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Message
re: Solve this OT
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:36 pm to PearlJam
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:36 pm to PearlJam
quote:
No. The outcome for G1 and G2 is the same.
The same in that they're both gold balls, but isn't it just as true to say that the outcome for G1, G2, and G3 are all the same in that they're all balls?
Arguing they're the same shows a fundamental misunderstanding of why the answer is 67%.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:36 pm to slackster
quote:Well that is the reality. You are pulling 1 remaining ball from a box, it only has 2 possible outcomes.
I'm actually quite impressed that someone who agrees the answer is 67% can be this steadfast about having only two possible outcomes for the next ball - gold or silver.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:38 pm to PearlJam
I retract my 50% answer.
It takes a big man to admit when he is wrong.
It takes a big man to admit when he is wrong.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:38 pm to PearlJam
quote:
remaining ball from a box, it only has 2 possible outcomes.
And 1 divided by 2 is.....
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:39 pm to PearlJam
quote:
Well that is the reality. You are pulling 1 remaining ball from a box, it only has 2 possible outcomes.
Under the parameters you're setting, that's true. You're saying it can only be gold or silver. That's accurate.
We're saying it will be one of THREE unknown balls (outcomes) that remain for each of the possible original choices.
Your explanation and refusal to acknowledge the three outcomes is the same logic people use to say you either chose box 1 or box 2, so he answer is 50%. The reality of the situation is that your gold ball was one of 3 possible choices. Those 3 choices each have a distinct resolution, and those resolutions are why the answer is 67%.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:39 pm to slackster
quote:You can't pull G1 or G2 with you second pick. Either 1 of them is in your hand and out of play or they are both in the box you didn't select.
G1, G2
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:39 pm to MorgusTheMagnificent
quote:
And 1 divided by 2 is.....
How many brains you have.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:39 pm to PearlJam
quote:
There is only 1 ball remaining.
The only way this scenario would be the case would be if the balls were in fixed locations.
Location 1 Box 1 Gold
Location 2 Box 1 Gold
Location 1 Box 2 Gold
Location 2 Box 2 Silver
If your first picked ball were from location 1 of either box and it were (as it had to be) gold, then you would be correct. There are only 2 options left in choosing location 2 of the same box. It's 50/50 either gold or silver.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:40 pm to PearlJam
quote:
Because it is 66.7% more likely you pulled a gold ball from a box with 2 gold balls than a box with 1 gold ball.
This is handwaving the statistics and regurgitating the answer.
Explain to me why.
Here I'll help... In the analogy you posted the probability is substantially different:
Your probability of picking the gold from the majority silver box is 1/51 = 1.96%
Given a random selection of gold, your probability of picking another gold from the same box is 98.04% (50/51).
This post was edited on 7/23/18 at 2:42 pm
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:40 pm to slackster
quote:
I'm actually quite impressed that someone who agrees the answer is 67% can be this steadfast about having only two possible outcomes for the next ball - gold or silver.
Once you have the first gold ball in hand, there are only 2 possible outcomes.
When you pick the next ball, it can only be:
1. the silver ball, or
2. the other gold ball
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:41 pm to slackster
I'm gonna agree with PearlJam's nuance.
You guys seem to put an emphasis in it being possibly a different ball. The emphasis should be on the fact that there were two of them in that box making it more likely to have come from that box.
You guys seem to put an emphasis in it being possibly a different ball. The emphasis should be on the fact that there were two of them in that box making it more likely to have come from that box.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:41 pm to castorinho
quote:Exactly
I'm gonna agree with PearlJam's nuance.
You guys seem to put an emphasis in it being possibly a different ball. The emphasis should be on the fact that there were two of them in that box making it more likely to have come from that box.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:43 pm to UpToPar
quote:
When you pick the next ball, it can only be:
1. the silver ball, or
2. one of the other two gold balls
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:44 pm to PearlJam
quote:
ou can't pull G1 or G2 with you second pick. Either 1 of them is in your hand and out of play or they are both in the box you didn't select.
Yes you can. The labels are how they go into the box, not what you assign to them after you've chosen one.
Go back to my human box analogy. Your first pick is a male. That means you either picked John, James, or Jack. If you picked John, the next pick is James. If you picked James, the next pick is John. If you picked Jack, the next pick is Jill. We don't know who you picked, just that he's a male. As a result, there are still 3 (three) possible people that will come out of the box. Two of them are male, one of them is female.
If you'd like to say there are two possible sexes that can come out of the box, that's also true.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:44 pm to castorinho
quote:
I'm gonna agree with PearlJam's nuance.
If you had a box with 3 gold balls, and another box with 1 gold ball and two silvers, what are the odds of pulling a second gold ball from the same box if your first pull resulted in gold.
Once you can answer that, you will understand why it is important to consider each ball individually.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:45 pm to PearlJam
I am trying to think of a way using combinations:
Eliminating the obvious now [S,S] and adding the fact you have successfully chosen a G ball, You are left 3 choose 1 combinations (3 comb) in two boxes: [G1,G2], [G3,S].
The combinations are:
G1,G2
G2,G1
G3,S
2 out of the 3 combinations (67%) grant you a successful outcome.
Eliminating the obvious now [S,S] and adding the fact you have successfully chosen a G ball, You are left 3 choose 1 combinations (3 comb) in two boxes: [G1,G2], [G3,S].
The combinations are:
G1,G2
G2,G1
G3,S
2 out of the 3 combinations (67%) grant you a successful outcome.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:45 pm to UpToPar
quote:
Once you have the first gold ball in hand, there are only 2 possible outcomes.
When you pick the next ball, it can only be:
1. the silver ball, or
2. the other gold ball
You're correct.
Once you have the gold ball in hand, the next ball is one of the 3 remaining balls we haven't seen. That's also correct.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:47 pm to castorinho
quote:
You guys seem to put an emphasis in it being possibly a different ball. The emphasis should be on the fact that there were two of them in that box making it more likely to have come from that box.
If you can agree that you picked one of 3 possible gold balls, I can't fathom how you can disagree with the fact that you have one of 3 possible outcomes.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:49 pm to PearlJam
quote:
The one in the box can only be gold or silver.
While that is true, the ball can only be gold or silver, it does not mean there is a 50%chance the ball you choose will be silver.
While the outcome will only be gold or silver, the odds of the gold outcome are 2/3.
This post was edited on 7/23/18 at 2:49 pm
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:49 pm to slackster
quote:Uhhh... It is either silver or gold. They aren't all in the same box and a gold ball has been eliminated. It's either the gold ball that was in the box with a silver ball or it is one of the 2 gold balls that were once together.
Once you have the gold ball in hand, the next ball is one of the 3 remaining balls we haven't seen.
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