- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Tesla Cyber Truck or Rivian R1T
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:17 pm to fightin tigers
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:17 pm to fightin tigers
quote:My bad, I must have missed it.
I addressed this. You must gave missed it.
Virtially all of Tesla sales benefit from this. Ford or other manufactures aren't dependent on these in order to make ends meet.
Every single one of Tesla cars vs a small percentage of other manufacturers.
That being said, we're just going to ignore the tens of billions(probably more) that the big American automakers have received in bailouts? From the GM bailouts to tax breaks for bringing your factory to a given state, it's all the same, it's all subsidies. Tesla is wayyyyyyyy behind on dollar value of subsidies if you compare it to the big automakers I'd certainly bet.
Was it GM/Chrysler/Ford that got the $80billion bailout for failed companies? But no one gives them any shite whatsoever like we do Tesla, no?
1
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:21 pm to beerJeep
quote:
I think Elon is ahead of his time and has grand ideas, I just wish he would fund them privately.
Just out of curiosity do you consider grants for basic science research a government handout. Not comparing Tesla to NASA.. just wondering..
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:24 pm to Korkstand
quote:
I would argue that there are many more Ford/Chevy diehards than there are for Tesla, but ok
And while that is a valid point, it makes no sense in this discussion.
Agree with everything you posted in that middle part.
quote:
What wrong has he done so far? Honest question.
Attacks media for being impartial.
Stock manipulation and fraud.
Accusing the diver guy of being a pedo (then doubling down because he was fine with ruining the guy even if it cost him a few million)
Lies about drug use
Lies about safety issues
The weird school (but rich people are rich so it is just strange even though nothing is wrong with it)
Rewriting Tesla history
The whole Solar City scam
Probably a few other things I forgot. He is no doubt a dreamer and pulls some shite off, but the dude is sleazy and sketchy. Admittedly, to be successful it probably requires some balance, but there is plenty of reason to respect what he has accomplished while recognizing he has done lots wrong.
Doesn't even touch on that fraudulent hairline that he is passing off now.
This post was edited on 11/26/19 at 3:26 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:26 pm to shel311
quote:
That being said, we're just going to ignore the tens of billions(probably more) that the big American automakers have received in bailouts? From the GM bailouts to tax breaks for bringing your factory to a given state, it's all the same, it's all subsidies. Tesla is wayyyyyyyy behind on dollar value of subsidies if you compare it to the big automakers I'd certainly bet.
Won't ignore them at all. I don't think anyone talking about Ford or the other Big 3 last decade will pass them off either.
quote:
Was it GM/Chrysler/Ford that got the $80billion bailout for failed companies? But no one gives them any shite whatsoever like we do Tesla, no?
Um, yes they do. GM is not-so-affectionately known as government motors.
This post was edited on 11/26/19 at 3:28 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:28 pm to fightin tigers
quote:My point is no one ever does.
. I don't think anyone talking about Ford or the other Big 3 last decade
With Tesla, doesn't matter what the actual conversation is, some will always turn it to the subsidies.
That's my point, and my question is...why? I know you mentioned that Tesla is all electric so it is more vital to them, but it is not more vital than the bailouts the Big 3 got, so the question still stands as a fair question IMO.
This post was edited on 11/26/19 at 3:29 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:29 pm to shel311
quote:
That's my point, and my question is...why?
Because, for the most part, the Big 3 happened over a decade ago. For Tesla it is still a major part of why they even exist and is still ongoing.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:31 pm to Ramblin Wreck
Sold
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:31 pm to fightin tigers
quote:Fair enough.
Because, for the most part, the Big 3 happened over a decade ago. For Tesla it is still a major part of why they even exist and is still ongoing.
I disagree, I honestly think people just hate Tesla for mostly odd reasons and in many cases for no real reason at all. I think that drives it more than anything. Throw in the social media world we live in, and here we are, with people hating on an America company bringing lots of jobs to America "just cause."
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:32 pm to CarRamrod
quote:Sure, if we're not honest about it.
well special treatment could be defined many ways
quote:Special treatment for the industry, not for any particular company.
and in this case, subsidies is special treatment.
quote:This guy (who is he and why does he matter, btw?) goes on the say:
Tesla received $713 million in U.S. subsidies in Q3, compared to its $312 million profit.
quote:He clearly has no idea how business works, and particularly not Tesla's business.
Conclusion: In my view, without subsidies, there would be no Tesla.
