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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:12 pm to
Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8182 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:12 pm to
https://twitter.com/JackDetsch/status/1577020172925227009
quote:

NEW: U.S. has not seen a large-scale movement of Russian forces despite battlefield losses to Ukraine in the east and south of the country: senior U.S. military official


Russia is spent
This post was edited on 10/3/22 at 4:13 pm
Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8182 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:16 pm to
Report of a Russian counter attack on Kupyansk area.

https://medium.com/@x_TomCooper_x/ukraine-war-24-sep-3-oct-2022-russian-counterattack-on-kupyansk-c3d5c9a0fcdf
quote:

Around 20–21 September, what I — lacking info on exact designations — call the ‘Kupyansk Group ZSU’ (3rd Tank, 14th and 92nd Mech, Kraken Regiment, perhaps the Donbas Battalion, and few other units), completed mopping up eastern Kupyansk and then advanced further east and south, into Petropavlivka, Kurylivka, and Kivsharivka.

The Russians initially offered relatively light resistance, but: meanwhile, they have rushed the 3rd Motor Rifle Division — rebuilt with help of mobilised reservists without any training — and few other units from Belgorod, and then attacked, apparently, from east towards west. From the area around Arapivka, Volodymyrivka, and Kuzemivka, without any feints, without any diversions, with plentiful of air support and artillery support (that, however, was poorly directed) — straight over that empty area towards west.

Obviously, Ukrainians detected them early, brought their units in position, and brought in their artillery to bear.

Apparently, the first to go was the T-90s-equipped 27th Guards Motor Rifle Brigade. It attacked Kurylivka on 24 September, and lost a number of T-90s knocked out or abandoned in the process (even days later, Ukrainians were still collecting pieces of that unit around the battlefield). The next was a BTG of the 237th Tank Regiment, equipped with T-80s and BMP-2s taken out of storage. This attacked Petropavlivka and was completely smashed, sometimes on Sunday and/or Monday, 25–26 September. Think, somebody counted some 10–11 T-80s, a similar number of BMPs and MT-LBs, and about 40 other vehicles on just one video shown that battlefield on the ‘next morning’, but can’t find that link any more. Considering a Motor Rifle BTG can be expected to have a company of 10–11 MBTs, two or three companies of IFVs (like BMPs), and then similar-sized artillery support: as said, more or less an entire BTG was smashed there.


This post was edited on 10/3/22 at 4:17 pm
Posted by pirate75
Member since Jan 2011
861 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:20 pm to
Look again. He wasn't fapping....ol boy was catching a header from another ruskie.
Posted by joemuggs
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2007
617 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:23 pm to
This is a bold thread 2 weeks ago i would have said impossible, but today it seems, maybe overly optimistic, but certainly not impossible.

https://twitter.com/ThreshedThought/status/1577033853180387328


quote:

Dr Mike Martin ??
@ThreshedThought
Ok. Here is how the war ends, I think.
Posted by Darth_Vader
A galaxy far, far away
Member since Dec 2011
73969 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:24 pm to
quote:

The Russians initially offered relatively light resistance, but: meanwhile, they have rushed the 3rd Motor Rifle Division — rebuilt with help of mobilised reservists without any training — and few other units from Belgorod, and then attacked, apparently, from east towards west. From the area around Arapivka, Volodymyrivka, and Kuzemivka, without any feints, without any diversions, with plentiful of air support and artillery support (that, however, was poorly directed) — straight over that empty area towards west.

Obviously, Ukrainians detected them early, brought their units in position, and brought in their artillery to bear.

