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Started By
Message
re: Net Neutrality LIVE Vote • OFFICIAL RESULTS • Neutrality is Abolished
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:55 pm to Pilot Tiger
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:55 pm to Pilot Tiger
quote:
Let me just go pay to run my own lines so I can "compete" with the guy who had the local govt pay for 90% of the lines he owns
Free market though.
0
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:55 pm to c on z
quote:more freedom, less freedom doesn't matter. if dear leader says it, it's great
Trumpkins being fine with less freedom of the internet
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:55 pm to AbitaFan08
quote:
Close your eyes....
Imagine under this analogy, the baker would be selling vanilla cakes to everyone at whatever price they wanted for their vanilla cake. No problem there, right? Free market at work.
But when a customer says "hey, I think I want chocolate icing on my cake this time" the baker would say "oh well we're paid big money by the people who make vanilla icing, so it's going to be 3 months to get you a chocolate cake. but if you want a vanilla cake you can have it right now!"
So the customer (likely fat from eating so much cake) would say, "well then I'll go to the baker down the street!"
Now, MAYBE another baker has chocolate cake. But you signed a contract with the vanilla baker, so for a penalty fee you can finally go pay for a chocolate cake. But in a lot of cases, the vanilla conglomorate pays ALL the bakers, so having a chocolate cake is going to take 3 months no matter where you go.
...now imagine that the customer was straight.
First off, you are analogizing a bakery to the internet under no NN. I was creating an analogy between a bakery and an internet with NN. So, swing and a miss there.
Second, if there is a large demand for chocolate cakes, a new bakery will open up down the street and offer chocolate cakes. That's the free market at work.
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:55 pm to c on z
quote:
Trumpkins being fine with less freedom of the internet
It'll be a cold day in hell when more government regulation equals more freedom
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:56 pm to UpToPar
quote:
And for the record, I am not a fan of the repeal, but I'm not afraid to admit that I'm a hypocrite in that I support NN which is an example of big government and an opponent to the free market.
It is not hypocritical to recognize that one size does not fit all in economics.
If the ISP space was a highly competitive market with low barriers to entry and not an increasingly pivotal national resource that was heavily tax payer subsidized, sure, it might be hypocritical. But it is not that type of market in the vast majority of the country, where half of consumers have 1 or fewer definition high speed options for their home internet and the market is such that it is often a natural monopoly.
And I think the failure of people to recognize these sort of inner-market dynamics and understanding that one size does not fit all, is I think, a large stumbling block for why people are struggling to grasp both the issue itself and the harm the repeal does.
This post was edited on 12/14/17 at 1:58 pm
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:56 pm to stout
quote:
Exactly which comes full circle to what I have said this entire GD thread...get the Gov out of the internet.
IT'S
TOO
LATE
jesus Christ dude
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:56 pm to TH03
Maybe it’s semantics, but I think taking my ball and going home would be saying “frick it, I’m not doing the internet any more.”
I’m saying “oh well, I guess I can get my sport news and inane time-wasting bullshite from another source.
I’m saying “oh well, I guess I can get my sport news and inane time-wasting bullshite from another source.
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:57 pm to UpToPar
quote:
Explain how forcing a private company to provide a certain service is different then forcing a baker to bake a cake for a certain customer.
Because you have options. You can go to another bakery.
Imagine of there was only one baker in the state and he also owned the only farm in the state and the only trucking company.
And he made a deal with the neighboring states to not sell cakes or farm equipment or trucks in his market.
And he decided that you can now only have $50 delicious cake if you buy it from a company he sells cakes to. Sure, you can get other cakes from him, but the same delicious cake will cost you $400 from a different vendor or you can buy a half baked cake iced with shite, but hey it's still technically a cake.
So what do you do? Open up a rival bakery? Good luck. The state is paid by the bakery to keep competitors away. The other guy also owns the only farm and the only trucking company so you have to start a farm and a trucking comaony before you can even get to the bakery and you have to have the capital to get all of that off the ground and become competitive with the other bakery before you fall into bankruptcy.
So the government passes a law that says, OK bakery, you have to sell everyone the same cakes. You can charge more or less for quality of cake, but you can't discriminate based on what's written on the cake.
And the people in this thread say, frick that, repeal that law, and if you don't like it just wait for someone else to open a bakery, which, as discussed, is basically impossible.
This post was edited on 12/14/17 at 1:59 pm
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:57 pm to The Boat
quote:you know what
It'll be a cold day in hell when more government regulation equals more freedom
it's possible for there to be exceptions to rules sometimes
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:57 pm to UpToPar
quote:
So the problem isn't with NN. If what you are saying is true, then NN is a bandaid on a gun shot wound.
Basically, but instead of trying to stop the bleeding before removing the band-aid, this repeal rips off the band-aid so a big stick can be shoved in the hole.
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:58 pm to 50_Tiger
quote:
Small Cells don't need land permits.
Didn't know this. That brings the barrier for entry way down. Probably how the locally owned WISP in Lake Charles I mentioned earlier was able to enter the market.
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:58 pm to Pilot Tiger
quote:
but we repealed NN so now Joe at City Hall has to give permits to everyone right?
So, the issue lies with a corrupt government, right?
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:59 pm to 50_Tiger
quote:
Small Cells don't need land permits.
They need ROW permits.
Posted on 12/14/17 at 1:59 pm to Pilot Tiger
quote:
IT'S
TOO
LATE
Agree to disagree
Posted on 12/14/17 at 2:00 pm to TH03
quote:
The main barrier. You can't do shite without a permit.
You're saying that PERMITS are the main barrier to running fiber optic cables to every physical structure in a region?
PERMITS?.......
PERMITS are what's stopping them you say?
Not the IMMENSE GOD DAMN AMOUNT OF MONEY IT WOULD COST?
Posted on 12/14/17 at 2:00 pm to stout
quote:
Didn't know this. That brings the barrier for entry way down. Probably how the locally owned WISP in Lake Charles I mentioned earlier was able to enter the market.
Macro sites are on the decline specifically because of cost/procurement/etc.
Small cells can operate on certain bands that are popular 2/4/25/66. They can be hung from lamp posts and consume less than 5W of power. Actually less than that.
This post was edited on 12/14/17 at 2:01 pm
Posted on 12/14/17 at 2:00 pm to stout
Hold on, Stout. I'm going to go read Reddit for 15 minutes and come back and really boom you.
Posted on 12/14/17 at 2:01 pm to HogX
quote:Lol that is so gay.
Expect us.
Posted on 12/14/17 at 2:01 pm to Breesus
quote:
So what do you do? Open up a rival bakery? Good luck. The state is paid by the bakery to keep competitors away. The other guy also owns the only farm and the only trucking company so you have to start a farm and a trucking comaony before you can even get to the bakery and you have to have the capital to get all of that off the ground and become competitive with the other bakery before you fall into bankruptcy.
I'm starting to see a pattern here. It seems as though most are arguing that government regulation through net neutrality is needed to protect the consumer from government corruption. Do you not see the irony here?
Posted on 12/14/17 at 2:01 pm to Tigeralum2008
quote:
You're saying that PERMITS are the main barrier to running fiber optic cables to every physical structure in a region?
PERMITS?.......
PERMITS are what's stopping them you say?
Not the IMMENSE GOD DAMN AMOUNT OF MONEY IT WOULD COST?
I guess Google doesn't have any money.
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