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Started By
Message
re: Shot my first Glock
Posted on 9/10/13 at 2:40 am to AlxTgr
Posted on 9/10/13 at 2:40 am to AlxTgr
quote:
That's kinda what it's looking like.
Ever heard of point-shooting?
That's what happens in 90% of deadly encounters involving untrained individuals. Instincts kick in and tunnel vision trains on the threat, not the front sight. That has to be trained out of a person.
Even trained shooters point-shoot in deadly encounters inside of 35-40 feet.
Better practice both.
2
Posted on 9/10/13 at 7:01 am to olgoi khorkhoi
quote:
Instincts kick in and tunnel vision trains on the threat, not the front sight. That has to be trained out of a person.
I'm not sure what you're saying here. Are you criticizing point shooting? Because it's a sign of proficiency if a person can engage a target without relying on the pistol's sights in defensive/combat situations. If anything the over-reliance on a weapon's sights has to be trained out of a person.
quote:
Even trained shooters point-shoot in deadly encounters inside of 35-40 feet.
That's exactly what they should do.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:39 am to TigerOnThe Hill
quote:Not likely. If and when I get a handgun, it will be for fun only. It will most likely have a hammer and a safety. If I end up in LE or in a war, I'll give the Glocks and other strikers another look.
Who knows, you many end up w/ a self defense handgun after all.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:43 am to AlxTgr
Battle gun 
Only pistols I have with a hammer are revolvers. But they are fun to shoot also.
Only pistols I have with a hammer are revolvers. But they are fun to shoot also.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:44 am to Nodust
quote:
But they are fun to shoot
Especially when they're huge
ETA: And for the tactical guys in the room, shoot well without aiming
This post was edited on 9/10/13 at 8:45 am
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:48 am to AlxTgr
Check out the H&K action. It's a mix between striker and hammer, though it's a hammer fired pistol. Mine has no external safety and really no usable hammer, but it's double action only and really a neat concept. The hammer can actually cock the striker, IDK - when I researched it I found it was the simplest, most reliable thing outside of a revolver. Built more like a tank than Glock as well.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:52 am to Gaston
quote:I'm pretty much married to a safety and the single action portion of the DA/SA. The idea anyway.
Mine has no external safety and really no usable hammer, but it's double action only and really a neat concept.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:57 am to AlxTgr
They sell it in that variant as well. The DA/SA with a safety is probably the most popular variant, but I didn't trust myself with a safety. The whole concept of cocked and locked scares the shite out of me. I need something for dummies, and to me that was a long trigger pull with an external hammer (my thumb rides the hammer when I don't want it to fire). Point, pull the trigger.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:49 am to olgoi khorkhoi
quote:
Ever heard of point-shooting?
That's what happens in 90% of deadly encounters involving untrained individuals. Instincts kick in and tunnel vision trains on the threat, not the front sight. That has to be trained out of a person.
I agree with most of this except the last statement.
Your instinctual "point" when faced in a stressful scenario is most likely how you will aim. If you train to point the gun down your sight line every time you shoot, it will eventually become your natural point. I don't know if you can train it out of someone because we are all human and when the adrenaline kicks in, you won't be thinking, just reacting.
quote:
Better practice both.
I definitely agree with this though.
Tom you crack my shite up.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 11:13 am to bapple
quote:
Tom you crack my shite up.
Well that's getting printed, laminated and put on the fridge.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 12:36 pm to Tom288
Posted on 9/10/13 at 2:22 pm to Gaston
quote:
They sell it in that variant as well.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 8:14 pm to AlxTgr
The carrying of SA/DA pistols by cops is already fairly rare, and is soon to become rarer. Relatively few LE departments are issuing SA/DA pistols -- instead they are putting the LEM trigger in the duty HK's and the DAK trigger in the duty SIGs -- making them DAO. And of course the vast majority of agencies issue Glocks or M&P's.
The reason is that way too may LEO's can't//don't master both trigger pulls (SA and DA). It takes most folks (certainly I'm in the group) a lot of time (lots of rounds) to master one trigger pull. By "master" I mean being able to get accurate rapid followup shots, on demand, under stress.
I see a lot of students who deem an external safety to be an essential feature on a handgun -- often because they're used to rifles and shotguns that have external safeties. (But virtually every instructor under whom I have trained carries a handgun with no external safety).
What is often overlooked by students is that rifles and shotguns aren't carried in holsters that cover the trigger. Self-defense handguns are (except, I suppose, for the folks who plan to walk around in Walmart or Academy with their gun in their hand).
Every handgun should be carried in a holster, even those that are carried in your pocket. And every holster should cover the trigger. This in itself serves as an external safety.
Just my $.02
YMMV
The reason is that way too may LEO's can't//don't master both trigger pulls (SA and DA). It takes most folks (certainly I'm in the group) a lot of time (lots of rounds) to master one trigger pull. By "master" I mean being able to get accurate rapid followup shots, on demand, under stress.
I see a lot of students who deem an external safety to be an essential feature on a handgun -- often because they're used to rifles and shotguns that have external safeties. (But virtually every instructor under whom I have trained carries a handgun with no external safety).
What is often overlooked by students is that rifles and shotguns aren't carried in holsters that cover the trigger. Self-defense handguns are (except, I suppose, for the folks who plan to walk around in Walmart or Academy with their gun in their hand).
Every handgun should be carried in a holster, even those that are carried in your pocket. And every holster should cover the trigger. This in itself serves as an external safety.
Just my $.02
YMMV
Posted on 9/10/13 at 9:03 pm to dawg23
Was that in response to something?
FYI, external is redundant.
FYI, external is redundant.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 9:57 pm to dawg23
quote:
(except, I suppose, for the folks who plan to walk around in Walmart or Academy with their gun in their hand).
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:10 pm to AlxTgr
quote:
FYI, external is redundant.
Not really. Internal safeties exist too.
Posted on 9/10/13 at 10:17 pm to AlxTgr
quote:
My son saw your avi. He said, "WHOA" and pointed to it. He's 7
Just saw this. You training him well
Posted on 9/11/13 at 12:54 am to Tom288
quote:
I'm not sure what you're saying here. Are you criticizing point shooting?
I reread what I wrote and it is confusing. He said it doesn't matter how a gun points, just use the sights. I was giving the "why" for point-shooting, not criticizing.
quote:
it's a sign of proficiency if a person can engage a target without relying on the pistol's sights in defensive/combat situations.
Yes, being proficient at point-shooting is more useful than being a great sight-shooter for the average joe in a life/death self defense situation. That's why I said to practice it.
The point I was trying to make, and apparently failed, is that 99% of untrained people plan on, but aren't able to focus on the front sight in a deadly encounter.
Now, past a certain distance point-shooting becomes a negative and aiming is necessary. That's why I said:
quote:
Instincts kick in and tunnel vision trains on the threat, not the front sight. That has to be trained out of a person.
If the engagement is beyond effective point-shooting range, and stress is causing me to tunnel on the threat, I'm stuck point-shooting rather than being able to aim. If the other guy is a killer or trained, then I'm fricked. Of course, most self-defense situations are close range.
This post was edited on 9/11/13 at 1:01 am
Posted on 9/11/13 at 1:05 am to bapple
quote:
I don't know if you can train it out of someone because we are all human and when the adrenaline kicks in, you won't be thinking, just reacting.
Law enforcement and the military consistently train tunnel vision out of people.
Posted on 9/11/13 at 6:37 am to olgoi khorkhoi
Pretty interesting... I bet that takes forever. I think about my tendencies to point-shoot and it's pretty crazy to think that can be trained out of me.
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