Apparently, the first to go was the T-90s-equipped 27th Guards Motor Rifle Brigade. It attacked Kurylivka on 24 September, and lost a number of T-90s knocked out or abandoned in the process (even days later, Ukrainians were still collecting pieces of that unit around the battlefield). The next was a BTG of the 237th Tank Regiment, equipped with T-80s and BMP-2s taken out of storage. This attacked Petropavlivka and was completely smashed, sometimes on Sunday and/or Monday, 25–26 September. Think, somebody counted some 10–11 T-80s, a similar number of BMPs and MT-LBs, and about 40 other vehicles on just one video shown that battlefield on the ‘next morning’, but can’t find that link any more. Considering a Motor Rifle BTG can be expected to have a company of 10–11 MBTs, two or three companies of IFVs (like BMPs), and then similar-sized artillery support: as said, more or less an entire BTG was smashed there.


Change the vehicles nomenclatures to things like T-34 and SU-76, and that account could have been written by a Wehrmacht Panzergrenadier during WWII.

Take out references to vehicles and that account could have been written by a German Landser during WWI or a Japanese soldier a decade earlier during the Russo-Japanese war.

Not much has changed with the Russian army in the past 100 plus years.
Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8182 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:28 pm to
I was just looking over the maps from the Battle of Kursk while I contemplated the similarities to today's war. For those who don't know, the areas around Belogord (very close to Ukraine) were the battleground for one of the largest battles in WW2. Russia suffered hundreds of thousands of casualties to defeat the Germans at Kursk.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kursk

War never changes
This post was edited on 10/3/22 at 4:30 pm
Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8182 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:31 pm to
If you want a healthy dose of Russian Optimism, follow this guy.

https://substack.com/profile/102984907-big-serge
https://twitter.com/witte_sergei

These quotes are from this article: https://bigserge.substack.com/p/the-war-has-just-begun?utm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2
quote:

Ukraine spent the summer sending its 2nd tier conscripts to the front in the Donbas as it lovingly collected NATO-donated weapons and trained units in the rear. With generous NATO help, Ukraine was able to accumulate forces for two full scale offensives - one in Kherson (which failed spectacularly) and one in Kharkov (which succeeded in pushing past the Russian screening force and reaching the Oskil). Much of that carefully accumulated fighting power is now gone or degraded. Rumors circulated of a third offensive towards Melitipol, but Ukraine does not seem to have the combat power to achieve this, and strong Russian forces are in the region behind prepared defensive lines.

On the whole, therefore, Ukraine’s window for offensive operations has closed, and what remains is closing quickly. The last zone of intense Ukrainian operations is around Lyman, where aggressive Ukrainian attacks have so far failed to either storm or encircle the town. It is still possible that they take Lyman and consolidate control of Kupyansk, but this would likely represent the culmination of Ukrainian offensive capability. For now, the area around Lyman is a killing zone that exposes attacking Ukrainian troops to Russian air and ground fires.

The large scale view of force ratios is as follows:

Ukraine has spent much of the combat power that they accumulated with NATO help during the summer, and will have an urgent need to reduce combat intensity for refitting and rearming at precisely the same time that Russian combat power in the theater begins to surge.

Simultaneously, NATO’s ability to arm Ukraine is on the verge of exhaustion. Let’s look at this more closely.


quote:

Anyone who expects the war to slow down during the winter is in for a surprise. Russia is going to launch a late autumn/winter offensive and achieve significant gains. The arc of force generation (both Russia’s increasing force accumulation and Ukraine’s degradation) coincide with the approach of cold weather.

Let’s make a brief note about combat in the cold. Russia is perfectly capable of waging effective operations in the snow. Going back to World War Two, the Red Army was more than capable of offensive success during the winter, starting in 1941 with the general counteroffensive at Moscow, again in 1942 with the destruction of the German 6th Army at Stalingrad, and in 1943-44 with two successful large scale offensives beginning in the winter. Now, of course World War Two is not directly applicable in all ways, but we can establish that from a technical standpoint there is a clearly established capability to wage operations in cold weather.


quote:

As for where Russia will choose to commit its newly generated forces, there are four realistic possibilities, which I will enumerate in no particular order:

Reopening the Northern Front with an operation around Kharkov. The attractiveness of this option is clear. A Russian move in force towards Kharkov would immediately collapse all of Ukraine’s gains towards the Oskil by compromising their rear areas.