Does he not think that, absent the credits, Tesla might price their vehicles differently? That they might slow down their massive investments in manufacturing, R&D, and charging infrastructure? That they might just in general behave differently given different market variables and do what has to be done in order to remain a going concern?
This is an extremely simplified and dumbed-down article meant to smear Tesla. It's propaganda.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:33 pm to shel311
Well yeah, welcome to Ford vs Chevy for the last 100 years.
Those two hate anything the other comes out with no matter how innovative. Don't get your feelings hurt because someone doesn't like your car.
Those two hate anything the other comes out with no matter how innovative. Don't get your feelings hurt because someone doesn't like your car.
This post was edited on 11/26/19 at 3:34 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:35 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Does he not think that, absent the credits, Tesla might price their vehicles differently?
Psst. I think that is the exact point.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:37 pm to fightin tigers
quote:Nah, I think he was pretty clearly insinuating Tesla would literally not exist, and not that Tesla would just be different from their current state now.
Psst. I think that is the exact point.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:40 pm to shel311
Losing 7k a sale would fundamentally change the company. Possibly into nonexistence.
It is a legitimate argument, I just find a ultimately futile one especially conidering the political leanings of this site. Giving subsidies is fine to promote an industry and usually supportes by fiscal conservatives.
It is a legitimate argument, I just find a ultimately futile one especially conidering the political leanings of this site. Giving subsidies is fine to promote an industry and usually supportes by fiscal conservatives.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:50 pm to fightin tigers
quote:Right, and we can agree to disagree, but I think the author clearly meant Tesla being nonexistent. But the author presented that as fact, when we don't know that that is fact. It would certainly fundamentally change the company but again, I don't think in any way, shape or form that was what the author meant there.
Losing 7k a sale would fundamentally change the company. Possibly into nonexistence.
But we've beat that one to a dead horse, so fair enough to move on.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:51 pm to shel311
I have a friend that constantly rails on the subsidization of Tesla. Then the next week he is railing on the changes to ITEP that push industry to TX.
To some of you that read the EV threads, I might sound like a broken record but I will encapsulate it again:
Like it or not EV production is the next big move in vehicles. Automotive production is a huge economic engine that supports tons of subsidiary manufacturers. As of now in large part to Tesla, the US still has a competitive edge in the market. If we aren't prudent in fostering this sector we will give the edge to China and the Europeans. If we sit back and play the go out and sink or swim game China will subsidize their way into controlling the market.
I never answered the OP but if I had to spend money on one or the other tomorrow it would be a Tesla. Rivian is a complete unknown at this point in many ways. While I prefer the looks of the Rivian it could be a complete disaster, in the case the devil you know is the smarter option with MY money.
To some of you that read the EV threads, I might sound like a broken record but I will encapsulate it again:
Like it or not EV production is the next big move in vehicles. Automotive production is a huge economic engine that supports tons of subsidiary manufacturers. As of now in large part to Tesla, the US still has a competitive edge in the market. If we aren't prudent in fostering this sector we will give the edge to China and the Europeans. If we sit back and play the go out and sink or swim game China will subsidize their way into controlling the market.
I never answered the OP but if I had to spend money on one or the other tomorrow it would be a Tesla. Rivian is a complete unknown at this point in many ways. While I prefer the looks of the Rivian it could be a complete disaster, in the case the devil you know is the smarter option with MY money.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:52 pm to Obtuse1
Wildcard; take the new Mustang E thing and cut off the back El Camino style.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:53 pm to fightin tigers
quote:My buddy hates it, I kinda like it.
Wildcard; take the new Mustang E thing and cut off the back El Camino style.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:54 pm to shel311
One of the few electric cars I actually like the aesthetics of.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:56 pm to Obtuse1
quote:Agreed here
I never answered the OP but if I had to spend money on one or the other tomorrow it would be a Tesla. Rivian is a complete unknown at this point in many ways. While I prefer the looks of the Rivian it could be a complete disaster, in the case the devil you know is the smarter option with MY money
I'd buy Rivian for sure, just not first generation. Let them prove they're sustainable with a great car, I don't even need a supercharging network and I'd grab one but that's many years down the road.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:56 pm to fightin tigers
quote:I like the Rivian SUV way more based on looks and the Model X a bit more but definitely think the Mach E looks good.
One of the few electric cars I actually like the aesthetics of.
Page 10 of 13
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News