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Started By
Message
re: Biden blowing up the pipeline would do more to fight "globalism" than anything Trump
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:13 am to GumboPot
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:13 am to GumboPot
quote:
This is such a childish theory.
This is LITERALLY what Putin historically does.
quote:
If Putin closed the valve and was concerned about losing the propaganda war from the NYTs and WaPo as Europeans are freezing and can't make fertilizer then he could just open the valve.
Why did he manufacture a bullshite justification to invade Ukraine, then?
quote:
We are talking about billion of dollars
No we're not. There wasn't going to be gas flowing in that pipeline anytime soon. The sabotage has no net effect on any of those variables.
quote:
Germany trading in rubles and losing political and economic leverage over the biggest country in the EU is not in our best interest.
The US would spend trillions of dollars to subsidize the EU to prevent this rather than risk war with some of our closest allies.
This is legit fantasy bullshite.
2
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:16 am to Mo Jeaux
quote:
How can an imperialistic system be anti-globalist? I
Because it's meant to serve the interest of one country that only accounts for 5 percent of the global population? That might be a guess.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:16 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Yeah, the elites and technocrats
I'm confused about the laughing? Have you never read any of Yuval Noah Harari's books? He is essentially the main driver of technocratic thought in the WEF and the members refer to themselves as technocrats.
As others said after your response... having 99% of the global population live as slaves to the top 1% is the all-but-outright-stated goal.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:17 am to Mo Jeaux
quote:
Well, the WEF has a lot less power than many believe
I agree
I don't think our worldviews on this issue are much different I just disagree with you using "globalism" to describe US hegemony.
quote:
How can an imperialistic system be anti-globalist?
Imperialism is by default, nationalist (for the motherland).
Globalism is fostering international relationships that create relatively even international relationships. Hence, the "global" in "globalism".
quote:
Imperialism by its very nature is "inter", not "intra".
The empire is intra for the motherland. Yes there is a facade of international relationships, but its all subjugation to the one ruler.
Globalism is "free" associations between international actors.
Put it this way: The US can pull out of the Iran nuclear deal with a penstroke. The UK can pull out of the EU by filing some paperwork. The US had to go to war with England to withdraw from the English Empire.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:18 am to tiggerthetooth
quote:
they've always looked down on Americans despite their history in the first half of the 20th century.
No they don’t look down on Americans. That’s ridiculous. I travel extensively in Europe, and their views towards Americans range all across the board. Most admire America; many would love to be Americans; some resent us, usually because they have inferiority complexes. Many other Europeans are just frustrated that America’s policies are so influential in their lives, and they have no say in those policies.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:18 am to TrueTiger
quote:
Faced with freezing, the public will scream to bring back fossil and nukes.
While burning every tree they can get their hands on. Before coal, oil and natural gas, forests would be stripped for fuel. Also, air quality was worse because of all the home heating via wood... plus, all the home that would burn down.
I personally love a real fireplace or woodstove. I like the smell of a wood fireplace and the smoke most wood gives off... as long as it isn't overwhelming. Like it is likely to be in Germany this winter.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:18 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
The US would spend trillions of dollars to subsidize the EU to prevent this rather than risk war with some of our closest allies.
You have to know you're lying. This doesn't even make sense. How do you come to this conclusion with everything that is going on? We're selling weapons and lending aid to Uktaine right now. We would be in a full blown war if the people hadn't gotten so upset about it. The U.S. govt loves them some war and for whatever reason, we're currently willing to sacrifice Europe to do it. If Biden didn't want war, all he would have to do is open up our oil production and this all goes away. Plus we make money. Win-win.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:19 am to Powerman
quote:
Because it's meant to serve the interest of one country that only accounts for 5 percent of the global population? That might be a guess.
Nope. Not at all. Oh, that may be how it starts, but just take a close look at the development of any imperial system over time. Arguably, the original metropole winds up bearing significant burdens in order for the system to survive.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:20 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Why did he manufacture a bullshite justification to invade Ukraine, then?
He said he invaded Ukraine to stop NATO advancement. He does not want Ukraine to join NATO.
Justified or not, that's his reason.
quote:
This is legit fantasy bullshite.
What fantasy?
Do you agree that the U.S. needs to maintain leverage (militarily and economically) over the EU or not?
Would you agree that EU dependence on Russian energy is a threat to U.S. leverage over the EU?
This post was edited on 9/28/22 at 8:26 am
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:20 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
SlowFlowPro
Did you forget to log in from an alter account?
You at 7:02 AM
quote:
You have to REALLY get into CT mindset to justify why Europe or the US would do this.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:21 am to TrueTiger
quote:
It doesn't fit the green agenda either.
Faced with freezing, the public will scream to bring back fossil and nukes.
Somehow I missed this.
100% correct. This Ukraine invasion (and the Western response) has done more to harm Green policies than anything Trump could dream of. It's exposed the flaws in the Green policies, which are major sources of government power grabs going on.
If the Green movement is fractured/harmed by these policies, globalism is harmed, too.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:22 am to GumboPot
quote:
He said he invaded Ukraine to stop NATO advancement. He does not want Ukraine to join NATO.