An offensive on Nikolayev out of the Kherson region. This would move further towards the goal of a landlocked Ukraine, and would take advantage of the fact that Ukrainian forces in this region are badly chewed up after their own failed offensive.

Massive commitment to the Donbas to finish the liberation of DNR territory by capturing Slovyansk and Kramatorsk. This is less likely, as Russia has demonstrated comfort with the slow tempo of operations on this front.

A push north from the Melitopol area towards Zaparozhia. This would safeguard the nuclear powerplant and end any credible threats to the land bridge to Crimea.

Other possibilities I regard as unlikely. A second advance on Kiev would make little operational sense, as it would not support any of the existing fronts. I would expect action around Kiev only if the new force generation is significantly larger than the headline number of 300,000. Otherwise, Russia’s winter offensives are likely to be concentrated on mutually supporting fronts. I think some movement to reopen the northern is likely, as it would completely compromise Ukraine’s gains in the Izyum-Kupyansk direction. There are rumors that forces are being moved into Belarus, but I actually think the Chernigov-Sumy axis would be more likely than a new Kiev operation, as it could be supportive of an offensive on Kharkov.
This post was edited on 10/3/22 at 4:37 pm
Posted by ned nederlander
Member since Dec 2012
5988 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:36 pm to
quote:

I actually like Musk, but this is where his shortcomings on human emotion get a bit superseded by his logic. Surely he doesn’t think the Russians are winning presently, so I guess he’s putting a high likelihood on Russia using nukes and the potential for full on nuclear war. If I’m not mistaken he’s previous said it is a concern of his partially driving his mars goal.


I think the Musk proposal largely equates to a near full surrender by Ukraine and would achieve a temporary pause before another invasion, but I also hope Ukraine doesn’t attempt to retake Crimea by force.

As painful as it is to say, that pushes the prospect of nuclear war to close to reality for me.

I think this ends by trading formal recognition of Crimea to Russia for withdrawal of Russia from the Donbas, and some level of reparations and return of any and all deported peoples.

I don’t think Ukraine joins NATO but there may be some timeframe during which NATO will treat an invasion of Ukraine by Russia as an article 5 event.

Or perhaps some trigger where Ukraine will automatically be admitted to NATO if certain events happen or Russia fails to comply with certain conditions of the ceasefire.

Who knows. It is just really hard to see how this ends absent a Russian regime change and that seems to me the most far fetched outcome.
Posted by jfan244888
Soda City, SC
Member since Jul 2021
1165 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:37 pm to
I'm thinking Ukraine launches an attack at the center to Melitopol now no? Russia trying to defend there, Kherson and the east will need to make some hard decisions.

Russia can certainly issue "fight to the death" orders everywhere, but they can't do that forever.

Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8182 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:38 pm to
I've been thinking about the Russian nuke threat. I don't think Russia will use them until Ukraine starts taking back the DPR/LPR lands. I suspect that is Russia's real redline.
Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8182 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:39 pm to
Agreed, the timing is right for a hard punch into the Melitopol/Mariupol directions.
Posted by Kentucker
Rabbit Hash, KY
Member since Apr 2013
20055 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:41 pm to
quote:

What's the world coming to when you can't fap in your foxhole without someone trying to drop a grenade on your head.


No, that’s definitely a blowjob going on.

The horror!

Putin will have both of them put directly on the front line.

Oh, wait…
Posted by CitizenK
BR
Member since Aug 2019
16095 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:43 pm to
That counterattack was destined to stall and leave an all but clear road for Ukr to advance.
Posted by Darth_Vader
A galaxy far, far away
Member since Dec 2011
73969 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:44 pm to
quote:

I was just looking over the maps from the Battle of Kursk while I contemplated the similarities to today's war. For those who don't know, the areas around Belogord (very close to Ukraine) were the battleground for one of the largest battles in WW2. Russia suffered hundreds of thousands of casualties to defeat the Germans at Kursk. LINK

War never changes


The Russians have long been known for a number of seemingly contradictory characteristics when it comes to war fighting:

1. They are far more willing to take horrendous losses on a scale most Western countries cannot fathom.

2. They tend to do well on the defensive but struggle to carry out anything more than the most simplistic offensive operations.

