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Started By
Message
re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 12/5/24 at 6:20 pm to GOP_Tiger
Posted on 12/5/24 at 6:20 pm to GOP_Tiger
People learned the wrong lessons from Iraq and Afghanistan. The problem wasn't that we got involved; The problem was that we naively believed that we could turn those places into democratic paradises.
In both cases, if we had simply won and quickly installed a friendly warlord, both those countries and the United States would have been much better off.
The problem with "forever wars" was the "forever" part, not with the "war" part. We won both Iraq and Afghanistan and then lost them in the utopian idealism of trying to build democracies in places that lacked the societal norms necessary to sustain democracy.
In both cases, if we had simply won and quickly installed a friendly warlord, both those countries and the United States would have been much better off.
The problem with "forever wars" was the "forever" part, not with the "war" part. We won both Iraq and Afghanistan and then lost them in the utopian idealism of trying to build democracies in places that lacked the societal norms necessary to sustain democracy.
3
Posted on 12/5/24 at 7:02 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
The problem wasn't that we got involved
Invading a country based on a total lie “not a problem”.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 7:32 pm to texag7
HTS reported to be halfway to Homs
Illia Ponomarenko
?@ioponomarenko.bsky.social?
If Syrian rebels proceed to take Homs and isolate Russian naval and air bases and cut Damascus off from the sea, it will be TAAAAAAAASTYYYYYYYY.
Illia Ponomarenko
?@ioponomarenko.bsky.social?
If Syrian rebels proceed to take Homs and isolate Russian naval and air bases and cut Damascus off from the sea, it will be TAAAAAAAASTYYYYYYYY.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 8:11 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
If McCain has been listened to, Assad would have been toppled years ago, and we would have a friendly (or at least neutral) government in Damascus.
Did that apply to Gaddafi in Libya also?
What about Saddam in Iraq?
How about the Taliban in Afghanistan?
How did those work out?
Friendly/neutral governments exist there?
Posted on 12/5/24 at 8:13 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
In both cases, if we had simply won and quickly installed a friendly warlord, both those countries and the United States would have been much better off.
Sadaam was the friendly warlord
The Taliban had defeated our friendly warlords.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 8:14 pm to CitizenK
You’re not an honest person
Posted on 12/5/24 at 8:29 pm to AU86
quote:
Did that apply to Gaddafi in Libya also?
For American interests, we are likely better off with the current mess in Libya than we were with an anti-American dictator there supporting terrorism against the United States.
quote:
What about Saddam in Iraq?
How about the Taliban in Afghanistan?
You didn't read my follow-up post, obviously.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 8:33 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
Sadaam was the friendly warlord
The guy who had literally just attempted to assassinate George H.W. Bush?
Sometimes, I think that you are like SirWinston and just running a clown account for kicks.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 9:00 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
Sadaam was the friendly warlord
When Sadaam invaded Kuwait, we had to straighten him out.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 9:18 pm to doubleb
quote:
When Sadaam invaded Kuwait, we had to straighten him out.
How long did it take before he was actually straightened out on the end of a rope?
Posted on 12/5/24 at 9:19 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
Sadaam was the friendly warlord
Jesus.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 9:24 pm to texag7
quote:
Invading a country based on a total lie “not a problem”.
we're in agreement.
I opposed even invading Afghanistan... it seemed like we were walking right into the trap Al Qaeda was trying to lure us into, and it didn't work out in their favor as much as they thought... so lucky for them we invaded Iraq to completely screw the pooch.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 9:26 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
Sadaam was the friendly warlord
The Taliban had defeated our friendly warlords.
Correct on both.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 9:28 pm to doubleb
quote:
Sadaam was the friendly warlord
When Sadaam invaded Kuwait, we had to straighten him out.
Saddam had been the friendly warlord...
He launched a proxy war on Iran for us...
Then he got pissed when he found out we were secretly arming the Iranian side, too...
and in his nihilistic shitfit after that he just decided to grab Kuwait, and maybe Saudi Arabia, because why not, everybody is full of shite!
Posted on 12/5/24 at 9:36 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
The guy who had literally just attempted to assassinate George H.W. Bush?
My point is that he was the friendly warlord
States have their own interests
Posted on 12/5/24 at 10:27 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
For American interests, we are likely better off with the current mess in Libya than we were with an anti-American dictator there supporting terrorism against the United States.
Libya wasn’t a threat.
And the war was idiotic. The country slave markets now, and it’s become a highway for mass migration to Europe.
Posted on 12/5/24 at 10:33 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
For American interests, we are likely better off with the current mess in Libya than we were with an anti-American dictator there supporting terrorism against the United States.
You really are a fool
Posted on 12/5/24 at 11:50 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
You’re not an honest person
In your Putin wet dreams maybe, but I am quite honest.
Maybe you should try being honest with yourself first, because you obviously aren't.
Posted on 12/6/24 at 12:22 am to CitizenK
ISW Update Dec 5
quote:
Key Takeaways:
The Kremlin is continuing to suffer significant manpower losses to make tactical advances in western Donetsk Oblast at the expense of Russia's ongoing war effort and the medium-term viability of the Russian economy.
Russia's constrained labor pool is likely unable to sustain this increased casualty rate in the medium-term, and continued Western military support for Ukraine remains vital to Ukraine's ability to inflict losses at this rate.
Russian Chief of the General Staff Army General Valery Gerasimov undermined the Kremlin's information operation to portray Russia's November 21 Oreshnik ballistic missile strike against Ukraine as a defensive response to the US permitting Ukraine to conduct strikes in Russia with US-provided ATACMS missiles.
Russian-North Korean military cooperation will likely continue to intensify in the coming months following the formal commencement of their comprehensive strategic partnership agreement on December 4.
Chechen Republic Head Ramzan Kadyrov continues to publicly position himself as a defender of migrants and Russian ethnic minorities in opposition to other senior Russian security officials, suggesting that senior Russian officials may be increasingly divided over Russian President Vladimir Putin's efforts to promote an inclusive Russian civic nationalism that ensures interethnic and interreligious harmony in Russia.
Ukrainian forces recently advanced in Kursk and northern Kharkiv oblasts, and Russian forces advanced in the Toretsk, Kurakhove, and Vuhledar directions.
Russian forces are reportedly increasingly recruiting women for combat and logistics functions.
Posted on 12/6/24 at 3:55 am to StormyMcMan
Russia's fall offensive cost more than 50 soldiers per square kilometer, ISW says
by Tim Zadorozhnyy December 6, 2024 10:54 AM
Russian troops suffered approximately 53 casualties per square kilometer as they advanced through Ukrainian territory in fall 2024, the Institute for the Study of War (ISW) reported on Dec. 5.
During September, October, and November 2024, Russian forces captured approximately 2,356 square kilometers of territory, including parts of Ukraine and the Kursk Oblast, at the cost of an estimated 125,800 personnel, the report said.
The Kyiv Independent
by Tim Zadorozhnyy December 6, 2024 10:54 AM
Russian troops suffered approximately 53 casualties per square kilometer as they advanced through Ukrainian territory in fall 2024, the Institute for the Study of War (ISW) reported on Dec. 5.
During September, October, and November 2024, Russian forces captured approximately 2,356 square kilometers of territory, including parts of Ukraine and the Kursk Oblast, at the cost of an estimated 125,800 personnel, the report said.
The Kyiv Independent
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