changed in the 80’s but as a Real Estate Professional the code absolutely gives tax advantages to those that qualify that others do not get. It is 100% “uniquely advantageous” as you put it.
quote:I mean all I said was that it wasn’t such an extremely and unique advantage, and I meant that in regards to businesses. They too benefit from any number of business deductions. Amazon is a prime example. And they advantage of depreciation and amortization. And I’m well aware of things like the MACRS tables, because I was able to depreciate a portion of my home (home office) for my consulting work, although the 39 year table I had to use is not as good as the tables for say a rental property. I also invest in REIT’s, and I researched them before buying. So I’m not completely unaware of some unique advantages of real estate investment trusts.
Your knowledge on this is rudimentary at best. Again, do some research. The IRS has specific guidelines on what constitutes a Real Estate Professional and the tax laws that govern such designation.
That being said, I don’t see how the advantages from the tax code are so great that it makes real-estate the surest investment.
But rather than saying it is, and calling me ignorant, why don’t you provide an example or two.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:38 pm to BBONDS25
quote:Til the next argument.
Unforgivable. You got me. Thanks for sticking around in the thread. Was a nice discussion.
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:41 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
I don’t see how the advantages from the tax code are so great that it makes real-estate the surest investment.
Statements like this is where you get yourself into trouble. RE has the most advantageous tax breaks, loopholes, and benefits of any industry. By far. It's not even close. Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:46 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:Well you missed an important part of the comment:
Statements like this is where you get yourself into trouble. RE has the most advantageous tax breaks, loopholes, and benefits of any industry.
quote:In other words, the tax advantages aren’t enough alone to make it the surest investment.
the surest investment.
quote:Tell that to the Hollywood accountants.
By far. It's not even close
This post was edited on 5/7/19 at 10:48 pm
Posted on 5/7/19 at 10:50 pm to StrongSafety
quote:
Or show that he’s the horrible business man facts show
Nah. What it’s going to show is that imbeciles like whatever it is you are are nothing but stupid, babbling, village idiots.
quote:
StrongSafety
You dumb, useless S.O.A.B.
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