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House denies colleges tuition-setting authority (again).
Posted on 5/20/15 at 7:45 am
Posted on 5/20/15 at 7:45 am
I really hate politicians. They act like they are doing a favor for "students and families," but what they are really doing is clinging to a power they should not possess in the first place.
https://theadvocate.com/news/legislature/12418778-123/louisiana-house-refuses-to-give
https://theadvocate.com/news/legislature/12418778-123/louisiana-house-refuses-to-give
Posted on 5/20/15 at 7:53 am to Slippy
To be fair.. TOPS has tied their hands in these regards considering they are paying the bill for a pretty large amount of students. Sure, for some it's about pure power but for many, they see the consequences of an immediate rise in tuition that would take place.. The lsu system should be advocating for a constitutional amendment changing the way cuts are forced in lean times
Posted on 5/20/15 at 7:57 am to Slippy
Agreed... This would at least help weed out the institutions that should probably get closed down. I guess the politicians friends are making too much at Suno/grambling and the like for this to receive serious consideration. I wish jindal would use his executive power to close down these shitholes and do some actual good.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:02 am to TJG210
quote:
I wish jindal would use his executive power to close down these shitholes and do some actual good.
He would likely get crucified for being "anti higher education". Do you not remember how fired up people got when they went to merge UNO and SUNO? Think what would happen if you started messing the SELU, Nicholls, ULM type schools that are all what I would consider a step above UNO and SUNO.
I agree with the statement about TOPS. Unless they re-structure how TOPS is actually awarded, they can't give the power to state schools. If they did, LSU could make tuition $20k and the state would have to pay that bill.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:13 am to KG6
quote:
re-structure how TOPS is actually awarded,
Make it a loan that is forgiven upon graduation. You get a degree, you do not have to pay it back. There can be exceptions for medical issues.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:18 am to TJG210
quote:
I wish jindal would use his executive power to close down these shitholes and do some actual good.
Sorry, it's being put to much better use sucking up to Tony Perkins and the Evangelicals in Iowa. Can't waste those EO's on something that might actually benefit Louisiana long-term finances.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:23 am to CoachChappy
quote:
Make it a loan that is forgiven upon graduation. You get a degree, you do not have to pay it back.
You honestly think this is a better idea that what we currently have? The state would never get their money back and it would hinder students who are already struggling to afford going to college to better themselves under the fear that they may not finish.
If the state is not going to cap TOPS and let schools change tuition then TOPS needs to move towards the idea of a need based sliding scale based on FASFA information. No reason why the state should pay 100% of tuition for a student whose parents make 150K+. Pay 33% or something. Then as income drops the percentage rises. TOPS is a great program that I benefited from, but as a state and an institution (LSU specifically) we can no longer afford to keep it the way it currently structured.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:27 am to KG6
For all the pissing and moaning the OP has done about budget cuts to LSU, I find it noteworthy that he nor LSU has offered any suggestions of cuts they can make themselves to ease their pain. It appears the university is at max capacity with high salaried positions and yet they are reluctant to offer eliminating or consolidating any of those positions, let alone eliminating some of the waste within tlower levels of their own bureaucracy. If LSU is unwilling to negotiate a 10% cut to the budget themselves, then let the legislature do so. That isn't LSU's money they are cutting- its mine and every other taxpayers. I have no problem making LSU or any other school get their financial affairs in order if they aren't willing to do so themselves.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:27 am to CoachChappy
quote:
Make it a loan that is forgiven upon graduation
That doesn't really fix the issue at hand. If you graduate, the state is still paying your tuition bill. Currently TOPS states that it will pay tuition for any state school. If you give all these state schools the power to set their own tuition, then you will bankrupt TOPS. They need to restructure TOPS as an amount based award if you want to give the schools the power. As in, if you reach this level of TOPS, you get $3k. Then you'd have 3k towards tuition, but LSU would have the power to make the tuition $6k without bankrupting Louisiana.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:31 am to Fratastic423
quote:
You honestly think this is a better idea that what we currently have? The state would never get their money back
Is this serious? Let's do a simple experiment. Say only one person that failed out pays back their "loan." That means only $10k gets paid back. But under the current system, that person wouldn't have had to pay anything back. Since $10k > $0, your statement makes no sense at all.
quote:
and it would hinder students who are already struggling to afford going to college to better themselves under the fear that they may not finish.
I would think if anything it would be motivation. You seem to be backwards on this entire issue.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:32 am to TROLA
There are two bills working their way through the Senate -- one to "untie" TOPS from tuition increases, and another to remove tuition-setting authority from the legislature. The fate of the house bill suggests that the Senate bill is DOA.
For all the big talk from some of you right-wingnuts screaming about LSU cutting its budget, I can't fathom why you oppose the idea of LSU being governed by market forces. If you put them in charge of their own finances, then they will be forced to live within their means. You can only raise tuition so much before enrollment suffers. The problem is that they can't raise it at all, and some of you morons refuse to admit that LSU's tuition is LOW.