3. Their offensives tend to rely on sheer weight of shells (they LOVE artillery) and throwing masses of bodies at the enemy until the enemy is finally exhausted. (See point #1)

4. The only thing the Russians understand less than complex, combined-arms maneuver offensive operations, is logistics. And if you told the the former relies on the later, they’d look at you like you’ve lost your mind.

5. Their weapons systems tend to be crude but reliable. This is true for everything from their rifles up to their tanks. To quote Stalin, “quantity has a quality all its own”. He didn’t come up with this idea. It was already well engrained in Russia ling before he was born.
This post was edited on 10/3/22 at 4:52 pm
Posted by cypher
Member since Sep 2014
5722 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:50 pm to
WASHINGTON (AP) — The U.S. will soon deliver to Ukraine four more of the advanced rocket systems credited with helping the country’s military gain momentum in its war with Russia.

The High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems, known as HIMARS, will be part of a new $625 million package of aid expected to be announced on Tuesday, according to U.S. officials.

The decision marks the first time the U.S. has sent more HIMARS to Ukraine since late July, and it will bring the total number delivered so far to 20. The systems have become a key tool in Ukraine’s ability to strike bridges that Russia has used to supply its troops, enabling Ukrainian forces to make inroads in Russia-controlled regions.

The U.S. in recent weeks also provided funding through a separate program — the Ukraine Security Assistance Initiative — so another 18 HIMARS can be purchased through longer-term contracts. USAI funds are being used as part of the effort by the U.S. and Western allies to ensure Ukraine's forces are trained and equipped to defend their country in the years to come. But those contracts will take several years to fulfill.
Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8182 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:52 pm to
quote:

5. Their weapons systems tend to be crude but reliable. This is true for everything from their rifles up to their tanks. To quote Stalin, “quantity has a quality all its own”. He didn’t come up with this idea. It was already well engrained in Russia ling before he was born.


The problem with this line of thinking (not yours) is that it leaves the Russians stuck with technologically inferior weapons vs their opponent. In WW2 there wasn't as large of a technology gap as there is today. Combine that with a lack of the ONE thing Russia had going for it in WW2 (Manpower) then the Quantity vs Quality argument is moot. Russia doesn't have the quantity or the quality in Ukraine.
This post was edited on 10/3/22 at 4:54 pm
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
42747 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:55 pm to
He says NATO (western allies) are helping Ukrsine and he is correct.
He brings up tremendous Russian victories in WWII to wave the flag, but he forgot to mention that those great WWII victories were enabled by guess what? Tremendous help from the West.

Posted by lowspark12
nashville, tn
Member since Aug 2009
22596 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:56 pm to
Question is how much of that line of thinking/doctrine works in modern war?… can you win today with a large conscripted army and technological parody (or maybe even disparity)?

We’re about to find out in a few months.
Posted by jfan244888
Soda City, SC
Member since Jul 2021
1165 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:57 pm to
To that point In utterly shocked the Russians don't have things like night scopes. Its like they never innovated after 1945.
This post was edited on 10/3/22 at 4:58 pm
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
37816 posts
Posted on 10/3/22 at 4:57 pm to
quote:

He brings up tremendous Russian victories in WWII to wave the flag, but he forgot to mention that those great WWII victories were enabled by guess what? Tremendous help from the West.

Yep. We provided an otherworldly amount of materiel, ammo, and supplies to the Soviets.

I’ve forgotten the numbers now but I believe we sent them more vehicles than we ourselves actually used for our own troops in the European theater.
This post was edited on 10/3/22 at 4:58 pm
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