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Posted on 11/13/24 at 7:44 am to Lou
How did fish develop a taste for worms?
Posted on 11/13/24 at 7:53 am to Lou
quote:
4.13: Sexual reproduction could not have come about through evolution. Howard Hershey has the following to say about the evolution of sex (he warns that he is stating all of this from memory, but believes it is a simple task to check his statements in any genetics or developmental biology textbook): Recombination (a key element of meiosis that differs from mitosis significantly enough to warrant new activities) also occurs in bacteria (which don't have sex as we eucaryotes know it). The bacterial enzymes involved are called the RecA, RecB enzymes. These are enzymes that are also involved in DNA repair. he RecA enzyme in particular is involved in repair of UV damage. Almost any molecular biology or genetics book will talk about the Rec system. Recombination in eucaryotes is very similar but the enzymes are not as well studied. But topoisomerases (enzymes that break and reseal DNA) are clearly involved and these enzymes have a long evolutionary history. But the key thing to remember is that sex (in the biological sense) is simply the passage from the diploid (2N) state to the haploid (1N) state and back again by fusion. Undoubtedly what these creationists mean is "How can we create two sexes that are so different from one another?" An interesting question when posed by a three-year old but one that ignores the fact that some creatures have an even more dramatic differentiation between the sexes than humans do and some have much less. The passage of the sexual cycle does NOT require two highly differentiated sexes producing specialized gamete cells. Yeast, for example, are sexual animals just as much as humans and it is hard to distinguish haploid cells from diploid and the difference between the mating types (when the haploid gametic cells are visually indistinguishable from each other they are called mating types; when one is differentiated to hold most of the cytoplasm it is an egg and the other less endowed cell is a sperm with males being sperm carriers and females being egg carriers). There [are] all kinds of variations in nature between the yeast and mammals (although fish carry sexual dimorphism to an extreme unseen in mammals). Even within humans, sex is not a case of being different from the moment of conception. The early human embryo (XY male or XX female) is sexually dimorphic (has both embryonic male and female parts). Normally a single gene (on the Y) sets in motion a cascade of events that leads to the emphasis of the male internal parts (Wolfian ducts) and degeneration of the female parts (Mullerian tract). Absent that gene, the male parts degenerate and a female develops. Most of what we call male and female traits are purely hormonally caused and depending on the hormonal environment you can get interesting events. I have a lovely picture of a busty young woman who is XY (she has a defect that makes her cells unable to respond to androgens). Internally, she is sterile because the genes that determine the degradation of the Mullerian tract are different. She also has no pubic hair (because that requires a cellular response to androgens). There are also XX individuals with various levels of penis and (empty) scrotum formation because of in utero exposure to androgens (the mothers had a tumor or took certain steroidal drugs). The external genitalia equivalents are very simple scrotum = labia and penis = clitoris. There are all kinds of intermediate situations since this is a question of different differentiation of organs rather than de novo creation of different organs. All this (and much more) can be found in most textbooks of development or genetics. But, amazingly, most creationists seem completely ignorant of these basic facts and somehow think that male and female were created separately. (Hershey, 1996)
All the answers you seek can be found here… Mark I. Vuletic - Frequently encountered criticisms in evolution vs. creationism
Posted on 11/13/24 at 7:55 am to Tangineck
quote:
It's a copy of a copy of a copy, and those that reproduce/survive most are copied the most.
With this line of thinking it would seem like there would be less and less genetic diversity over time, which would create organisms less able to adapt over time, which would increase the odds of extinction in the event of environmental changes.
Posted on 11/13/24 at 8:05 am to TigrrrDad
quote:
Howard Hershey has the following to say about the evolution of sex
I bet Howard Hershey was really stoned when he wrote all that.
Posted on 11/13/24 at 8:06 am to cssamerican
quote:
With this line of thinking it would seem like there would be less and less genetic diversity over time, which would create organisms less able to adapt over time, which would increase the odds of extinction in the event of environmental changes.
There are a whole lot of species that are extinct. Way more than what still exist.
Posted on 11/13/24 at 7:52 pm to MintBerry Crunch
quote:
Noah also lived to be 900, right?