For all the big talk from some of you right-wingnuts screaming about LSU cutting its budget, I can't fathom why you oppose the idea of LSU being governed by market forces. If you put them in charge of their own finances, then they will be forced to live within their means. You can only raise tuition so much before enrollment suffers. The problem is that they can't raise it at all, and some of you morons refuse to admit that LSU's tuition is LOW.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:35 am to LNCHBOX
He's got a point as much as the other side of the argument does. How many students would stay in school and continue to get a degree only because they don't want to pay back the money? If they stay, they are using more of the state's money. We need people who don't get degrees out in the workforce too.
My office has a similar policy that if you receive any bonuses, you have to pay them back if you leave the company voluntarily within 12 months. People just get fired or file harassment complaints to not pay back the money. People will find a way around the "pay back" rule in my opinion.
My office has a similar policy that if you receive any bonuses, you have to pay them back if you leave the company voluntarily within 12 months. People just get fired or file harassment complaints to not pay back the money. People will find a way around the "pay back" rule in my opinion.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:38 am to KG6
quote:
How many students would stay in school and continue to get a degree only because they don't want to pay back the money?
You'd still get more money back than the current system. Anything is greater than $0.
quote:
If they stay, they are using more of the state's money.
Who is dropping out of school that remains eligible for TOPS the whole time? That can't be more than a handful of people.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:39 am to Slippy
quote:
For all the big talk from some of you right-wingnuts screaming about LSU cutting its budget,
Here is all you need to know about LSU's budget:
quote:
You’ve heard over and over again that LSU’s funding has dropped off the table since 2008, right? That was, of course, the year Louisiana’s state budget was some $30 billion thanks to the massive Katrina recovery bubble, crude oil prices well over $100 a barrel and a strong national economy that would shortly fall into recession. Well, LSU’s 2008-09 budget that year was $425 million.
Guess what LSU’s 2014-15 budget is?
It’s $455 million.
All you’ve heard for the last six years is that LSU has been gutted by the Jindal administration and the governor and his appointees on the BOS ought to hang themselves from the rafters at the Pete Maravich Assembly Center for all the damage they’ve done. And yet LSU has $30 million more coming in this year than it had in the fat years.
Now, the state general fund revenue to the school has dropped from $235 million to $108 million, but LSU’s self-generated revenues have gone from $190 million to $347 million.
LSU is taking in more money than ever before. Time for it to do what everyone else is expected to do...live within your means. Simple as that.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:47 am to LNCHBOX
But also, what about that kid that is trying to break the family cycle of no college grads. Goes to college using TOPS, but still has to work his arse off for living expenses. Can't cut it and has to drop out of school. Maybe he'll come back later. I like that our state gives him the opportunity to give it a try. Can't do that most places. Paying back the money would hurt that demographic and take away from what so many view as great about TOPS.
I'm not saying I completely disagree with your points. Just that there are equally valid points on the other side of the argument, so I am not so quick to jump on that being a good solution.
I'm not saying I completely disagree with your points. Just that there are equally valid points on the other side of the argument, so I am not so quick to jump on that being a good solution.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:51 am to KG6
quote:
But also, what about that kid that is trying to break the family cycle of no college grads. Goes to college using TOPS, but still has to work his arse off for living expenses. Can't cut it and has to drop out of school. Maybe he'll come back later. I like that our state gives him the opportunity to give it a try. Can't do that most places. Paying back the money would hurt that demographic and take away from what so many view as great about TOPS.
At some point, you can't just keep handing money out. That kid would likely qualify for Pell grants or other forms of financial aid to make ends meet. And if he couldn't make the grades to keep TOPS ( a paltry 2.5 last I checked), then that's just too bad. It sounds cruel, but it's unsustainable in it's current form.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:54 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
At some point, you can't just keep handing money out. That kid would likely qualify for Pell grants or other forms of financial aid to make ends meet. And if he couldn't make the grades to keep TOPS ( a paltry 2.5 last I checked), then that's just too bad. It sounds cruel, but it's unsustainable in it's current form.
True, however if we have to change the system why are we not changing the process to help the students who need it the most. Why not cut it back for those who it is a luxury rather than a need?
Or cap the system and say everyone gets 1500 a semester (or whatever), if that pays for LSU great, but it may just pay for SLU and if you are in desperate need of funds you can go there.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:57 am to Slippy
Good. It is likely that the only people more greedy and self-serving than legislators are university administrators. They measure their success and status in dollars spent.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:57 am to Fratastic423
quote:
True, however if we have to change the system why are we not changing the process to help the students who need it the most. Why not cut it back for those who it is a luxury rather than a need?
I don't like this because a student's family may make a lot of money but also spend a lot. The high income takes away financial aid opportunities for the student even though the student doesn't have access to any more money than families with lower incomes.
quote:
Or cap the system and say everyone gets 1500 a semester (or whatever), if that pays for LSU great, but it may just pay for SLU and if you are in desperate need of funds you can go there.
I think that's a much better idea and is actually fair to all students.
Posted on 5/20/15 at 8:58 am to tigerinthebueche
quote:
tigerinthebueche
By God have an upvote.
This fear mongering coming from the LSU administration is bordering on the ridiculous level. Like you said the bottom line is they don't want to strap their boots up and get a little tighter.
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