Which we were clearly meddling in Ukraine. It might also be a long game for him to acquire a straight line path to the Med without going through Turkey.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:23 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Imperialism is by default, nationalist (for the motherland).
quote:
The empire is intra for the motherland. Yes there is a facade of international relationships, but its all subjugation to the one ruler.
No. You and powerman need to really look at imperial developments, not just a cursory idea of what an Empire is. You can pick any one really. They all wind up developing the same way.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:23 am to squid_hunt
quote:
We're selling weapons and lending aid to Uktaine right now.
So are our EU allies
quote:
We would be in a full blown war if the people hadn't gotten so upset about it.
Maybe. Maybe not. Nukes are the biggest factor in that calculus.
quote:
The U.S. govt loves them some war and for whatever reason, we're currently willing to sacrifice Europe to do it.
LINK?
quote:
If Biden didn't want war, all he would have to do is open up our oil production and this all goes away.
Dude. You can't just snap your fingers and put gas in Europe. It takes months/years to increase petro production, process the petro, and ship it over the sea to the EU.
We could be doing more in terms of petro policy, but the EU wouldn't be getting our gas until 2023 regardless.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:27 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
So are our EU allies
Not really relevant. Besides they have incentive to contain Russia. Russia dos not have incentive to blow upnits own freaking pipeline.
quote:
Nukes are the biggest factor in that calculus.
No, they're not. No one is using nukes for the same reason no one has used nukes since Japan. That's an idle threat the media is bleating out because it gets clicks. If they really thought Putin was going to use nukes he would be dead.
quote:
You can't just snap your fingers and put gas in Europe
We could with the billions we sent to Ukraine. If we really wanted to stop a war, it would be easy. We haven't even started heading that direction. Hmm. Wonder why?
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:28 am to GumboPot
quote:
He said he invaded Ukraine to stop NATO advancement. He does not want Ukraine to join NATO.
Yeah, I said it was bullshite.
Why did he feel the need to manufacture this bullshite justification to invade Ukraine?
quote:
Justified or not, that's his reason.
And if he was going to invade Ukraine regardless, which he was, why even manufacture it in the first place?
quote:
Do you agree that the U.S. needs to maintain leverage (militarily and economically) over the EU or not?
We work in collaboration with the EU. They are some of our closest legitimate allies (along with Canada, Mexico, UK, and Japan)
If we were in direct conflict we would probably win, but it would be extremely expensive. Invading Afghanistan and Iraq were ungodly expensive and took 20 years and trillions. Europe would take longer and cost more.
quote:
Would you agree that EU dependence on Russian energy is a threat to U.S. leverage over the EU?
The EU dependence on Russian energy has existed for a long, long time.
Germany and the EU aren't going to turn their backs on the US because of a problem that costs maybe $100-200B, especially when the US would gladly pay that to subsidize European energy prices.
This energy crisis is a crisis that can be solved with money. Less money than it would cost than economic strife with the EU or war with the EU/Russia.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:30 am to squid_hunt
quote:
Not really relevant.
The US and EU being allies and being on the same side is highly relevant to what would amount to a US declaration of war on the EU
quote:
Russia dos not have incentive to blow upnits own freaking pipeline.
Again. Putin loves bullshite justifications.
Just like his irrational bullshite about Ukraine prior to invasion. There was no incentive to create that talking point other than to have people defend Putin.
quote:
We could with the billions we sent to Ukraine. If we really wanted to stop a war, it would be easy. We haven't even started heading that direction. Hmm. Wonder why?
This is a literal non-answer if I've ever seen one
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:34 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Putin loves bullshite justifications.
Russia as a straight irrational actor with no objectives is garbage. Putin has been very deliberate about what he is doin and why. Blowing up the pipeline does not help Putin. He loses leverage. It does help us.
quote:
This is a literal non-answer if I've ever seen one
Is this more of that logic and reason you were trumpeting a couple posts up? You're a deliberate liar. Who knows your motivation but you are trying to muddy the entire issue in a very dishonest way.
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:39 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:quote:
He said he invaded Ukraine to stop NATO advancement. He does not want Ukraine to join NATO.
Yeah, I said it was bullshite.
But it's not. This is the primary reason for Putin's invasion of Ukraine.
Just read his words.
quote:
Why did he feel the need to manufacture this bullshite justification to invade Ukraine?
quote:
Justified or not, that's his reason.
And if he was going to invade Ukraine regardless, which he was, why even manufacture it in the first place?
You are falling into the trap created by our western pundit class call "discourse analysis". You are making up reasons for the Russian invasion of Ukraine and avoiding what Putin and Russian generals have been saying about NATO advancement.
Just admit it. The U.S. under Biden wants to make Ukraine a NATO member state and Biden even said so.
This post was edited on 9/28/22 at 8:41 am
Posted on 9/28/22 at 8:40 am to GumboPot
quote:
it's not. This is one of the primary reason for Putin's invasion of Ukraine.
Just read his words.
So you just take Putin at his word? Jesus Christ man
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