No. 950
Posted on 11/13/24 at 8:02 pm to AlxTgr
quote:
This question makes no sense.
It’s a chicken or the egg scenario.
There’s no chicken without an egg but a chicken has to make the egg
Posted on 11/13/24 at 9:03 pm to Lou
It helps to recognize the parents of the first bird were not actually a bird.
Posted on 11/13/24 at 9:06 pm to Lou
Where did the egg come from if there wasn’t a momma?
Posted on 11/13/24 at 9:43 pm to TigrrrDad
quote:
All the answers you seek can be found here… Mark I. Vuletic - Frequently encountered criticisms in evolution vs. creationism
If Hershey is so smart, how come he doesn't know what a paragraph is?
quote:
Most of what we call male and female traits are purely hormonally caused and depending on the hormonal environment you can get interesting events
And in all seriousness, it is shite like this that gives the mentally deranged trans crowd a platform. Not the science itself, but the fact he is associating extremely rare instances of a mutation with normalcy.
Posted on 11/13/24 at 9:45 pm to Lou
quote:
I understand evolution when it comes to species progression
Apparently not.
It’s not like one day a dinosaur laid a bird egg
Posted on 11/13/24 at 9:47 pm to Lou
quote:
Shorthand = Which came first, the mama bear or the baby bear? And when did Papa bear make his appearance?
Here's a better question: How does the Brown-headed Cowbird know how to be a Brown-headed Cowbird? They are nest parasites. They lay one egg in the nest of another bird species and leave it for the other mother bird to brood and raise. They are usually much bigger than their target species, even as babies. They are not raised by or with other Brown-headed Cowbirds, but they wind up being one and joing back up with their species after they are fully fledged.
Nature vs Nurture, indeed.
Posted on 11/13/24 at 9:47 pm to Lou
quote:
How did the first baby bird survive without their mama to feed it?

Posted on 11/13/24 at 9:55 pm to LegendInMyMind
this is an old, but funny blog post about brown headed cowbirds...my favorite part is the photo of one of them captioned "hi, i am an a-hole!"
LINK

LINK
Posted on 11/13/24 at 10:00 pm to Tangineck
quote:
There was no "first" baby bird. In evolutionary theory, from generation to generation there is no discernable difference., i.e. the differences are so subtle that you can't tell when changes happen. Only over extremely long periods of time can you compare the organism to what it used to be. It's a copy of a copy of a copy, and those that reproduce/survive most are copied the most.
Where has this been observed in the fossil record?
Posted on 11/13/24 at 10:00 pm to Tangineck
quote:
There was no "first" baby bird. In evolutionary theory, from generation to generation there is no discernable difference., i.e. the differences are so subtle that you can't tell when changes happen. Only over extremely long periods of time can you compare the organism to what it used to be. It's a copy of a copy of a copy, and those that reproduce/survive most are copied the most.
We've actually observed evolution kicked into overdrive in some species. Some by environment pressures, others in adaptation to a completely new environment. Peppered Moths changed their colorations/patterns along with industrialisation and the pollution that came with it. When that pollution decreased they quickly reverted to their original colorations. That was tied back to the air polution and particulates changing the color of the trees they often frequented. Their lighter color against a much darker background made them much easier for predators to spot.
The invasive Cane Toads in Australia have rapidly evolved to grow longer legs under pressure from the hot, dry desert environments that they've encountered in their conquest of their new continent. The longer legs help them cover more ground in an environment not exactly suitable for them to thrive. The shorter legged specimens seem to fare poorly and eventually die off.
It is kind of amazing to read about.
This post was edited on 11/13/24 at 10:04 pm
Posted on 11/13/24 at 10:05 pm to pussywillows
quote:
this is an old, but funny blog post about brown headed cowbirds...my favorite part is the photo of one of them captioned "hi, i am an a-hole!"
They are assholes, for sure, but at least they're native assholes. I'll check that out.
Posted on 11/13/24 at 11:27 pm to FoTownBam
quote:
The Bible goes into great detail in explaining how the first humans were created. I imagine most animals were created the same way
LOL
Posted on 11/14/24 at 7:59 am to Lou
I thought there was going to be a punchline
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